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  1. #251
    Platinum Member joemd11's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Posts
    987
    Location
    Western Pa
    Tractor
    LS R3039, Power King 1614, Simplicity Soveriegn 75th Aniv model.

    Default Re: Caroni Flail Belt Failure

    Great. Thanks for the info.
    Quote Originally Posted by King of the Road View Post
    B43. You need three of them.

  2. #252
    Silver Member Hill Billy Bob's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Posts
    145
    Location
    Western NY
    Tractor
    2011 Kioti CK30, 2005 Cub Cadet LT1050

    Default Re: Caroni Flail Belt Failure

    Quote Originally Posted by King of the Road View Post
    Reporting in with a catastrophic belt failure on my 73" Caroni flail.

    I had 16 hours on the tractor and 10 hours or so on the flail.

    I hope to find some belts locally in the morning so I can mow all day tomorrow.

    Thanks to the posters in this thread with all the info.
    I purchased this same mower model in August of this year. Took me 14 hours to cook my belts. I had removed belt cover to lube all fittings, even drew up tension adjusting bolt a half inch, cuz belts seemed a bit loose. After 10 hours run time, removed again...things seemed ok. Four hours later...smoked-um. Bought a new set of belts from the same place you did...went with their Kevlar ones tho.

    I found the problem in the process of changing the belts, it was that the idler pulley mounting bracket was not free enough to move. Took a couple of swats with the heel of my hand to get it to move at all. Removed bracket from mower, cleaned off the grease, used a strip of emery cloth to polish things a tad, put bracket back on, a few shots of grease....now, if nudged, the tensioner pulley and bracket swing like a clock pendulum.

    Have run new belts 30+ hours so far. I take a look at belts in motion occasionally, to make sure idler pulley and tension spring are wiggling the way they should....Bob

  3. #253
    New Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Posts
    4
    Location
    Enfield, NH
    Tractor
    Kubota M8540

    Default Re: Caroni Flail Belt Failure

    I have a Caroni TM1900 and experienced belt failure at about 8 hours of use, mostly in heavy grass and light brush. Searching for belts now--I'll call AgriSupply and try that part #20992 as noted above. I like the job this mower does, and it's width given that I have 4km of 10' wide trails to keep clean. Just hope the belts don't fail this often!

  4. #254
    Gold Member GinNB's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    317
    Location
    NB, Canada, eh?
    Tractor
    2x Kubota M108S, M105S, 2x M9000, IH885, IH584, IH484, IH454, F3000

    Default Re: Caroni Flail Belt Failure

    OrangeKrawler, you have way too much horsepower available for those belts if you're using that 8540 on it. You could burn a set off very quickly if you tried or weren't aware of the load. Go slooowly in heavy grass and don't cut too low. Use two passes if you need to.

  5. #255
    New Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Posts
    4
    Location
    Enfield, NH
    Tractor
    Kubota M8540

    Default Re: Caroni Flail Belt Failure

    Ahhhhh, thanks for the heads up on overpowering the mower. I ran it last year on a JD4400 (37hp), but sold that this spring and changed to an M8540 (narrow/krawler version with 85hp). After 2 hrs...belt burnout. If I run it at 540 I should be OK, regardless of tractor hp. I was hitting some heavy brush and (hindsight is great) stupidly goosed the RPMs. It's all coming into focus now! Cheers and thanks!

  6. #256
    Elite Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Posts
    3,824
    Location
    NE USA
    Tractor
    JD LA115, WH 244, Troy Built Horse 8 HP

    Default Re: Caroni Flail Belt Failure

    Quote Originally Posted by OrangeKrawler View Post
    Ahhhhh, thanks for the heads up on overpowering the mower. I ran it last year on a JD4400 (37hp), but sold that this spring and changed to an M8540 (narrow/krawler version with 85hp). After 2 hrs...belt burnout. If I run it at 540 I should be OK, regardless of tractor hp. I was hitting some heavy brush and (hindsight is great) stupidly goosed the RPMs. It's all coming into focus now! Cheers and thanks!


