Great wire rope trick

[Danno1]

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As I looked at the pics I started thinking the same thing Cityfarma said.

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[MJPetersen]

No, guys it has full strength. Think of it in this way. You have divided the line in half that is true, but in the normal load pull direction BOTH halves are taking strain and that is why it is full strength. You are not pulling only on one side, but rather using both sides. It is full strength.

Mike

[Brad_Blazer]

The theoretical strength should be at least 2/3 since the load is shared by the other side of the loop. so 2/3 of the rope gets 1/2 of the load and 1/3 gets the other half. The wound and taped tail will allow the cut ends to carry some load.
Check out this link! Look for the Farmer's Eye Splice. They say it is full strength when 2 or more clamps are used.
http://www.worksafebc.com/publicatio...f/splicing.pdf

[Willis Fecon Bushhogging]

Originally Posted by bx24

All I can tell you is what we have done in the past, we always made the tails about 1/3 the total amount we un-raveled.

As several folks have mentioned, when working and ultimately loading wire rope, things can and do happen. In the original post, I mentioned that we snapped the winch lines a LOT. Any time the cable has been choked, smashed, nicked or otherwise compromised, you should expect it to fail. Unlike chain, wire rope also stretches so it stores a lot of energy that will cause it to snap far faster than you can move. Never put yourself in line with the cable, either in front or behind what ever you are pulling on. We have shattered windshields the the broken wire rope flew over the top of the truck and hit the glass.

From my own trial and errors, the tails need to be there. As was also pointed out, tape is not critical, but it helps me not catch the tail on things. Even with the heavy 1/2 inch cable we used, I can weave an eye in a little over a minute. This trick will not solve all of your problems, but give it a try and I am pretty sure you will use this trick at some point. To get the hang of it, practice and play with nylon rope and you will see what different length tails do for you. I like this because you can easily weave this eye around fixed objects. One last thing, never choke winch cable, you will damage it!

Being from a past as a commerical fisherman, I had almost forgot that knot. I used it all the time, I just opened the cable and stuck the tail in the main part, blow the eye. It keep the eye from pulling out. I used this splice for helping my friends with their cables also. I never had one fail. As stated always use proper safety, in doing this

[brandoro]

I splice ropes the same way as EddieWalker describes, I learned it as a Boy Scout then had my memory refreshed when I took the rigging course during trade school. You pass the tails under three twists for maximum strength for an eye or a rope to rope splice, you can make the tails longer but no extra advantage is gained. I have never tried making that splice on wire rope but I know it can be done because the steel slings that were site made on a job I worked on in China were made from wire rope. I never timed them but they could make an eye splice in wire rope pretty quickly.

[bx24]

Originally Posted by cityfarma

I still disagree. While I agree that the rope loop will not slip, the loop of rope is only 1/3 the strength of the main rope. Look at the "re weave the legs" picture. Wind the 2 strands down just short of the the main rope. Without winding the 2 strand tail around the 1 strand tail, the weakest point is the single strand adjacent to the main rope. Now wind the 1 and 2 strands together. If the single strand breaks, the remaining twisted tail will simply pull apart.

If you disagree, please explain where I am wrong.

Cityfarma

While I cannot argue the physics of the connection, I can attest by first hand experience that the winch line itself virtually always failed before the eye. On one specific occasion, we just go done putting some new line on the winch and it broke within a day or two (waaaayyyyy more quickly than normal even for us!). We took a section of the cable to the wire distributor and they quickly weaved eyes in the manor I described (no tape) on both ends and put the length into their "snapping machine" (basically a huge ram with a "pull" meter on it). They loaded up the cable and predictably, it snapped somewhere in the middle and NOT at the eyes.

Proof or not, this technique has helped me too many times to remember and has never let me down. Hopefully it will help others. If anyone still has concerns or questions, build some slings with nylon rope and break them between two car hitches .... see what works and what fails. Just make sure to make the eyes a little bigger since the nylon has much less friction, and keep them less than 8 feet so when they snap, there is not enough length to go too far. I know many farmers who call nylon tow ropes "widow makers" because they store so much energy. We had the heavy equipment to do this same thing with wire rope, but I would expect most of you don't have the ability to safely put that much tension on a sling. When I was at the wire distributor, they were making lifting slings and while they used a crimp on aluminum billet to "finish off the tails", they were weaving the eyes first.

One last tip I will share if you are concerned about any rope or winch line snapping. Consider tying some rope to something heavy (cinder block etc) and the other end around the winch line. When it breaks, this will absorb a bunch of the energy of the flying cable and if done right should keep the ends from flying too far.

Good luck all and be safe

[bx24]

Originally Posted by Brad_Blazer

The theoretical strength should be at least 2/3 since the load is shared by the other side of the loop. so 2/3 of the rope gets 1/2 of the load and 1/3 gets the other half. The wound and taped tail will allow the cut ends to carry some load.
Check out this link! Look for the Farmer's Eye Splice. They say it is full strength when 2 or more clamps are used.
http://www.worksafebc.com/publicatio...f/splicing.pdf

Great article Brad. I definitely agree with securing the tail to the pull line (we used tape) to avoid hang ups. We used our winches to pull in sections of communications cable the size of your arm. The longest section I remember pulling was about 1500' through conduit and the reel weighed about 12K lbs with only tape holding the tail.

[SPYDERLK]

Originally Posted by MJPetersen

No, guys it has full strength. Think of it in this way. You have divided the line in half that is true, but in the normal load pull direction BOTH halves are taking strain and that is why it is full strength. You are not pulling only on one side, but rather using both sides. It is full strength.

Mike

Actually the loop is stronger since both sides of it are almost full strength and they share the load equally. I wager the loop is about 1.5X the rope strength.
larry

[excelagator]

Cool Post!!! I worked for a company that built underground use winches. I took the completed winch to a company that would do what you do. The cable was 2 to 2-1/2" if I remember right. The guy would weave the ends and it was just cool to watch.

Dan

[Cap-n-Cray]

bx24,

Great tip. It is very similar to a eye spice for double braid class 1 Samson line. I have seen that splice used to secure very large boats and subs.

Here is the Samson site. Look at the class 1 double braid eye splice. A very strong splice.

Thanks,

Cary