City boy shopping for first tractor

[geedub]

Frank, my comment about a 40 now and a 60 HP later was in reference to comment about having 2 tractors. The specific advise was to have a 25-30 and 60 HP. I was trying to work with that idea.

I guess I'm still waiting for someone to tell me what I can't do with 45 horses. I understand that some jobs will take more time with a smaller tractor, but I'm willing to invest that extra time if it means I can get good utility out of a single machine. If I can do 90% of my chores easily with a 45, then I'll live with the slower pace on the other 10%. Make sense?

Thanks for the input.

 

[jsborn]

You can move the world with a teaspoon if you take small enough scoops.

A 40 to 45 hp tractor will do most average chores you will have on the land you described it will just take a little while longer.

As far a HST you will be very happy with it i am sure.

IMHO I would stay far away from Gray market units they can be hard to get parts for and here in south Ga probably no one will service them.
In this part of the world there is Orange (2 shades) and Greene and Blue with a small % of Red.

Good luck

 

[madpogue]

My reasons for being stubborn about HST are:

*I'm a tractor novice. I can handle a clutch well in a truck, but I'll be learning everything at once.

We were tractor novices as well (actually, with only 35 hrs on the tractor, we still are). But we've both been driving manual tranny road vehicles for decades, and learning a collar-shift tractor (JD 790 27HP MFwd) was very intuitive. Besides, with most work, you select a gear and stay in it. For us, the big learning curve was (well, still is) turning and handling the tractor on slopes, at the ends of rows, etc., and operating the 3PH implements (no FEL yet). This would be the same with HST or manual.

*Cindy's buying the tractor and I want her to feel comfortable operating it. She's also good with a clutch but same as above.

As above, my wife has been "driving stick" since disco first sucked. Don't underestimate Cindy's ability to learn it. Like I said, concentrate on handling, maneuvering, working the FEL, etc., and the tranny will come naturally. If anything, IIRC, the HST requires you to have a foot on the pedal all the time, right? I'd rather not be so restricted. On some slopes, when I want to be able to react quickly, I like to ride with my feet just ABOVE (not ON) the clutch and brake pedals, so I can just stomp both feet to stop everything when I feel the need.

*I assume a lot of FEL time.

*I'll be working in tight areas like woods and around the pond banks.

Dunno what to say about either of these. We don't have a FEL, but we do have some tight spaces, and if I just go slow, I manage.

*I believe that HST will have a better resale value in the future as more babyboomers retire and move into our area.

Resale value will hold up as long as you properly maintain any tractor. That's in part why we bought new. The used ones we saw had quite a few hours on them, and were not much less than a new one. And by going manual, we were able to afford it (we would've had to either buy used, or fewer HP, if we'd gone HST).

 

[geedub]

madpogue, I can see your points, but you haven't really said much to change my mind about HST. You mentioned not wanting to have your foot committed to being on the pedal so that you can react quickly, but with HST stopping the tractor is as easy as lifting your (one) foot. When you drive your car you always have your foot on the gas...

The reason I think resale will be better with HST in the future is that the popularity of HST seems to be growing, especially with novices. More novices are buying tractors all the time. Are these statements incorrect anyone?

That leaves higher cost of HST. Can anyone guesstimate how much more a tractor with HST would be than an identical tractor with one of the other tranny's?

 

[john_bud]

madpogue, I can see your points, but you haven't really said much to change my mind about HST. You mentioned not wanting to have your foot committed to being on the pedal so that you can react quickly, but with HST stopping the tractor is as easy as lifting your (one) foot. When you drive your car you always have your foot on the gas...

The reason I think resale will be better with HST in the future is that the popularity of HST seems to be growing, especially with novices. More novices are buying tractors all the time. Are these statements incorrect anyone?

That leaves higher cost of HST. Can anyone guesstimate how much more a tractor with HST would be than an identical tractor with one of the other tranny's?

I agree with all your reasoning about the HST. To re-enforce your position, a novice on a straight gear tractor looks like a complete novice on a tractor. A novice on an HST tractor looks like a person using a tractor. get the point?

