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  1. #11
    Silver Member skipro3's Avatar
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    Jul 2008
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    Placerville, CA
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    Montana 4344

    Default Re: Rental Rates

    O.K. it doesn't lift the tractor up like the FEL can lift the tractor up. However, If the tractor were to be jacked up from the rear axle, the 3pt box scrapper lowered down, then the jack lowered, would the box scrapper hold up the tractor? Or would the box float back up? I hope I'm explaining that to make sense.

  2. #12
    Platinum Member JDeerekid's Avatar
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    Sep 2004
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    877
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    P-Town, Upstate New York
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    Montana 4340C w/Loader, JD GX345 w/54in. mower

    Default Re: Rental Rates

    Quote Originally Posted by skipro3 View Post
    O.K. it doesn't lift the tractor up like the FEL can lift the tractor up. However, If the tractor were to be jacked up from the rear axle, the 3pt box scrapper lowered down, then the jack lowered, would the box scrapper hold up the tractor? Or would the box float back up? I hope I'm explaining that to make sense.
    The box blade will just float back up. It is like a floor jack.
    Montana 4340C w/loader, AgroTrend FU78 rear snowblower with hydraulic shute rotation, Horst 48" pallet forks, 3pt. 2-bottom plow, 6ft. bush hog rotarty cutter, 3pt. Woods 7ft back blade, 3pt. cultivator, 5ft 3pt. york rake, 6' KKII tiller, JD494 4-row planter. Future attachments: backhoe, grapple

  3. #13
    Silver Member skipro3's Avatar
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    Jul 2008
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    Placerville, CA
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    Montana 4344

    Default Re: Rental Rates

    Well, I'm really confused then; what's the draft control for? I thought that was to float the box and that I could set it so it would either float at a preset level, or it would stay exactly where I put it.

  4. #14
    Platinum Member JDeerekid's Avatar
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    P-Town, Upstate New York
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    Montana 4340C w/Loader, JD GX345 w/54in. mower

    Default Re: Rental Rates

    draft control is only good for something like plowing. Box blading maybe but not as effective.
    I still don't know enough about it but I know some. Draft control is on for below ground use. When plowing or using ground engaging equipment you set the draft control so it will only dig down so far and when the plow trys to did futher down it raises it on its own to keep it at a set level. It is all based on gravity to go back down into the ground.

    So for grading or trying to float a blade it is just about useless.

    I know it is confusing because it is confusing me writing this. Maybe someone else can explain better. I know there are a few threads on here with people trying to explain it. I know the manual for any tractor does not explain it very good.
    Montana 4340C w/loader, AgroTrend FU78 rear snowblower with hydraulic shute rotation, Horst 48" pallet forks, 3pt. 2-bottom plow, 6ft. bush hog rotarty cutter, 3pt. Woods 7ft back blade, 3pt. cultivator, 5ft 3pt. york rake, 6' KKII tiller, JD494 4-row planter. Future attachments: backhoe, grapple

  5. #15
    Veteran Member Rara Avis's Avatar
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    Oct 2006
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    2,023
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    USA
    Tractor
    John Deere

    Default Re: Rental Rates

    Quote Originally Posted by skipro3 View Post
    Well, I'm really confused then; what's the draft control for? I thought that was to float the box and that I could set it so it would either float at a preset level, or it would stay exactly where I put it.
    Draft control. Draft control, while not essential, makes life a little easier when plowing, sub-soiling, or using other ground engaging implements. For illustration purposes, let's assume we want to go plow up the back forty. We've mounted our plow to the three point hitch and adjusted things so that the plow will run straight and track properly behind the tractor. A note about plowing- if you have adjusted the plow properly, you should not have to use the stabilizer system to keep it running true behind the tractor. As you let the lift arms down, and begin to move forward though the field, the plow will start to enter the ground. As the plow continues down, traction and horsepower requirements increase. The natural tendency is for the plow to continue down until the tractor either loses traction, runs out of power, or the lift arms reach their lower limit. It is very unlikely that the latter will happen. We want to be able to plow at a reasonable depth without straining the engine or having excessive tire slippage. We also do not want to have to continually fiddle with the lift controls, raising and lowering the plow by small amounts, as ground conditions vary throughout the field. That's where draft control really helps. Draft control senses the amount of strain that the tractor is being subjected to from the plow. If the strain exceeds a predetermined level, the draft control will automatically raise the plow just enough to restore normal loading of the tractor. After you get past the hard spot in the field, the draft control automatically returns the plow to the pre-selected, ideal depth. There are two main types of draft sensing in wide use today. They are: lower link draft sensing, and top link draft sensing. Both achieve the same end result, and much discussion could be made over which is the best method. Generally you will find lower link sensing on larger, higher horsepower tractors. In the case of lower link sensing, the front of the lift arms are attached to a common bar that flexes with variable loading to impart movement to linkage that is ultimately connected to the control valve. There are also tractors on the market that incorporate an electronic lift control system. With these, the lower draft bar contains a strain sensor which sends a signal to an onboard computer. Movement of these electronic bars is almost undetectable to the eye. For tractors that utilize top link draft sensing, there are several methods in use to transmit draft load information to the control valve. For a large portion of North American style tractors, there is a rather large (usually internal) coil spring, which is compressed (by the top link) as draft load increases, and relaxed as the load diminishes. This compression/relaxation causes movement in the draft control linkage, thus changing the position on the control valve, raising and lowering the lift arms as needed. Other tractors (namely European style) have a massive leaf type spring between the top link and the lift cover. Still others use a torsion bar that is actually twisted as the top link moves toward and away from the tractor. Now, with all of this draft action going on, we've got to slow the lift system down some, or we'll end up with a rapid, out of control oscillation of the lift arms going up and down. This is accomplished with something called?

