Tractor Sizing I am short...

[goosegbf]

Thanks for the quick reply folks - greatly appreciate it.

Like MANY other folks here I am really struggling with the B/L or CK/DK split. Particularly for lift capacity. I have read a million posts with folks asking the same question and generally the advice is just get the L/DK if you can afford it. So my laundry list is below - fire off any opinions.

As for the the seat debacle, I will go back and explain to the guys at H&M and see what they can do about that seat. I would hope that this would not take the DK out of the running.

1) I have an unruly stream that loses bank definition, so I have ~1,000 feet of trenching/grading to do to keep the stream where it is supposed to be and not leaking out making a general mess of itself. So, I am debating getting the back hoe.
2) We have a great wood burning stove/fireplace. In this ridiculously warm winter in upstate NY we are through ~1 cord. I imagine this would be much greater in a normal winter. So, lots of wood hauling and I would love to be able to elevate logs while I cut so I can stop sharpening chains and rolling logs. I would really like a front grapple to do this, but from what I see I really need the L/DK size to be able to have a grapple and still be able to pick something up once the grapple weight is factored in. Oh yeah, we have some pretty steep slopes in the back of the property and I'd like to get some of the trees that Hurricane Irene decided to play pick up sticks with back there. So traction is key (going with Ag tires - not messing around with the tractor on the lawn).
3) The property is criss-crossed by old farmer walls. I want to transport much of these stones to the front to help me rebuild a ~250' by 2' wide by 3' tall wall across the front of the yard. I also want the backhoe to dig that foundation. Grapple might be nice for stone placement (or backhoe with thumb)
4) 700' gravel driveway that is relatively level. Currently planning on putting a snow thrower on the back. I know - everybody says get a cab and put the snow thrower on the front. I didn't have any trouble on the CK35 turning around and I don't want the cab because I guarantee that I will pick if off in the woods.
5) Other attachments that I see in my future are a PTO woodchipper for 4" and smaller limbs and a brush hog for some serious honeysuckle control. Toothbar on the FEL so I can dig a place for the slab where the new barn will go for the tractor (my wife didn't even blink when I said that. I can only imagine what the payment for that will be - a new WRX I imagine since the tractor is her WRX fund. I have one - she has a Mazda 3 and wants my WRX... Hence the future issue). Probably a box blade to fix the driveway after I toss stones with the snow thrower.
6) I am unsure what to do about Emerich's as they are 15 mins from my house. They REALLY irritated me when I went to talk with them last year. The guy listened for 30 seconds, cut me off, and told me that I wanted a BX and here was his price. Well, I didn't and don't want a BX and I don't care what his price is. The guys at H&M have been infinitely better and for that reason alone I think Kubota and Cub Cadet are far behind in the running. Also, I am unsure what to think about Cub Cadet and Yanmar breaking up. That said Emerich's has a seemingly good deal going for a 50 HP Cub Cadet with FEL and BH for $31k. DK40 should slide in right around there as well - no way a GL touches that I'm guessing.

So what's the consensus? FEL capacity of CK/B has me a little worried. If it weren't for that, this decision would be easy and I would have a CK35HST sitting in my driveway.

Thanks again folks!

 

[k0ua]

I am not saying not to get the DK, but the CK series could work. Get one of the wildcat 48 inch grapples that are all the rage here on the forum, they are light enough to still have some lift capacity left over... Of course if you go with a DK and get the 401 loader.. well your lift capacity worries are over for sure. the Grand L's are still in the running at your budget. I would go slow and keep my options open at this stage. Of course it is easy for all of us to set in our armchairs and spend your money. If I had my choice I would have a DK40 SE Hydro machine. I priced one here about a month ago just for S/G and it was just under $27000 here. Tractor Prices are regional though. Possibly go get a Kubota quote and the Kioti quote, and go back and forth a few times between dealerships Good Luck on what ever you choose, I think you are headed down the right road.

James K0UA

 

[Don87]

Get the biggest you can afford that will accept the backhoe. You need a hoe from what you describe.

Look at using rock to line your stream, that's about the only sure way to keep it where you want it.


EDIT: I would use the available rock for the stream first. Used railroad ties can be used for ladnscaping.

 

[Martian]

Thanks for the quick reply folks - greatly appreciate it.

Like MANY other folks here I am really struggling with the B/L or CK/DK split. Particularly for lift capacity. I have read a million posts with folks asking the same question and generally the advice is just get the L/DK if you can afford it. So my laundry list is below - fire off any opinions.

As for the the seat debacle, I will go back and explain to the guys at H&M and see what they can do about that seat. I would hope that this would not take the DK out of the running.

