Tractor Sizing What do you use for logging? Prevent my divorce.

[nehalem2]

Since you are only an occasional logger with a 20" Max DBH I think your should spend the money on your logging winch. I have a Farmi pto winch on a 35 hp JD 1070 (4wd) and can pull 24" x16' logs (one at a time) with no problems. I avoid logging in the mud. The Farmi seems expensive, but has nice safety features & 160' of cable which helps avoid the mud.

-brian

[arrow]

I am logging about 60 acres in my spare time. My plan is to keep this tractor for a long time (will it to my children long). The property is fairly to very wet otherwise typical New England woods. Most of what I pull is a mix of soft and hardwoods (max DBH of 20 inches) to be milled for my restoring my barns, firewood and timber management. I have a MF1428v (28 hp hydro) with R4 tires with rear chains, FEL and a skidding plate that does an admirable job for what it is but I know I need something bigger for both safety and efficiency. I have been looking at all the colors for 6 months and think I have done my homework in terms of research. One of the reasons I have not pulled the trigger is that I am not confident that I know what I need. I do need a FEL for loader work around the barn and to move snow and therefore would like a shuttle shift or Hydro. I do need 4WD/MFWD given snow removal and how wet the property is.
SO..here are my questions:
What are people using in the woods?
What wheelbase?
What HP?
What weight?
R1, R1W, R4 with chains?
Metal fenders only or will a fiberglass tolerate the loose chain thwack.
Exposed drive shafts, hydraulic lines and diesel tanks need to be up-armored?
One of the tractors has only three reverse gears. Is that a problem?
I am buying a winch. How does that figure into any of the above?
I have too small a tractor but can I get too big a tractor?
I need the input from those of you in the know.
If there is something I am completely forgetting please tell me.
If some of these are idiotic concerns feel free to call me on it.
My deadline is December 31st as I have been threatened with marital counseling ("Will you just buy the **** tractor already").
I will let you know what I buy and of course I know I am required to post pictures.
Thanks in advance. -R

1. Their is such a diversity of what people use and where they are as to become meaningless as a decision making process. You are in New England with many ground obstructions and contours. This necessitates a tractor that is not too large or small and preferably one that is low slung such as an orchard tractor to get your gravity center lower. You also want a tractor with strong front end components as they take a beating when in the wood.
2. Wheel bases will equal out to the size of the tractor. Not such an issue or not as much of an issue as tire track width as you want lateral stability.
3. Hp is also not an issue as most tractors will not allow you to use up HP before you lose traction. Weight is your friend here. Hp comes more into play when using implements off the pto. Whatever size tractor you get will have the right hp.
4. You want heavy. 3500# and up. But you want low cog more importantly.
5.Definitely chains. You can put chains on turf tires and have a different tractor traction wise. Tire choice will more depend on where you plan to bring your tractor to the most whether for grass cutting, ground engagement, hard or paved surfaces. etc. If it is primarily a woods tractor with mud, you want floatation that a wider tire will provide. Most if not all my logging is done in the snow or at least when the ground freezes. I have R1's as they also give the most ground clearance. Whatever tire you choose, get them weighted and chained.
6. Metal fenders preferable and not because of chain thwack but more for that sapling that gets stuck in your tire track and comes around between the tire and fender. Just bang the fender out.
7. Driveshaft not so much but hydro lines up and out of the way. Tie rods take quite the beating and need the most protection.
8. No
9. One of the best things you can buy for your purpose. Actually its the other way around with the tractor you get controlling winch capacity. If anything a winch mitigates the beating the tractor gets in comparison to that tractor with no winch.
10. Absolutely especially if the tractor is getting higher and higher as it is getting bigger.
Ideally your tractor will have more than a single rops. I am not talking about a cab but more of a cage. Not having falling timber protection is one of the largest arguments for those who think a tractor has no business logging. Also, it is not a good idea to skid with your winch line.

In general you want a low,heavy 4wd tractor with a good dealer to back you up.
Look at how skidders are built and how low they sit on their axles.

