Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 26
  1. #1
    Gold Member JC4HD's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Posts
    308
    Location
    Live in Lower Hudson Valley Tractor used mostly in Central NY
    Tractor
    Sold the 4310 downsized to a JD 2320 - Purchased from K.C. Canary (HRT) in Fultonville, NY

    Default Mule or Ranger (diesel or Gas)?

    Shopping around and found a Diesel Mule (brand new) for $8,500 or my choice of a gas Mule or Ranger for $8,300. Should I go for the diesel or Gas for $200 less? Not planning on doing any heavy "stuff" with either... occasional heavy loads but mostly "touring" the property with wife and two dogs!

    Should I spend the extra for the diesel?

  2. #2

    Join Date
    Sep 2000
    Posts
    1,862
    Location
    The Fabulous Foothills of Northern California

    Default Re: Mule or Ranger (diesel or Gas)?

    JC, my neighbors purchased a diesel John Deere Gator. Everyone around them all comment on the racket it makes. If you like noise, no question the diesel is your pick. For me, I'd go gas and throw the savings into something else. Diesel has its advantages, these little mini haulers with diesel in my opinion are not one of them. My sisters Mule is gas, obviously its a Kawasaki, its quiet, has full 4 Wheel Lock-Up ( I am not aware of anyone that has this). The traction is so good in 2WD that we use the 4WD occasionally just to see if it actually works. 99.99875% of the time 2WD does the job, even when pulling a chain harrow. Mules are very well built. Check prices at Carvers, they sell Mules now. Rat...

  3. #3
    Gold Member JC4HD's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Posts
    308
    Location
    Live in Lower Hudson Valley Tractor used mostly in Central NY
    Tractor
    Sold the 4310 downsized to a JD 2320 - Purchased from K.C. Canary (HRT) in Fultonville, NY

    Default Re: Mule or Ranger (diesel or Gas)?

    Thanks for the imput... Yes they are noisey but the price was a good one... I thought there was more to the diesel that met the eye (ear). I guess not... going Gas!

    Thanks,

  4. #4
    Super Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2000
    Posts
    6,737
    Tractor
    JD 8320 MFWD, JD 6415 MFWD, FEL, and cab, John Deere MFWD 4600, John Deere 4020, John Deere 4430, John Deere 455 mower, Deutz, and Gehl 4610 perkins skidsteer

    Default Re: Mule or Ranger (diesel or Gas)?

    What I would say you have to do is decide what you want more. More torque and a longer lasting, less maint. engine or do you want that 6x6. No doubt that diesel motor will outlast the vehicle. You will also have ALOT more torque and useable pulling power compared to the gas motor. The only plus for the Ranger would be the 6x6. If you don't need the 6x6 definitely, in my mind, go for the diesel.

  5. #5

    Join Date
    Sep 2000
    Posts
    1,862
    Location
    The Fabulous Foothills of Northern California

    Default Re: Mule or Ranger (diesel or Gas)?

    While diesel may and I say "may" have slightly more torque and less horsepower, I doubt it will amount to much. Maintenance on todays gas engines is no more then that of diesels. That was an old argument back in the days of low voltage coils, points and condensers. Todays gas engines are so reliable and maintenance free that I don't consider it an argument anymore. Where you need to change a spark plug on a gas engine, you admittedly will change a glowplug (albeit slightly less frequently then a spark plug although my F250 diesel uses glowplugs more frequently then todays gas engines use plugs) diesels will typically require more oil, larger and more expensive fuel filter(s) larger or more frequent battery replacement.

    What it all boils down too is how much you need a quieter and less smelling mule or gator etc. I would choose the gas for a small vehicle like this everytime. Fuel consumption will be higher with gas, but I don't even think that will be an issue. Your best decision can be made by trying the models with the different engines out. As much as I like diesel, this is one application where I like gas.

    My 93 Ford with a non turbo diesel is about as anemic of a diesel as you can get . Even the much smaller Ford 351 gas engine seems to out do this engine be it climing hills or in pulling power but at a fuel efficiency that is definitely less. Its a weak diesel for 444 cu. inches of displacement. It goes to show that diesel has its disadvantages too. High altitude makes it smoke excessively as my many trips up to Lake Tahoe can prove. My Ford diesel (and the other similar Ford diesels) are all way over in the right lane chugging up the steep grade, I often wonder where all that torque is?

  6. #6
    Super Star Member RoyJackson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2001
    Posts
    18,845
    Location
    Bethel, Vermont
    Tractor
    John Deere 4400 MFWD, Deere 855D UTV, Z920A Zero Turn Mower and assorted implements

    Default Re: Mule or Ranger (diesel or Gas)?

    your torque theory may or may not hold up. There are plenty of small gasoline engines developing as much torque as the diesel option and almost always more HP.

    Very true, but we may be simplifying.

    The torque characteristics (torque curve) is as important as torque itself...more important then HP, in my opinion. Torque is work, HP is a measure of power an engine makes.
    We use torque for acceleration and pulling power. Unless you're running at peak RPM, you're not developing maximum Horse Power.

    Gasoline engines tend to have torque peaks at higher RPM then diesels. A diesel also has a broad flat curve which is important for the pulling effort we need with our machines.
    There's also displacement and a host of other variables to consider.
    As diesels run cooler (then gasoline engines), they tend to last longer too.
    And, of course, the gear ratios are also involved.