    Response control. Response control (in most systems we know of) simply serves to control the rate at which hydraulic oil is allowed to escape from the lift cylinder. By slowing this rate, we minimize undesirable oscillations that would otherwise occur. Response control has no effect on rate of lift, and that is good, because we want the plow to raise quickly when we hit a hard spot. However, if we let the plow go back into the ground at an uncontrolled speed, we will end up pulling a plow that jumps into and out of the ground. We have to give the system a little time to settle down somewhere in the raise/lower cycle, and that is the function of the response control.

    To get the maximum benefit from draft control, you must use it the way the manufacturer intended for it to be used. Do you need draft control? On the smaller tractors, probably not, as these tractors are rarely used to do much plowing. On larger tractors, it is pretty much standard equipment anyway, so the choice is made for you.

    http://www.tractorsmart.com/main/Tra...ft%20Types.htm

  6. #16
    Platinum Member JDeerekid's Avatar
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    877
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    P-Town, Upstate New York
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    Montana 4340C w/Loader, JD GX345 w/54in. mower

    Default Re: Rental Rates

    Thanks Paul for helping explain it a little better.
    Montana 4340C w/loader, AgroTrend FU78 rear snowblower with hydraulic shute rotation, Horst 48" pallet forks, 3pt. 2-bottom plow, 6ft. bush hog rotarty cutter, 3pt. Woods 7ft back blade, 3pt. cultivator, 5ft 3pt. york rake, 6' KKII tiller, JD494 4-row planter. Future attachments: backhoe, grapple

  7. #17
    Platinum Member
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    Mar 2005
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    926
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    Southern Indiana

    Default Re: Rental Rates

    I rented the 6' box scraper on Friday. It was $40/day, $25/4 hours. It had 6 rippers. It did a pretty good job on the road. I think I can do a better job with more time and practice, and probably if I go at it in the spring when the ground is softer. I think I'll be selling my 5' rear blade (just a blade, not a box scraper) and upgrading to a 6' box scraper as time and funds allow.
    --------------------------------
    shawn

  8. #18
    Gold Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
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    489
    Location
    Southern Adirondacks, NY
    Tractor
    TC24D

    Default Re: Rental Rates

    Shawn,

    Thanks for the update, that doesn't seem unreasonable. I'll have to check and try to get it some Saturday. This weekend I have to go fishing, tough I know, but somebody has to do it!

    I would suggest hanging onto your straight blade unless you need the cash or have no room to store it. For what you would get out of it, you would never replace it and you never know when you might want it. Just a thought.

    Brad

  9. #19
    Platinum Member
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    Mar 2005
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    Southern Indiana

    Default Re: Rental Rates

    I got it dirt cheap and have had it for two and a half years. I've used it a handful of times, never successfully. I could use the money and space to upgrade to the 6' box scraper. The 5' rear blade barely covers my tracks when it's straight. When I use it angled it just makes a big mess. Anything I've wanted to do with it I've been able to accomplish faster and easier with my front end loader.
    --------------------------------
    shawn

  10. #20
    Veteran Member kthompson's Avatar
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    Sep 2008
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    South Carolina
    Tractor
    Kubota M 6800; Kubota B 2710; Gator; Bushhog ZTR; Volvo Mini Excavator EC45

    Default Re: Rental Rates

    Quote Originally Posted by dooleysm View Post
    I got it dirt cheap and have had it for two and a half years. I've used it a handful of times, never successfully. I could use the money and space to upgrade to the 6' box scraper. The 5' rear blade barely covers my tracks when it's straight. When I use it angled it just makes a big mess. Anything I've wanted to do with it I've been able to accomplish faster and easier with my front end loader.
    Are you sure you don't have a light weight rear blade? A light weight rear blade is about worthless on packed dirt. I have a right heavy one and it will cut anything even roots, but not if set straight, would have to be angled some. I am one of those who can cut much better with a rear blade than I ever did with box blade. The front and read blades on them I found to be a limiting issue as it spreads out the weight over both blades. At same time let me know how you angle the box blade to round the road bed. kt

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