IH1086 - Getting Tired and Old - low oil pressure.

[Steve Bosshard]

Right to the point - over 9000 hours - very low oil consumption - some slobber - a little at the rear seal.

Starting cold - 60 psi - hot @ 2200 rpm - 30 psi. hot @ 600 rpm - 5 psi.....

That is where I heard a little knock that went away when I bumped up the throttle just a little.

I am thinking about replacing the main bearings and connecting rod bearings from the bottom to help get the pressure up - also a rebuilt oil pump.

I am hoping I can drop the pan and get to the mains and rod bearings.

The clutch and TA have been OK.

I don't want to go for a full overhaul - I have a very small operation and work less than 50 acres in hay.

Don't pull any punches - is this a foolish plan - am I wasting my time not replacing the cam bearings (line bore required) ?

I believe I have to remove the cab and split the tractor to do the full deal - this would pretty much exceed my capabilities - pretty heavy machine with a GB110 front end loader to boot.

Sure would like to hear from someone who has been around a while with good honest experience.

Thanks - Steve

 

[RickB]

You can accomplish everything you wish in-frame. I think it is a good (interim) plan. You can also R&R the sleeves and pistons in-frame.

 

[ToadHill]

If the mains have the tabs on the bearings you may find it hard to remove them and put in new ones. I've had some luck by loosening all the main caps so they are just bearly holding and then take one off at a time to drive out the top of the bearing. This lets the crankshaft drop on some engines, not much but sometimes enough to slide out the top bearing half. It worked on my old MF and Land Rover.

 

[art]

Steve the whole engine kits for those is pretty cheap! even to do the whole engine the tractor would be split between the clutch and the engine and the cab stays on the chassis with special supports for the front of the cab and the nose of the tractor is rolled away.

If you do do the whole engine remember to have the valve recessions cut to factory specs!

Those cranks are hard enough that if you don't spin a bearing they often can just have the bearings changed out about two to three times before needing to be turned! Very rare to see on egged out.

 

[matt21]

As was said earlier, I would just do an in-frame overhaul and put a new oil pump on it. It's a relatively simple process and fairly inexpensive at about $1,050. a new oil pump should be around $300 maybe a bit more. I doubt just new bearings are going to help you. All you will be left with is an old engine with new bearings and still very low oil pressure. You can do it yourself with some basic tools plus snap ring pliers and piston ring compressor if it's a wet sleeve engine. If it's a dry sleeve engine you may need to rent a sleeve puller from a dealer. All in all I think it's worth doing an in-frame.

 

[RickB]

As was said earlier, I would just do an in-frame overhaul and put a new oil pump on it. It's a relatively simple process and fairly inexpensive at about $1,050. a new oil pump should be around $300 maybe a bit more. I doubt just new bearings are going to help you. All you will be left with is an old engine with new bearings and still very low oil pressure. You can do it yourself with some basic tools plus snap ring pliers and piston ring compressor if it's a wet sleeve engine. If it's a dry sleeve engine you may need to rent a sleeve puller from a dealer. All in all I think it's worth doing an in-frame.

If the OP is already talking about new rods, mains, and oil pump, what more will an in-frame do for his low oil pressure? If he wants to take the cheap way out, he can roll in bearings and replace the oil pump without removing the head and probably cure his main symptom. The front cover will have to come off to access the oil pump.
As Art suggests, an inframe kit for this application is pretty cheap as well. Cam bearings aren't usually a source of low oil pressure in IH 400 series engines, and are not part of the usual in-frame overhaul.

FWIW, it's wet sleeved.

 

[Steve Bosshard]

Here is the preliminary results - New OEM bearings, bolts and a pan gasket arrived this morning - a little over $400. The rod bearings were a breeze - used generous amounts of Lubriplate. Each cap was marked with a code like K55 or K58 or K92 and so was each connecting rod. They torque in 2 stages - 60 ft pounds and then 130 ft pounds. The main bearings were a little more aggravating - I had to fidget with the crankshaft a little but the upper bearings went into place - lower halves were easy (used original bolts). I could move each connecting rod just a tiny bit back and forth after torquing - tells me noting seized.

The thrust bearing upper was a little difficult - had to ever so gently file a rough edge on the side away from the journal to get the bearing started. I bumped the starter a little before putting the pan back on (and the oil suction screen). Again everything moved freely.

I did find trouble with wallowed out holes on the bolster - that will be another story.

Anyhow 20 + quarts of oil later she cranked and sounded great. I ran her about 5 minutes at minimum idle - pressure around 60 or so. Stopped to check oil level (after filters filled) and AOK.

Long and short - ran for about 30 minutes finally up to 1500 rpm - I let the engine warm up and then throttled back to 600 rpm - pressure held at around 22psi (instead of 5 psi).

No, she is not fixed....I still want to do a full overhaul later on. I am sure the cam bearings are pretty worn also, but new cam bearings meant line boring (removing the block, etc). A least that is what the local IH dealer told me.

So, I bought a little time.

Big thanks to everyone for advice - will still run the machine gently for a few hours before any serious work.

Best regards, Steve

 

[Dead Horse]

Putting the cam bearings in takes some know how and skill..........you should not have to line bore the block though.

22# at idle seems like very good oil pressure to me. I would change out the filter in the next several hours. cheap insurance after your hard work.

Nice outcome, congratulations!

 

[RickB]

Good work. You probably just saved your crank and block. Again, I'd not think the cam bearings need attention if your oil pressure is that good. if the rear main crankshaft seal is not leaking, I'd complete the inframe at your convenience and call it good. This type of thing has been done to THOUSANDS of 400 series engines over the years.

 

[SPYDERLK]

Please tell us what the pressures are after you get it fully warm by actually working it for an hour.
larry