Help a future small farmer out with first Tractor purchase

[bswampy]

Hi guys,

Been learning a lot on these forums for a while now just from reading but its finally time for a post. I'm hoping to own a tractor by this spring.

Here are the details:

3 flat acres in eastern CT:
All dry during the summer. Late fall/winter/spring probably 1/2 acre gets pretty spongy. 1.5 acres cleared, 1.5 second-growth woods, very dense growth (tons of trees less than 8" , bushes and tons of brush). This all used to be some kind of grazing pasture 30-40 years ago i think. There is also a flat 4 acre wooded lot next door that I would love to own someday but thats a long ways of, if ever.

My goals for the land:
End up with 2.5 acres of cleared organic fields for vegatables/fruit/small animals/whatever-the-future-holds
1/2 acre for lawn, house (18 years old), pool someday
keep my 500' (100 feet paved, 400' gravel) driveway plowed and rut free
I want this land to provide as much food as possible for my family and hopefully someday allow me to earn some income as a market gardener.

Implements/features I think i will need:
Loader (with toothbar!)
backhoe (stumps, trenching, anywhere that I am swinging that pick ax now)
4" PTO chipper
tiller (what I plan on upkeeping my fields with once established, not quite sure on what implements are needed to get there, see below)
BB for the driveway
bushhog
snowplow (lowest priority)
will NOT need a mower as I already own a little JD lawn tractor and im not planning on having much lawn to mow since grass doesnt taste very good
HST
4wd i know i will regret not having on the rare occasions i get stuck

Questions
I'm open to all suggestions and welcome any discussion. Here are my specific questions right now. I'll start with the one that I know is tough to answer.

1. Is a SCUT going to be big enough? If they saying that it can do anything the bigger boys can just slower, then im pretty sure it will suit me just fine. Any thing that can dig and move dirt faster than a shovel/wheelbarrow is probably going to blow me away. Is there anything a SCUT is just not going to be able to handle at all?
2. What implement(s) will I need to get all the roots/rocks out of the woods once I clear the trees and dig the stumps with the hoe?
3. New vs used. I've seen mention of new BX24s on hear for $15,500 with no deck. 16K is probably my budget ceiling for the TLB combo. I've also seen low hours B series TLBs for the same price or lower. This is where I start getting really conflicted. I'm not opposed to used at all but for a first timer with little mechanical experience a warranty may prove cheaper in the long run. But I also recognize the risk in buying undersized and then having to trade up later and eat the costs. I saw an ad a few months back for a ~1000 hour B21 with almost every implement I listed above for 16K, im guessing finding another one of those is going to be cheapest way for me to go in long run
4. What kind of tires do you recommend for me, not planning on mowing at all

I'm not leaning towards any brand right now, all the major ones have dealers in my area and I plan on checking them all out.

Thanks a lot guys!

Brian

 

[MFRED]

A SCUT would do it, it will just take longer. I personally wouold go a little bigger, maybe a small compact. On the other side, a larger one will run you more than your budget. I've seen the MF GC2410 do some pretty good projects. They will run a 4" chipper & 4' box blade. I'm sure the BX would also. The resale on those little tractors stays high too, so omaybe after your projects you could trade up to something that could handle what sounds like a large garden. Check with the dealers while you're there, somtimes they can lead you to someone that wants to trade & cut out the middle man.
Eastern CT, there should be some deals coming up with the fairs going on too. Check, usually youo can buy before the fairs & get the same deals.

 

[slewisma]

In SCUTs and many CUTs, 4WD isn't going to help when you get stuck. It might help you go somewhere where you get stuck though.

I've been using the FEL and BH a lot lately to lift up the BX24 enough to put some rocks or logs under the tires and ease back out of somewhere I shouldn't have been. 4WD just meant both axles sunk faster.

I'd go for Ag tires given your description.

