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  1. #21
    Gold Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2001
    Posts
    429
    Location
    Lake View,N.Y.(WNY)
    Tractor
    International 184(1980),KIOTI DK40(2002))

    Default Re: Buying/Pricing

    Dazed,Have you considered a Kioti? I've always been a IH guy,but since nothing is made in the US anyway I ditched my brand loyalty and went for the best tractor for my $$.
    In my case it was a DK40 Kioti and I absolutely love it.
    Don't listen to the dealer retoric,the best tractor is always the one they're selling now.
    Check out the Kioti message board and listen to what the owners have to say.
    Oh,and that resale thing is as overated now as it was when my buddy bought one of the first Kubotas.
    My 2cents.......Mike













  2. #22
    Platinum Member Buster57's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Posts
    583
    Location
    Hillsboro, Oregon
    Tractor
    B7800, JD RX95

    Default Re: Buying/Pricing

    I think you will be very happy with any of the big 3-NH, JD or kubota. I own JD and Kubota and plan to buy a NH one day as well. I would not go with an off brand.

    My Kubota is an L3010 with a HD bucket that a rock yard would want! I love using the HD bucket almost as much as my Land Pride mower deck. Great combo!

    Unfortunately, I have heard war stories about backhoes. The bad experiences are for occasional users who face high insurance costs or really expensive equipment that is rarely used. My uneducated technical advice is to rent the backhoe. Case 580c is a good worker. Costs as much as a Mercedes but great to rent!


    Before you buy your tractor, HOW GOOD IS THE DEALER? How does your foot fit the gas pedal/ How well does your butt fit the seat? Try to really know the unit before you buy. Half the fun is studying the equipment. The equipment you are looking at is some of the finest equipment in the world!

    Go to the dealer armed with knowledge and you will be a better consumer. Check out all the specs on the WEB and read as much on TBN as you can handle, and you will learn huge amounts of information. Some tips may be useful, irrelevant or idiotic (“carry a weapon on your tractor”) in nature. Fortunately, most of the information can be quite helpful before, during or after your purchase.

    Have fun-
    Buster

  3. #23

    Default Re: Buying/Pricing

    Dazed, deffinetly read this twice before you make your decision. RE: HST vs Gear. For the novice user forget loader efficiency, forget comfort, forget power loss, and forget the lower up front cost. Think only of safety for you, your tractor, and your surroundings. Hydros are the only choice. They allow immediate, precise response and control when stopping, backing up, manuvering out of potential roll-over situations, manuvering near obsticles (people, houses, cars), turning on slopes, etc.. They allow the operator to focus on other tractor and implement functions and reduce wear on clutch, brakes and driveline components. Do not listen to any argument against HST for your intended use. Buy blue, orange, or green. Don't buy Chinese (no hydro). I bought a KUB L 3010 from Emerich in Charlton, NY and it was priced competitively with blue and green gear drives. Foldable ROPS depends on height of garage. L3410 is same except for motor configuration (bore, stroke, injector popping pressure). L3710 is a little larger machine all around. Buy the backhoe if you can afford it; you'll use it more than you think and resale is good on that implement. Good luck in your decision.

  4. #24

    Default Re: Buying/Pricing

    nathanelmo - It's funny you should mention Emerich...I live in Halfmoon, and my quest began at the Saratoga County Fair 2 years ago when I sat on a kubota 3010 for $9995.00. I have seen in several posts that they are very reasonable. How do you find them as far as dealer support, knowlegable, etc.? You obvoiusly know about Clifton Park Lawn & Leisure, Capital Tractor and Abele. Let me know if you can spare any "localized info" either through this baord or by email @ skipbarberman@hotmail.com Thanks - Sean

  5. #25

    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Posts
    582
    Location
    Seattle area
    Tractor
    JD 855 4WD, HST

    Default Re: Buying/Pricing

    Dazed,

    I've got to agree with the guys who are telling you that the Hydro is the way to go. I was going to purchase a gear drive tractor and test drove many of them. They were fine and would have certainly gotten the job done more than adequately. I ended up with a hydro by sheer luck. There is really no comparison. The power loss is not an issue at all other than the fact that you can usually hear your hyd. pump working while you are in motion. (At least on mine).

    Get the Hydro - you will NEVER regret it. If a dealer told you that you wouldn't want one then I am assuming that he/she has some sort of alterior motive. No hydros in stock or something like that.

    You can search TBN and find tons of information about this debate (Hyd vs. Non-Hyd) but the bottom line is the Hydro is easier to use period. Good luck. [img]/w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif[/img]

  6. #26
    Super Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2000
    Posts
    6,737
    Tractor
    JD 8320 MFWD, JD 6415 MFWD, FEL, and cab, John Deere MFWD 4600, John Deere 4020, John Deere 4430, John Deere 455 mower, Deutz, and Gehl 4610 perkins skidsteer

    Default Re: Buying/Pricing

    I disagree. I have used tractors all my life and the difference in a hydro and gear is negligible once you know how to drive a tractor. I can do just as much work, just as fast, and just as safe as anyone that has a hyrdro tractor. Many things you can get done faster and do a better job with a gear drive tractor as well. Gear drive is much better for doing things like spraying, planting, plowing, discing, etc. There is absolutely no difference at all in safety, that's just plain hogwash, unless you really don't know what you are doing and then it doesn't matter if you have a gear or a hydro. If you're just a weekend buff and want just want a tractor for yard chores then sure a hydro is fine. However if you really want the benefits of a tractor and less hassle in the end then your dealer was right that a gear drive tractor is just as good. If you go JD get the power reverser and you will never regret not having a hydro.

