Buying Advice Bobcat Track loader No MSRP/negotiation ?

[reedfarm]

It seems like there is no starting point on the bobcats. There is not even a MSRP. I am looking at a T250,T300,T320, and the new T750. I cannot find any "real" prices on these things. I did see a NY state site that was getting skid steers for 36% off of MSRP, but can't find msrp anywhere ? Anyone else run into this problem ?

[bp fick]

It seems like there is no starting point on the bobcats. There is not even a MSRP. I am looking at a T250,T300,T320, and the new T750. I cannot find any "real" prices on these things. I did see a NY state site that was getting skid steers for 36% off of MSRP, but can't find msrp anywhere ? Anyone else run into this problem ?

MSRP is a bit fuzzy with tractors, but most of the major colors have a "build my tractor" type feature on their websites. This is helpful. Armed with that info, one tries hard to press for 10-12% off that website pricing. Having a good relationship with one's local dealer is great, as long as that doesn't mean over paying to the point of the absurd.

[reedfarm]

Not Bobcat ... they have a "build your ...." but once you are finished, it says a local dealer will contact you ! Then it is a "quote" not a cost vs. msrp. I have discovered that the mark up is ~30%. But Bobcat is very secretive. They also have a "area dealer" system where if you live in one zip code, only one dealer is supposed to sell you a new skid steer. If you go "out of area" dealer, they refer you back to the local one. Just seems very tricky and a way to keep prices high with non - compitition.

[milkman636]

https://procure.ohio.gov/PriceList/7...vpricelist.pdf

Here are some '08 list prices that I ran across recently. 2010 would be a litttle higher, but this could get you in the ballpark.

[reedfarm]

Thanks Milkman. It looks like the prices the guy in lynchburg va gave me are right off the list prices. Strange, no dealing ? I did see off a NY state procurement site that they were giving 36% off machines, 15% off additions and 25% off implements. I guess thats to keep profits up ?

[Digdeep]

Not Bobcat ... they have a "build your ...." but once you are finished, it says a local dealer will contact you ! Then it is a "quote" not a cost vs. msrp. I have discovered that the mark up is ~30%. But Bobcat is very secretive. They also have a "area dealer" system where if you live in one zip code, only one dealer is supposed to sell you a new skid steer. If you go "out of area" dealer, they refer you back to the local one. Just seems very tricky and a way to keep prices high with non - compitition.

Why do you consider it tricky? I see it as a way to ensure that Bobcat dealers can make a decent living by having local customers buy from local dealers instead of shiopping all over tarnation to save $750 only to go back to the dealer they stiffed expecting him to jump through hoops for them.

The compact equipment industry isn't the auto industry. Back in the heyday there were about 55-60k skids sold and about 30k mini-ex's. 2009 auto sales were at a 27 year low and there were still 11.5 million cars sold.

[ace10]

Why do you consider it tricky? I see it as a way to ensure that Bobcat dealers can make a decent living by having local customers buy from local dealers instead of shiopping all over tarnation to save $750 only to go back to the dealer they stiffed expecting him to jump through hoops for them.

The compact equipment industry isn't the auto industry. Back in the heyday there were about 55-60k skids sold and about 30k mini-ex's. 2009 auto sales were at a 27 year low and there were still 11.5 million cars sold.

When has sole-source procurement ever been good for the buyer?

[Digdeep]

When has sole-source procurement ever been good for the buyer?

The buyer has a choice of multiple brands if he/she is not satisfied with a dealer's personnel, pricing, or service. This phenomenon is not new to the industry. CAT, Bobcat, deere, etc. all prescribe to the same practice. It worked this way when I sold Bobcats, and it still works this way. I would not sell a machine to a customer outside of my territory. I wouldn't let my dog out to dump in my neighbor's yard, and expect him to clean it up?

If a dealer's marketshare or sales fall in the toilet because they hold their prices too high, stink at product support, etc., the OEM cancels them.

[reedfarm]

You are comparing selling bobcats to picking up dog poop ?
The point I was trying to make is that what other industry/service in the USA do you not even have the slightest idea of the cost before you walk through the door ? Bobcat had 20 different products (S250 T750) that I was interested in, but did not even know which one was in my price range. As a consumer, I educate myself as to price and features before I buy anything. I have no problem with a salesman/dealership making a fair profit, but in most industries, the more a salesman can sell something for, the more he makes. Plus I do have an issue when a company has a product marked up so much they can offer a government RFP at a 37% off msrp, but will not drop a penny for me. That selling policy almost had me looking at other products (too bad the Kubota did not have high flow hydraulics) Oh, I just got the T320 with the options I needed that was $69K for $61K because I looked around, and the guy who sold it for $61K was really, really happy he made a sale.

[Digdeep]

You are comparing selling bobcats to picking up dog poop ?
The point I was trying to make is that what other industry/service in the USA do you not even have the slightest idea of the cost before you walk through the door ? Bobcat had 20 different products (S250 T750) that I was interested in, but did not even know which one was in my price range. As a consumer, I educate myself as to price and features before I buy anything. I have no problem with a salesman/dealership making a fair profit, but in most industries, the more a salesman can sell something for, the more he makes. Plus I do have an issue when a company has a product marked up so much they can offer a government RFP at a 37% off msrp, but will not drop a penny for me. That selling policy almost had me looking at other products (too bad the Kubota did not have high flow hydraulics) Oh, I just got the T320 with the options I needed that was $69K for $61K because I looked around, and the guy who sold it for $61K was really, really happy he made a sale.

No, it was simply an analogy comparing the the reasons why dealers don't sell out side of their territories.

I definitely agree a dealer should give you a MSRP. Typically market conditions dictate prices less than MSRP, especially in the down market the US has experienced.

OEMs will usually have a much lower price to states, govt. etc. This is usually a corporate account direct from the factory and the dealer gets a small service fee for the machines sold into his territory.