If you hope to be farming for profit soon, I'd also go for a CUT over the SCUT as the time it takes to do the work will matter. Otherwise, something like a BX will hold its value pretty well and you can ease your way in over several years and still sell it for a decent price if you do have to upgrade later.

 

[RWolf]

You've pretty much identified your implements already. 4wd will allow you to have a smaller tractor and get the same amount of work as for a larger 2wd. Personally the way you describe your property I'd look at a CUT over a SCUT primarily for weight and HP considerations. I know you can load tires or use a ballast box but why not get the weight to start with. Other than what you've said already the only thing I can think of at this time would be to define how much HP you can put to work. Because you want a BH I'd look at least a 30 to 35 HP to start with. I started out with a 14HP tractor with MMM and FEL and it worked but I'm much happier with my 40HP 6' shedder, FEL and the other bells and whistles.

Good luck

 

[bswampy]

Thanks for the responses guys

Because you want a BH I'd look at least a 30 to 35 HP to start with.

Is there anyway to get that size CUT with loader/BH for under 16K, lightly used? And what do you guys think about that size tractor compared to the size of my property?

In SCUTs and many CUTs, 4WD isn't going to help when you get stuck. It might help you go somewhere where you get stuck though.

Hmm thats interesting. Coming from my Jeep days I was always extremely pleased when I pulled that tranfer case back to get me into 4wd and out of the mud/snow. Compared to my parents RWD van that became a 3ton bobsled the moment there was 1/2 inch of snow on the roads. I do know how the 4wd can get you really stuck good but isnt there plenty of cases with a tractor where the 4wd stops you from getting stuck at all? Or at least getting you moving through most terrain with minimal slippage?

A SCUT would do it, it will just take longer. I personally wouold go a little bigger, maybe a small compact. On the other side, a larger one will run you more than your budget.

This is where im wavering back and forth. I can get a new SCUT or used small compact if i search around long enough. I just need to get one with enough PTO hp to run my implements. Specs I could find lead me to believe the chipper will be the most demanding at about 16hp for 4" models. Any thoughts on that anyone. What is the minimum for a 4' tiller?

The resale on those little tractors stays high too, so omaybe after your projects you could trade up to something that could handle what sounds like a large garden.

THis also gives me something to think about. I've been watching for used SCUT TLBs. They seem hard to find and the ones that are out there are awfully close to brand new price-wise. Perhaps I can use this to my advantage later on if needed.

Im also going to look into the fairs since that season is rolling around again

Brian

 

[slewisma]

Hmm thats interesting. Coming from my Jeep days I was always extremely pleased when I pulled that tranfer case back to get me into 4wd and out of the mud/snow. Compared to my parents RWD van that became a 3ton bobsled the moment there was 1/2 inch of snow on the roads. I do know how the 4wd can get you really stuck good but isnt there plenty of cases with a tractor where the 4wd stops you from getting stuck at all? Or at least getting you moving through most terrain with minimal slippage?

Brian

It is not that kind of 4WD. I've done crazy things with 4WD in pickups and landcruisers. 4WD in smaller tractors is just a little assist and, frankly, is much more valuable for engine braking through all 4 tires via the HST than for traction. Some of the larger tractors have "real" 4WD but not the SCUTs and not some of the CUTs.

I've been learning this the hard way for the last few weeks with all this rain we've had in New England. A reasonably dry area zoned as wetlands meadows on my property has been a wet swampy mess and I had the notion to try to get in and out with 4WD and rear diff lock. FEL, BH and lots of rocks and brush under the tires got me out. Lesson learned.

 

[RWolf]

Unfortunately the backhoe is a major expense. Just for comparison a new JD 3000 series with loader and backhoe goes for around $20k. I'm sure there are better deals.

Good luck.