    Yup, too much power. raise the cutting height by lowering the rear roller, purchase the Kevlar belts for
    it and do half cuts and or slow down to a very low ground speed and you will be fine.

    Do you have the metal tracks on your 8540 or the rubber ones?

    Are you happy with the quality of the cab and controls assembly for the 8540?

    Be sure to change the air fitration filters often as folks do not change filters enough.

    If I have not welcomed you to the Flail Mower Nation previously I want to welcome you now.


    you can buy the Kevlar belts at TSC, NAPA, Farm and Fleet, Menards etc.

    Happy tractoring

  7. #257
    Gold Member GinNB's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    317
    Location
    NB, Canada, eh?
    Tractor
    2x Kubota M108S, M105S, 2x M9000, IH885, IH584, IH484, IH454, F3000

    Default Re: Caroni Flail Belt Failure

    Too much HP needed (and applied) for the job asked of the mower will burn your belts regardless of PTO shaft RPM. Over-revving the mower will actually make it cut better, requiring less torque to do the job asked of it, assuming you could travel the same speed and just up the mower speed (dual speed button downshift and raise the RPMs 20% at the same time). That'll destroy bearings and gearboxes faster and is definitely not recommended, but flails cut better and easier the faster they are run. That's why manufacturers recommend that they be run at 540 PTO rpm (more revolutions per second effectively divides the required torque into smaller chunks and throws more knife cuts per second at a faster tip speed at the job). Travelling 2mph in 2nd at 2200 engine rpm and 540 PTO rpm cuts better and is easier on the mower than the same 2mph in, say, 3rd gear at 1100 engine rpm and 270 pto rpm. That doesn't change the fact that (and I'll pick numbers at random here) it might take 40hp sustained to cut your tall grass down low traveling at 4mph when there is long grass wrapped around the cutting edges of your flail knives, making it an extremely inefficient way to cut grass. In a smaller tractor it'd be bogging down pretty heavily and that would train the driver to slow down. In your tractor the belts just start heating, stretching, slipping, burning, and failing. Most manufacturers have a recommended HP range listed for their mowers, not just a minimum. A person can run a bigger tractor than the max recommended one but realize that it can cause premature mower failure if care isn't taken. The belts are designed to be the weak part to save more expensive and dangerous bits (driveshafts, gearboxes) from flying apart and possibly injuring someone.

    A Caroni isn't the same as a Maschio which is a better fit for the HP your tractor can put out. You'll be able to start to lug your tractor with a Maschio without the ability to burn out belts every half hour like you can with that Caroni. I know you haven't been but you could. Note that the max HP for the Maschio in this link stay the same (90hp) regardless of width while the minimum recommended horsepower rises with width.

    http://www.maschionet.com/catalog/product/chiara/en_GB

  8. #258
    New Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Posts
    4
    Location
    Enfield, NH
    Tractor
    Kubota M8540

    Default Re: Caroni Flail Belt Failure

    Slowing down is a key--my first hour I was running at very low speeds. Got comfortable with how it was handling behind the M8540 and up the speed and lowered the cut. Hindsight again: oops. Very happy with the M8540 cab and controls, as well as the ease of unloading/loading the loader, and overall operation. Rubber tracks. Thanks for the advice on the filters and source of belts.

  9. #259
    New Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Posts
    4
    Location
    Enfield, NH
    Tractor
    Kubota M8540

    Default Re: Caroni Flail Belt Failure

    Thanks for the excellent feedback. As noted above, I had purchased the Caroni for a JD4400. Did not give it much thought when moving up to the kubota M8540. I'll give it a go for awhile running the PTO at 540RPMs, keeping the tractor speed slow, and raising the cut in deep/heavy grass. If I keep burning up belts, then I'll look to sell the Caroni and swap to a better-matched flail mower. Thanks again for being so helpful

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