The only down side is that in the HP range you are looking (45-50), you won't find a used one in the price range you desire. You can get a 15-20 year old Ford 45 hp tractor with FEL for $6,000-10,000 depending on condition. You won't find an HST for much if any under $20,000 because you won't find many older than 5-10 years. They just haven't depreciated much yet.

jb

 

[geedub]

What about these?

KUBOTA L4330 For Sale at TractorHouse.com

2003 KUBOTA L4330HST For Sale at TractorHouse.com

KUBOTA L4610HST For Sale at TractorHouse.com

2004 NEW HOLLAND TC40DA For Sale at TractorHouse.com

2005 NEW HOLLAND TC45D For Sale at TractorHouse.com

2003 NEW HOLLAND TC45D For Sale at TractorHouse.com

2001 NEW HOLLAND TC45D For Sale at TractorHouse.com

I realize that none of these may be exactly in our price range but these are asking prices. I limited my search to tractors with 1200 or less hours. I'm assuming that more tractors will be coming on the market later in the year and we aren't in a rush.

I'm not trying to be a wise @$$ or anything, but I'm trying to make all of the information add up the best I can.

 

[madpogue]

madpogue, I can see your points, but you haven't really said much to change my mind about HST. You mentioned not wanting to have your foot committed to being on the pedal so that you can react quickly, but with HST stopping the tractor is as easy as lifting your (one) foot. When you drive your car you always have your foot on the gas...

So lifting your foot also activates the brake on an HST? (I never operated one)

Funny you mentioned the car; I drive with cruise control most of the time, so I can hover my foot over the brake pedal for faster reaction time. And in any event, with the tractor, I almost always use the hand throttle.

The reason I think resale will be better with HST in the future is that the popularity of HST seems to be growing, especially with novices. More novices are buying tractors all the time. Are these statements incorrect anyone?

Probably true. 'Course, if you can't readily sell a collar-shifter, RoyJackson will always buy it .

That leaves higher cost of HST. Can anyone guesstimate how much more a tractor with HST would be than an identical tractor with one of the other tranny's?

About $3000 for a new one. It's kinda hard to compare apples to apples. For example, John Deere's 990 is the manual version of the size/type of tractor you want. With R4 tires it comes in at about $17,000. HP-wise, it falls right in between the 3520 and 3720, its HST "counterparts", which come in at about $20,000 and $22,000 respectively. If you're going used, and your HST resale value theory applies, the difference won't be proportional, but I would expect to pay $2500-ish more. That seems to coincide with the span between new and "late-model-used", which is just what we noticed when we were shopping. So yeah, for the price of a new collar-shifter, you could get an HST with a few hundred hours on it. One thing you can always do, if you're buying used from a dealer, is haggle for them to throw in a warranty, so you'll at least have part of the "comfort factor" of buying new.

Hmm, that 2005 NH you linked comes with a trailer (worth a grand or so, if you can use it).

I agree with all your reasoning about the HST. To re-enforce your position, a novice on a straight gear tractor looks like a complete novice on a tractor. A novice on an HST tractor looks like a person using a tractor. get the point?

Whew, good thing our land's on a "tertiary" town road, and almost no one sees us working...

 

[geedub]

So lifting your foot also activates the brake on an HST? (I never operated one)

It doesn't activate the brake, but you slow down pretty quickly.

Funny you mentioned the car; I drive with cruise control most of the time, so I can hover my foot over the brake pedal for faster reaction time. And in any event, with the tractor, I almost always use the hand throttle.

I'll bet you don't use cruise control in the parking lot of the grocery store.

From what I've heard HST is simpler when using the FEL because you control your forward and reverse with your foot leaving one hand free to steer and the other to control the bucket.

 

[RoyJackson]

From what I've heard HST is simpler when using the FEL because you control your forward and reverse with your foot leaving one hand free to steer and the other to control the bucket.

Yeah, but you're only looking at a second or two difference in usage.

 

[geedub]

Yeah, but you're only looking at a second or two difference in usage.

Does that apply to a novice?

edit: Also a second or two every time you go in for a load seems like it would add up Roy.