Ventrac choices: engine advice?

   / Ventrac choices: engine advice? #1  

MountainMomma

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So, we're about to pull the trigger on a Ventrac 4200 of some description (and, yes, we've already come to that decision through much research--see this thread), and are only looking at Ventrac's liquid cooled engines, which narrows the field to four machines: 2 gas and 2 diesel. In combing the Ventrac section, I came across this:

"Ventrac provides tractors with 31 hp Gasoline and 31 hp Turbo Diesel engines. Both can operate safely on 30 degree slopes. However, the Gasoline version is rated for intermittent operation only--meaning no more than 10 minutes at a time on a 30 degree side slope. The [TURBO] Diesel engine has had modifications (by the manufacturer Daihatsu) to allow for unlimited continuous operation on slopes of up to 30 degrees. I switched to the Turbo Diesel in order to get this capability since I mow a lot of slopes. Incidentally, both engines have virtually the same torque response with the Turbo Diesel having a slight edge. In most practical tractor applications you can't tell the difference in performance."

MOST of the land that I need to mow is hilly. with many 30 degree slopes, but also lesser slopes intermittently. In other words, I can climb to a more level spot pretty frequently when mowing the truly steep areas. I've checked the current owners manuals online for the 4200 series, and the above is correct information according to the specs--the 31 hp diesel has same constraints as both gas engines, but the Turbo Diesel can run continuously.

Do I read this correctly to say... what? We can only mow for 10 minutes on such slopes with all but the D Turbo, and then...? Cut off the engine? Go to a level place for a breather...? In other words, what do the non-turbo engines need AFTER 10 minutes of mowing on a 30 degree slope?
 
   / Ventrac choices: engine advice? #2  
I can't answer that question, but having owned/owning both gas and diesel, I now buy only diesel when available.
 
   / Ventrac choices: engine advice? #3  
It may be an oil issue, and not related to the turbo at all. Most machines may not be designed for the engine's oil pump to pick up oil from the pan at that degree of an angle, which would cause them to stop lubricating the moving parts if operated like that for more than just a few minutes. Running an engine without oil will do serious damage quickly. I don't know anything about Ventracs, but it could be that the turbo diesel engine has been modified to pick up oil from the pan regardless of angle.

Run time issues aside, if it's in the budget I would lean toward the turbo diesel anyway. Diesels are generally more fuel efficient than gasoline engines, and the turbo generally gives the engine a little more seat of the pants power.
 
   / Ventrac choices: engine advice? #4  
So, we're about to pull the trigger on a Ventrac 4200 of some description (and, yes, we've already come to that decision through much research--see this thread), and are only looking at Ventrac's liquid cooled engines, which narrows the field to four machines: 2 gas and 2 diesel. In combing the Ventrac section, I came across this:

"Ventrac provides tractors with 31 hp Gasoline and 31 hp Turbo Diesel engines. Both can operate safely on 30 degree slopes. However, the Gasoline version is rated for intermittent operation only--meaning no more than 10 minutes at a time on a 30 degree side slope. The [TURBO] Diesel engine has had modifications (by the manufacturer Daihatsu) to allow for unlimited continuous operation on slopes of up to 30 degrees. I switched to the Turbo Diesel in order to get this capability since I mow a lot of slopes. Incidentally, both engines have virtually the same torque response with the Turbo Diesel having a slight edge. In most practical tractor applications you can't tell the difference in performance."

MOST of the land that I need to mow is hilly. with many 30 degree slopes, but also lesser slopes intermittently. In other words, I can climb to a more level spot pretty frequently when mowing the truly steep areas. I've checked the current owners manuals online for the 4200 series, and the above is correct information according to the specs--the 31 hp diesel has same constraints as both gas engines, but the Turbo Diesel can run continuously.

Do I read this correctly to say... what? We can only mow for 10 minutes on such slopes with all but the D Turbo, and then...? Cut off the engine? Go to a level place for a breather...? In other words, what do the non-turbo engines need AFTER 10 minutes of mowing on a 30 degree slope?

I was going to post in your other thread to get the Turbo Diesel, but I figured you had already made your decision. Since you have not, get the Turbo Diesel.

As for your question, I don't know for sure, but I feel confident the issue is a potential lubrication issue. I think the correct response is to limit the amount of time on the slopes for those engines, and seek to get to a flat place, or at least a much flatter place as soon as possible.
 
   / Ventrac choices: engine advice? #5  
If it were my purchase, I'd go for the turbo-diesel also. As noted, it's almost certainly an engine lubrication matter, and their top of the line model (also the most costly), is designed for the steepest slope conditions. With a purchase in that price range and knowing what you'll be doing with it, it just seems prudent to go for the one best engineered to deal with mowing on hillsides.

Be sure to get the dual wheels. Don't know if your place requires the rough cut mower or one of the finish type mowers. I'd suggest you look seriously at the loader attachment. While it's costly, no doubt, loaders are some of the handiest attachments on any tractor. The other stuff, well you can figure out what's needed as you proceed. I don't know if Ventrac offers a "package deal" for attachments bought with a new tractor, but it's worth checking. That's pretty typical for other tractor manufacturers.
 
   / Ventrac choices: engine advice?
  • Thread Starter
#6  
Yep; we're being quoted package deals. The difference is not insignificant: about $8K, but I'd hate to have to put a 10-min. stopwatch on every mow of a 30 degree hillside.

By the way, how do you judge the degree of hillside... just by looking? Seems that they make a distinction between 25 and 30 degrees... pretty fine for my eye. Are there tools so that we can "take soundings" (as it were) on our land?
 
   / Ventrac choices: engine advice? #7  
   / Ventrac choices: engine advice? #8  
How about some pictures so we can understand the angle that you'll be working on?
DevilDog
 
   / Ventrac choices: engine advice?
  • Thread Starter
#9  
OK: here are shots of my terrain, in different seasons...

winter shot of one slope

Summer shot is the same view in green in April. This grass is now WAIST high! We need a mower for sure!

Other side of our property just this month: valley with significant slope and, oh yeah, multiflora rose bushes galore to pull up. Fun!
 
 
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