 

[bswampy]

so from the recent threads I see here about people wanting to step up from SCUTs for use in the woods, its the larger rear tires that make the biggest difference for traction? Also I've read many times that those larger tires make the ride a lot smoother. This is one of the advantages of compact over subcompact that im trying to decide if it makes it worth it to get a used compact over a new subcompact

 

[driver444]

Take a look at the Mahindras too.
I have a 2015 (replaced this year by the 2216). It's available in gear or hydro, and will easily do all you will ask of it. It's a small compact, but a little larger and heavier than the BX's, but there are benefits to that. Ground clearance for one. And even though it's heavy, I mow a few acres with it, and the r-4 tires don't leave a mark. (unless I do something stupid!!!)

I think you'd be close to, or slightly above budget with the hoe on it. I have a hoe on mine, and it's impressive.

Mahindra also makes a sub compact, (the 1815), that compares to the BX type tractor, but I never tried one.

Give 'em a look. The MSRP's are on the website

 

[flusher]

Hi guys,

Been learning a lot on these forums for a while now just from reading but its finally time for a post. I'm hoping to own a tractor by this spring.

Here are the details:

3 flat acres in eastern CT:
All dry during the summer. Late fall/winter/spring probably 1/2 acre gets pretty spongy. 1.5 acres cleared, 1.5 second-growth woods, very dense growth (tons of trees less than 8" , bushes and tons of brush). This all used to be some kind of grazing pasture 30-40 years ago i think. There is also a flat 4 acre wooded lot next door that I would love to own someday but thats a long ways of, if ever.

My goals for the land:
End up with 2.5 acres of cleared organic fields for vegatables/fruit/small animals/whatever-the-future-holds
1/2 acre for lawn, house (18 years old), pool someday
keep my 500' (100 feet paved, 400' gravel) driveway plowed and rut free
I want this land to provide as much food as possible for my family and hopefully someday allow me to earn some income as a market gardener.

Implements/features I think i will need:
Loader (with toothbar!)
backhoe (stumps, trenching, anywhere that I am swinging that pick ax now)
4" PTO chipper
tiller (what I plan on upkeeping my fields with once established, not quite sure on what implements are needed to get there, see below)
BB for the driveway
bushhog
snowplow (lowest priority)
will NOT need a mower as I already own a little JD lawn tractor and im not planning on having much lawn to mow since grass doesnt taste very good
HST
4wd i know i will regret not having on the rare occasions i get stuck

Questions
I'm open to all suggestions and welcome any discussion. Here are my specific questions right now. I'll start with the one that I know is tough to answer.

1. Is a SCUT going to be big enough? If they saying that it can do anything the bigger boys can just slower, then im pretty sure it will suit me just fine. Any thing that can dig and move dirt faster than a shovel/wheelbarrow is probably going to blow me away. Is there anything a SCUT is just not going to be able to handle at all?
2. What implement(s) will I need to get all the roots/rocks out of the woods once I clear the trees and dig the stumps with the hoe?
3. New vs used. I've seen mention of new BX24s on hear for $15,500 with no deck. 16K is probably my budget ceiling for the TLB combo. I've also seen low hours B series TLBs for the same price or lower. This is where I start getting really conflicted. I'm not opposed to used at all but for a first timer with little mechanical experience a warranty may prove cheaper in the long run. But I also recognize the risk in buying undersized and then having to trade up later and eat the costs. I saw an ad a few months back for a ~1000 hour B21 with almost every implement I listed above for 16K, im guessing finding another one of those is going to be cheapest way for me to go in long run
4. What kind of tires do you recommend for me, not planning on mowing at all

I'm not leaning towards any brand right now, all the major ones have dealers in my area and I plan on checking them all out.

Thanks a lot guys!

Brian

Your 3 acres would make me lean toward a SCUT in the 20-25 hp range. My 2005 Kubota B7510HST (21 hp engine, 17 hp pto) with the LA302 FEL (4 ft bucket) would handle nearly all your planned chores except backhoe work. I paid $12600 plus tax for it in May05.

With only $16K for a TLB, you're budget is really tight if you're hard over on a new tractor. I'd be looking for a late model used TLB like the Kubota BX 24 or equivalent.