    In this instance...diesel vs. gas, Gator vs. Mule; perhaps fuel availability (and cost) is an issue as well.

    I like diesels for their torque characteristics. One gets more work out of a given displacement. But (Always a BUT...), is the trade off worth the higher initial costs of a diesel?
    Buying a diesel in a new pick up is a $2000-$4000 premium. If you keep the truck for many years..you amortized your costs...but if you trade every few years..you're likely losing money.

    However, for $200...I'd go for the diesel option...of course, I'd keep the machine until there ain't nothing left of it.

  7. #7
    Super Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2000
    Posts
    6,737
    Tractor
    JD 8320 MFWD, JD 6415 MFWD, FEL, and cab, John Deere MFWD 4600, John Deere 4020, John Deere 4430, John Deere 455 mower, Deutz, and Gehl 4610 perkins skidsteer

    Default Re: Mule or Ranger (diesel or Gas)?

    I'll second Rob's post. A diesel will outperform a gas engine any day of the week if you are talking about doing actual work with, esp. if there is any pulling involved. There is no doubt in the world that the same hp engine gas or diesel, the diesel will have more useable torque and hp.

    Secondly with regards to smell you don't even hardly smell those little engines anyway.

    With regards to reliability there is again no doubt that the diesel motor is going to outlast the gas motor hands down. You will be doing work on the gas motor far before you ever have to do any work on that diesel motor.

    Lastly if the diesel motor wasn't far superior to a gas motor then why in the heck do about 99% of the compact tractors made have a diesel motor? Reason being because a diesel produces more torque at useable levels than a gas motor, lasts longer, and requires less maint.


  8. #8

    Join Date
    Apr 2001
    Posts
    61
    Location
    Columbus,Texas
    Tractor
    Kubota B2400

    Default Re: Mule or Ranger (diesel or Gas)?

    Jim
    Check out pugpower.com if all you want to do is use it for "touring". I have one and it is great for that as well as general use around the property. Ckeck out the seat that folds down in the cargo bed. They make heavy duty units but I only needed the 480 series.

  9. #9

    Join Date
    Sep 2000
    Posts
    1,862
    Location
    The Fabulous Foothills of Northern California

    Default Re: Mule or Ranger (diesel or Gas)?

    Richard, while I think diesels are fantastic, especially the newer variety, (that excludes my anemic 7.3L Navistar) I would rather have a quieter and yes clean burning gas in a little Mule or Gator. Noise and smell are perhaps the biggest reasons and yes, our neighbors Gator does smell ( a lot) for a little diesel. When they stop and talk, its mandatory to turn it off because of the stinkin noise. Reliability is definitely not an issue with gas engines. If it was, airplanes would run diesels. If "usable torque and HP " which I haven't the foggiest idea what that means was as you say, race cars, boats, P51 mustangs etc would have opted for diesel. Its tough to beat a diesel. I love having a diesel in my tractor, you are correct, for such tiny engines, the torque curve is nice and flat. Low RPM's, great low RPM torque, those are reasons tractors love diesels. Now, tell me why diesels have such great torque. Hint, compression ratio has a lot to do with it. Sustained combustion, slightly higher BTu content in the fuel are 3 great reasons. Can anyone name more resaons? Rat..

  10. #10
    Super Star Member RoyJackson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2001
    Posts
    18,845
    Location
    Bethel, Vermont
    Tractor
    John Deere 4400 MFWD, Deere 855D UTV, Z920A Zero Turn Mower and assorted implements

    Default Re: Mule or Ranger (diesel or Gas)?

    If "usable torque and HP " which I haven't the foggiest idea what that means was as you say, race cars, boats, P51 mustangs etc would have opted for diesel.

    Weight is a big issue with the listed applications. Any racing engine runs at peak RPM for maximum HP constantly. We don't... Racing engines are also quite expensive and are rebuilt after one or two races.
    When I built an engine for a Porsche I had, I opted for cams that made less HP, but had a much better torque curve. Although the car had less peak HP (and torque, by the way) then a Porsche with "S" cams. mine was actually quicker to about 100 mph. More torque at lower RPMs meant quicker acceleration.
    So, in a real world scenario, usable HP and torque are what we need. We might get a kick out of fast 0 to 60 times...but what we use are the 30 to 50 and 50 to 70 times (passing and such...even accelerating on to a highway). This is where an engine that make peak torque at a lower RPM (and maintains a nice flat curve) is most value-added.

    As far as the other applications noted (Racing boats, P51 Mustange, etc.)...these are basically the same as race car usage.

    Now, since diesels do not produce the same HP and torque as a gasoline engine (of the same displacement), but do weigh more (for longevity), diesels aren't practical for racing, aviation, etc. Please note I'm not discussing turbocharging or supercharging...just normally aspirated engines.

    This is an apple to orange comparison.

    But for the kind of work we expect from a tractor or a Gator type utility vehicle...diesels are great.

    However, with the Mule noted in the lead post (of this thread), the diesel is an option. The buyer must decide which engine suits his needs.Simple as that...

Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
© 2014 TractorByNet.com. TractorByNet is a registered trademark of IMC Digital Universe, Inc. Other trademarks on this page are the property of their respective owners.