[IndyIan]

As much as I like the 5035 Mahindra, especially the PST, it is still probably considered a heavy compact. The 5530 is a utility size and much heavier, runs a fairly tall ag tire, and has a bunch of front axle articulation at the pivot. I think it would be better in the woods. Having said that, it's not shielded under the belly, so you would want to make a skid pan for it.

The more front axle pivot, the less one of the other tires will want to come off the ground and the less spinning if you get a front tire up on a stump or log, or down in a hole. I think it really makes a difference on rough wet ground.

Good point on the front axle, I haven't been into the woods yet with mine(Need to convert an atv trail to tractor trail) but I have run out of front pivot a few times just moving dirt around on my hills. I was a bit surprised but its probably a good thing for a new tractor owner.

[Dr_Zinj]

Still getting used to my new Bobcat CT230. I prefer not to run over saplings stumps and boulders with it as I have no skid plate on the bottom. And I like the hydraulic lines and stuff exactly where they currently are.

I do have more than enough hp and traction to haul a 15 to 20 foot log 2 foot at the butt. This is with plain filled R4s and putting the transmission into low range. I prefer the R4s because they're thicker and tougher and the branches and rocks less likely to blow one out. I suppose if things were icier I'd be getting slippage problems where chains would be the solution.

As with most pulling under questionable conditions, slowly but surely does the trick.

[slowzuki]

Just some pics in the spirit of the thread. Not the greatest, never time to shoot while working, and never took the camera during our normal work in the snow.

[Mike476]

68' MF 135 gas, loaded rears, 7' MF rear blade and 2 10K chains. 3+ acres, enough lumber milled that I built my 20X30 workshop in background of photo number 3 and will be building a 32X40 garage. Some large white pines, black spruce and some poplar. Wife and I milled it all.

[crazyal]

I use my Kubota GL4240 to log about 6 cord worth of wood a year. I only do it in the fall when the temps are reasonable. This year I started mid September and was done by early October. The tractor has the power to skid anything I've thrown at it including a pair of 50' long 18" diameter red maples. I don't think I would go with a larger tractor. Maybe a MX5100.

I find that the weight of the tractor on the wetter sections of the trails turns it quickly into a deep hole, a bigger tractor just means a bigger hole. I'm more of a be gentle on the land and not the get a large machine and just plow your way through type of person. I also find that because of the heavy snow falls we often get the ground may never freeze in the winter.

On some of the dirt hills I go up the ground just barely holds up to the weight of my tractor. I find that I need to use the diff lock or it will start digging the dirt even when not pulling anything. A heavier tractor just means it will require that much more traction. But I'm also lucky as I skid downhill.

I wouldn't think twice about a 3pt winch, get the correct size for what ever tractor you go with. For 6 cord a year I do it's not worth the money but any more than that and I can't see how it would not pay for itself. Right now I lug 20' lengths of 5/16" chain to the logs and string them up as often driving right up to the log is just out of the question. Plenty times I have to pull the log then back up and remove a section of chain and pull some more because I just can't get a nice long straight run. It's these little things that wear you out and add up time wise.

[Surgeon]

You are not the only one. TBN's auto-correct thinks so too!

[Johnbro]

I don't think the tractor size will be a big limiting factor. Traction is key so get 4wd and r1 tires, or else use chains. I try to get my logging and splitting done in late spring early summer so the wood can dry over the summer for that winter's burning. For lumber it doesn't matter when you get it so much, I'd do it when it's dry and you won't be digging big holes in your forest.

The trick to not beating up your tractor is to make a little road where you want to go with a power pruner, chain saw, and your FEL to push stuff out of the way. Then pull stuff out with a winch or just a lot of logging chain and skid it out. Nobody anywhere has woods thicker than what we have in the NW and I wouldn't blink at pulling out trees the size you just mentioned. And that would be with my old 22hp tractor

[slowzuki]

I think you mean trees bigger than in the NW? Most of Washington forest I've been in you could drive a D11 between the trees without clipping them. Back east here you can hardly walk through many areas but the trees don't get really big.

Nobody anywhere has woods thicker than what we have in the NW and I wouldn't blink at pulling out trees the size you just mentioned.