  7. #27

    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Posts
    578
    Location
    Beach City, TX
    Tractor
    NH TC33D

    Default Re: Buying/Pricing

    <font color=blue>I will need to do some trenching, lots of landscaping and a lot of mowing.</font color=blue>

    Seems to me that the hydro would be the way to go based on what you are saying. My first and only other tractor before my TC33D was a small, gear shift Massey Ferguson and it was a royal pain in the butt. My primary use was/is mowing and loader work and even though the M.F. did not have a loader, clutching and shifting gears all the time while mowing slowed down the mowing process considerably.

    You can't beat the hydrostatic transmission if your mowing involves backing underneath trees and navigating around obstacles. I keep one hand on the wheel and the other on the 3 pt. controller and don't have to mess with all the shifting from forward to reverse.

    Same goes for loader work. The only shifting I do when using the loader is when I shift into a lower range to fill the loader and then into a higher range if I have any distance to cover before dumping the load.

    Chris

  8. #28

    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Posts
    582
    Location
    Seattle area
    Tractor
    JD 855 4WD, HST

    Default Re: Buying/Pricing

    Richard,

    Agreed on the safety issue that the Hyd and non-Hyd are equally as safe or non-safe [img]/w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif[/img] depending on your perspective.

    <font color=blue>"I can do just as much work, just as fast, and just as safe as anyone that has a hyrdro tractor."</font color=blue>

    I won't argue that you could use your gear drive tractor as fast as me on my hydro since you were practically born on one, but I might argue that you were by far the exception rather than the rule.

    <font color=blue>"Many things you can get done faster and do a better job with a gear drive tractor as well."</font color=blue>

    I'm wondering how you could possibly do it faster with a gear drive tractor? I'll give you equally as fast but faster, how? [img]/w3tcompact/icons/hmm.gif[/img]

    My point is really that someone who is not a tractor expert (weekend warrior) but wants to do alot of landscaping, loader work etc, would really be more well suited with a hydro.

  9. #29
    Epic Contributor Bird's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2000
    Posts
    37,010
    Location
    Texas

    Default Re: Buying/Pricing

    <font color=blue>There is absolutely no difference at all in safety, that's just plain hogwash, unless you really don't know what you are doing and then it doesn't matter if you have a gear or a hydro.</font color=blue>

    Hmm, that's coming on pretty strong, and I'll concede that you have a lot more experience and knowledge than most of us (myself included) with tractors, but I'm just as convinced that you're wrong this time as you are that you're right.[img]/w3tcompact/icons/laugh.gif[/img]

  10. #30

    Join Date
    Sep 2000
    Posts
    1,862
    Location
    The Fabulous Foothills of Northern California

    Default Re: Buying/Pricing

    Sorry Richard, I respectfully disagree. There is a huge difference in safety. My 1000+ hours of experience not only tells me so, I can easily prove it. Mowing is an easy and perfect example. Remember folks, I own 2 tractors, a gear driven and a hydro. I can tell you that mowing with my 84" mower while backing it down (steep) almost into my pond is so much safer with hydro then on my gear drive, there really is no comparision. No brakes needed on the hydro, the degree to which I can back it in can be as slow as I desire and when it starts wanting to go completely in, simply releasing the hydro stops it and with ALL 4 WHEELS locked in, not just the rear brakes as all compacts are set up. (Once the clutch goes in on a 4WD gear drive, the front wheels are free to do as they wish until the clutch is released) No brakes, no clutch and no shifting. To get out I simply depress the forward pedal. It is not even close to being that easy with ANY gear tractor period. I have many, many of hours on gears both shuttle type and full manual, I know the limitations of them and this is a perfect example. I would not let many folks I know do this on my International, anyone can do it on my hydro.

    You simply cannot do loader work with a gear as fast as I can with a hydro. I believe your experience with hydro would be very limited if any at all to make that statement. I use both type drives for loader work and there is NO COMPARISION, You are quite correct though about discing, plowing, maybe spraying but I question that as there is very little load for spraying and the degree of hydro slip would be almost nil. Plowing and discing where the demands for maximum pull are required will have to be in favor of gears. Now, how many folks out there are buying compacts to disc and plow mass areas? My guess is very few. For small plots, you can get by with hydro for discing and plowing. For large areas, I suggest you skip the compacts altogether.

    JD's Power Reverser is no different then kubota and New Hollands shuttle shift. I use one almost everyday. I most definitely would regret getting a Power Reverser or hydraulic shuttle shift over a hydro, sorry to so strongly disagree as we have in the past, but I want folks to be armed with what I feel to be the correct facts about hydrostatic drive. Remember, hydrostatics have at least 2 ranges and typically 3. When in low, the amount of "slippage" if it exists is undetectable. I'm not advocating folks only buy hydrostatic drive, but I do want them to know the facts. If a bulk of what you do is mowing on slopes and loader work, its going to be VERY tough to outperform a hydrostatic drive. Rat...

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