Welding

[Rob-D]

Originally Posted by sizzami

I love this debate I have some people think a mig weld looks good when it doesnt thats one thing and learning to mig weld is easy learning to mig weld well is not , and there are a few things stick is better for , but it is the myth of stick allways being stronger is just that its the same alloy with a cleaner process, PROPERLY laid mig is as strong as stick on mild steel it just is. joint prep is still the # 1 reason for weld failure

Look at it this way. Who here wants to call Case, Caterpillar and John Deere to tell them, "Hey, just to let you know, I was having this little chat on the net with guys that know lots more then you do and I wanted to be the first to tell you that all your CNC MIG welded industrial equipment has inferior welds."
Just about every major assembly line in the country from cars to tractors and everything in between use MIG.

[sizzami]

agreed
also I defy anyone who has dragged 150 feet of stick lead through a vermont mud season day , laid on their back under a skidder getting zapped all the live long day , I defy that person to say " I LOVE STICK" the process is over 100 years old and they still cant develop a decent way to hold a little rod in a clamp.

[sizzami]

p.s Ill go one better if you were developing a process would you say "listen I like the fact that the electrode is only twelve inches long so I have to carry a thousand of them everywhere. I like pulling rod butts out of tires, Ilike that it throws unbeilivable sparks so you need a suit of armor to do it, I like that I have to treat the rods like they were that egg I had to watch in sixth grade or they might get "Damp"or "chilly" and oops there goes my money , now if you could add periodic electric shock to that Ill take it ,I think no.

[Inkomodius]

Originally Posted by Rob-D

Look at it this way. Who here wants to call Case, Caterpillar and John Deere to tell them, "Hey, just to let you know, I was having this little chat on the net with guys that know lots more then you do and I wanted to be the first to tell you that all your CNC MIG welded industrial equipment has inferior welds."
Just about every major assembly line in the country from cars to tractors and everything in between use MIG.

Just to let you know a lot of the CNC machines welding high strength steel isnt welded using the mig process, most ( I hope) use Submersion arc welding. All the trailers that i have built out of T1 or higher strenth steel require sub arc. For joining welds we use dual shielded flux core. Hardwire shielded MIG start cold and can cause weld fault, lead in and lead out tabs can remedy that for some critical welds. For anything critical MIG is always my last choice. However all the 30 ft flare stack trailers we use mig for everything, minus the pressure gas lines which are Sticked to b-pressure specs.

[bobodu]

I'd love to see someone drag 150 feet of MIG lead anywhere!!!
NO...you gotta drag the whole freaking machine!! And a tank....and a whole spool of wire even if it's only a short weld. Gets real interesting if the job is more than a few feet off the ground too.
I hate hot glue guns....

[Rob-D]

Originally Posted by bobodu

I'd love to see someone drag 150 feet of MIG lead anywhere!!!
NO...you gotta drag the whole freaking machine!! And a tank....and a whole spool of wire even if it's only a short weld. Gets real interesting if the job is more than a few feet off the ground too.
I hate hot glue guns....

Every friend I have who welds professionall uses MIG. People who think you get better penetration with stick don't know how to weld.

99% of my welding is right in my shop and the first thing I reach for is the 220V Miller MIG with dual guns, it's the cats meow. Can I run the welder complete with tanks to a remote location? Of course. Are you telling me you're welding 150 feet away from your shop on a daily basis?

I've welded off the ground and upside down. Like any process you have to learn your medium.

[Rob-D]

Originally Posted by Inkomodius

Just to let you know a lot of the CNC machines welding high strength steel isnt welded using the mig process, most ( I hope) use Submersion arc welding. All the trailers that i have built out of T1 or higher strenth steel require sub arc. For joining welds we use dual shielded flux core. Hardwire shielded MIG start cold and can cause weld fault, lead in and lead out tabs can remedy that for some critical welds. For anything critical MIG is always my last choice. However all the 30 ft flare stack trailers we use mig for everything, minus the pressure gas lines which are Sticked to b-pressure specs.

Think trailer hitches need to be high strength and bullet proof?

"As the manufacturer and distributor of 400 different trailer hitches and accompanying towing accessory components, Valley Industries, LLC of Lodi, California, was looking for a way to increase welding productivity and improve product quality. To do this, the company made the switch from a semi-automatic GMAW (MIG) welding process to robotic GMAW-P (Pulsed MIG) welding systems from The Lincoln Electric Company. The move to automation has resulted in a 60 percent increase in productivity, improved process control, and higher quality parts - adding up to a competitive advantage for Valley Industries among its OEM and aftermarket customers."

Robotic Welding Systems Boost Efficiency at Valley Industries | Lincoln Electric

Let's let the ghost of poor MIG penetration die the death it deserves. Sub arc welding doesn't give you any more strength. It's a different process for a different application. You can weld high strenght , low strenght, low carbon 1018 all just fine with MIG and I have. Go visit a modern robotics welding facility. They use MIG.

[bobodu]

I suppose if I did all my welding in a pretty little shop with air conditioning and CFL lighting, I might like an expensive toy like a decent MIG.
But I don't. And I don't have time to clear kinked up wire,clean plugged up tips,fiddle with knobs or make sure that the wind has died down and that the weld is perfectly clean and super well fit. I also don't wanna have to drag a machine around to the other side of the tractor 20 times before the job is done. While the MIG guys are burning up wire to get enough heat for penetration...I'm rolling up my leads to go home.

[Rob-D]

Originally Posted by bobodu

I suppose if I did all my welding in a pretty little shop with air conditioning and CFL lighting, I might like an expensive toy like a decent MIG.
But I don't.

To the fox who can't reach the highest grapes they are always the most sour.

Originally Posted by bobodu

And I don't have time to clear kinked up wire,clean plugged up tips,fiddle with knobs or make sure that the wind has died down and that the weld is perfectly clean and super well fit. I also don't wanna have to drag a machine around to the other side of the tractor 20 times before the job is done. While the MIG guys are burning up wire to get enough heat for penetration...I'm rolling up my leads to go home.

I'm not dragging my MIG any further then the guys with stick welders, I haven't cleared one kinked up wire, there is no wind in my well lit shop and I use fluxed wire when I'm out in it. I can fill gaps 'stitching' with a MIG better then any stick welder

... and when I roll up my leads I am home!

[bobodu]

Originally Posted by Rob-D

To the fox who can't reach the highest grapes they are always the most sour.

Oh...I'm not jealous if that's what you are trying to imply. I have a shop. 6 inch concrete floors,16' ceilings in the work bay. 740 sq ft back in the cold storage area, wood heat,ceiling fans, 6 hp compressor,jacks ,cranes,750 watt stereo and broadband. Plus a seperate storage area for my GoldWing.
It's a lot messier now that it's been broken in...


But real work involves more than making landscape rakes for Cute Urban Tractors. I sure as **** couldn't drag a MIG out to fix a feeder house on a combine or a Cat 3 hitch on a IH 3588.