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  1. #11
    Elite Member
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    Dec 2000
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    Southern VT, Southern ME
    Tractor
    John Deere 4100 HST /410 FEL, R4s

    Default Re: help selecting hydraulic valves to buy

    Bird, I can see where you would want that especially for tipping the box scraper foward. Right now my blade is canted slightly foward I'm at 22".

    If the need arises it looks like I can take up to an 1 1/2 off of the fixed end. Haven't had much chance to do anything with the tractor recently.[img]/w3tcompact/icons/sad.gif[/img]

    Its gonna be handy too when loading and unloading off of the trailer. Depending on how I'm parked both the landscape rake and rotary cutter often need the rear lifted. The cutter usually digs in getting off and rake's gauge wheels sometimes catch backing on.

    I just mocked up my new [img]/w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif[/img] 2n1 ripper/middlebuster. To level it out it would need 25".

    I'm gonna go slighly off subject for the moment here.

    Shorter on the toplink does what? Make it dig deeper?

    The manual also says to adjust the middlebuster so the shovelbottom is almost level or with the point slightly down. Does that sound right?

    DFB

  2. #12
    Elite Member
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    Southern VT, Southern ME
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    John Deere 4100 HST /410 FEL, R4s

    Default Re: help selecting hydraulic valves to buy

    Jim, dimensional size sounds great on the two spool. Is there a web site?

    My 4100 TM gives the spec on system pressure as 2466 PSI max.
    Pump flow as 5.0 GPM minimum @ 1500PSI on fast idle.

    The TM also mentions pump has capacity to flow up to 6.3 GPM.

    Will the valve's flow rate be enough?

    DFB

  3. #13
    Epic Contributor Bird's Avatar
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    Mar 2000
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    39,304
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    Texas

    Default Re: help selecting hydraulic valves to buy

    Yep, DFB, it does make it handy when putting the tractor on the trailer with an implement on the rear. It's also handy for lifting the back end of a mower higher for cleaning or sharpening (I put jack stands under it, of course).

    <font color=blue>Shorter on the toplink does what? Make it dig deeper?</font color=blue> Yep, that's it. If you shorten it too much, it'll try to dig in so deep it'll stall the tractor unless you raise the plow with the 3-point. On the other hand, if you lengthen it too much, the plow will just slide across the surface without ever digging in, even with the 3-point lowered all the way. The manual is right and once you have it adjusted just right, you can lower the 3-point all the way, the plow will run at the depth you want, come to the end of a row, pick it up and turn, and drop the 3-point all the way, and you'll still be running the same depth.

  4. #14
    Epic Contributor
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    jinman's Avatar
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    Feb 2001
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    21,014
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    Texas - Wise County - Sunset
    Tractor
    NHTC45D, NH LB75B, Ford Jubilee

    Default Re: help selecting hydraulic valves to buy

    DFB, your cylinder looks and sounds like a good deal. My Chief toplink is about 1" too long, but I'm thinking about drilling another set of holes in my toplink adapter on my tractor since I have about three inches of space to work with. Like Bird says, that extra 1" is a lot and if I can get 1-1/2 " it will be perfect.

  5. #15
    Veteran Member jimgerken's Avatar
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    Nov 2001
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    1,638
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    Minnesota
    Tractor
    John Deere 3720

    Default Re: help selecting hydraulic valves to buy

    Yes, they are nice and small. No web site I know of. I thiknk the combined capacity of the two pumps on a 4100 total about 6.3 GPM. The main pump is rated @ 5 GPM. The valves are just 5 GPM. So that may mean they would be slightly restrictive compared to a 12 GPM valve, when passing 5 GPM. But maybe thats a good thing for what these 3-5 spools get used for. I want smooth controllable motion, not jerky instant-full-flow.
    I am trying now to get size info on the Prince SV (stackable), so I can build the configuration I want, and the price is less than the Cessna 3-spool. I will post when I get the size of the Princes.

  6. #16
    Elite Member
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    Southern VT, Southern ME
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    John Deere 4100 HST /410 FEL, R4s

    Default Re: help selecting hydraulic valves to buy

    Jim, the way the TM decribes it, those specifications are for the tractor's hydraulic system. A single engine mounted pump on the HST supplies flow to just the 3 point lift, the optional factory DSCV, and aux hydraulic circuits.

    DFB

  7. #17
    Veteran Member jimgerken's Avatar
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    Minnesota
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    John Deere 3720

    Default Re: help selecting hydraulic valves to buy

    Well, you may be right, I researched all three brands and two models of each before purchasing the JD 4100 so I may be confusing the features. I thought it had sperate power steering pump of some small GPM volume. In fact, I just checked my spreadsheet and somewhere I apprently read and then recorded that the pump count was 2, for capacities of 5.1/2.3/7.4 (7.4 being the combined total). This would have been from sales literature. Actual numbers could be different, literature has been known to be wrong/outdated/purposly misleading.

  8. #18
    Elite Member
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    Dec 2000
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    Southern VT, Southern ME
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    John Deere 4100 HST /410 FEL, R4s

    Default Re: help selecting hydraulic valves to buy

    Jim, I'm glad to help out any if I can.

    According to the info in the tech manual both tractors have the 5.1 gpm minimum hydraulic pump and the gear model has a 2nd pump for the power steering unit. Like you say rated for 2.3 gpm. Its mounted just ahead of the hydraulic pump on the engine.

    On the HST the power steering flow is supplied by the charge pump that is part of the closed loop hydrostatic drive system. This pump also supplies the flow to the HST piston pump. The charge pump is rated for 1.6 GPM @ 1000 rpm and 4.2 GPM @2650 rpm.

    Your sure right about numbers being different too. The engine oil capacity is different in both the owners manual, 2.8 qt. and the shop manual, 2.3 qt. Book also says oil pan capacity is 2.6 qt. and I just use 2 qts even for an oil change. [img]/w3tcompact/icons/crazy.gif[/img]

    I have a question about using dump cylinders. If a single acting cylinder is used the bed will just lower under its own weight using a valve in a float position. Similar to the way my snowplow blade works. Is that correct?

    DFB

  9. #19

    Join Date
    Apr 2000
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    41
    Location
    San Juan Islands
    Tractor
    3710 HST

    Default Re: help selecting hydraulic valves to buy

    I am not trying to get off the subject but has anyone installed the 2 or 3 spool valves that kubota uses in there tractors? The type that will mount in the three elongated holes that are supplied. Are they too expensive? I am looking to add T and T and want a factory look and nothing to mount on the fenders. Is this possible without using the "factory" spools. Any help will be appreciated. Do these spools allow float?

  10. #20
    Veteran Member jimgerken's Avatar
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    Minnesota
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    John Deere 3720

    Default Re: help selecting hydraulic valves to buy

    DFB asks a really good question. Can a single acting cylinder be used with a 4-way valve with float? Otherwise, if a guy had a 4-way valve with power beyond, wouldn't you have a way to control a single-acting cyl ? ...by possibly connecting the unused side of a 4-way to the return line in a temporary wa, say with a short hose with quick couplers on it?

    I heard from Prince. Their sectional SV valves would be about 8.5" X 8" in a three-spool version. Im thinking their "small loader valve" called LVR may be a better deal, much smaller at 6.5" x 6.5", plus 8" handle (joystick control). Any experience with this???

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