1) I have an unruly stream that loses bank definition, so I have ~1,000 feet of trenching/grading to do to keep the stream where it is supposed to be and not leaking out making a general mess of itself. So, I am debating getting the back hoe.
2) We have a great wood burning stove/fireplace. In this ridiculously warm winter in upstate NY we are through ~1 cord. I imagine this would be much greater in a normal winter. So, lots of wood hauling and I would love to be able to elevate logs while I cut so I can stop sharpening chains and rolling logs. I would really like a front grapple to do this, but from what I see I really need the L/DK size to be able to have a grapple and still be able to pick something up once the grapple weight is factored in. Oh yeah, we have some pretty steep slopes in the back of the property and I'd like to get some of the trees that Hurricane Irene decided to play pick up sticks with back there. So traction is key (going with Ag tires - not messing around with the tractor on the lawn).
3) The property is criss-crossed by old farmer walls. I want to transport much of these stones to the front to help me rebuild a ~250' by 2' wide by 3' tall wall across the front of the yard. I also want the backhoe to dig that foundation. Grapple might be nice for stone placement (or backhoe with thumb)
4) 700' gravel driveway that is relatively level. Currently planning on putting a snow thrower on the back. I know - everybody says get a cab and put the snow thrower on the front. I didn't have any trouble on the CK35 turning around and I don't want the cab because I guarantee that I will pick if off in the woods.
5) Other attachments that I see in my future are a PTO woodchipper for 4" and smaller limbs and a brush hog for some serious honeysuckle control. Toothbar on the FEL so I can dig a place for the slab where the new barn will go for the tractor (my wife didn't even blink when I said that. I can only imagine what the payment for that will be - a new WRX I imagine since the tractor is her WRX fund. I have one - she has a Mazda 3 and wants my WRX... Hence the future issue). Probably a box blade to fix the driveway after I toss stones with the snow thrower.
6) I am unsure what to do about Emerich's as they are 15 mins from my house. They REALLY irritated me when I went to talk with them last year. The guy listened for 30 seconds, cut me off, and told me that I wanted a BX and here was his price. Well, I didn't and don't want a BX and I don't care what his price is. The guys at H&M have been infinitely better and for that reason alone I think Kubota and Cub Cadet are far behind in the running. Also, I am unsure what to think about Cub Cadet and Yanmar breaking up. That said Emerich's has a seemingly good deal going for a 50 HP Cub Cadet with FEL and BH for $31k. DK40 should slide in right around there as well - no way a GL touches that I'm guessing.

So what's the consensus? FEL capacity of CK/B has me a little worried. If it weren't for that, this decision would be easy and I would have a CK35HST sitting in my driveway.

Thanks again folks!

Ok, I'll try and cover all.

First - You want a L/DK size, for lifting that stuff and using the tractor as much as you describe, you may be able to complete the tasks with the smaller tractor, but take much longer. The extra size is well worth it. I always tend to get a size larger than what I think I'll need anyway, that way I know I'll know I'm getting enough tractor and don't spend more money than necessary trading in and trading up. You could do the work you intend with a smaller tractor, but using it a lot, the DK/L is the way to go.

Second - You can justify a backhoe very easily. Well worth it, and you want a thumb. Kubota is the only one who offers a thumb on their backhoes now though, factory. You can get an aftermarket thumb kit for nearly any backhoe, or just get an aftermarket backhoe like the one Woods offers. The dredging of the pond area will be enough for the backhoe, though. You'll find plenty of use for it down the road.

Third - Don't buy from a dealer you don't like. I've walked out on hard-to-pass deals because of an @$$ of a dealer. These machines cost thousands of dollars, and for me to spend a couple hundred more for a guy who will treat me right is worth it, for me. That's just my opinion, take it however you want.

Fourth - Budget, I can spend your money like a champ. But are you willing to pay the big bucks?

Fifth - Cab, adds a lot to the price, but when your out in the dead cold of winter plowing snow in your cab preset to 72ｰ, it's a good thing.

H&M equipment eh? I was about an inch from buying a Deere 110 from them, then I bought a different 110, but I think something like that is what you really want. Below is right from H&M's site. Has the hydraulics up front for the grapple, top n tilt 3 pt hitch in the rear and a backhoe with a thumb in the rear. And believe me when I tell you this, I searched around for the right 110 for me for ~4 months, 2 months more deciding what I wanted, and that one at H&M is the second best deal I found. The 110 fits right into the size of the L/DK, but will offer you more hydraulic power and a much improved backhoe. For reference, I just spend $26,500 ($29,000 with shipping from Montana to Michigan, a whole 1800 miles) and it came with all the hydraulic options, thumb, box blade, tnt 3 pt, grapple and forks. The one at H&M has all the hydro options, where the big money is, you can have your grapple, already has a thumb, the 3 rear remotes in the back with the top n tilt. It's a really nice machine and definitely worth considering. I know you already mentioned that the Kubota dealer burned a bridge with you, but they are the only make of a tractor that makes a compact TLB still. Deere used to with the 110, what I'd recommend from H&M, but they since discontinued it. Now Kubota offers their compact TLB's as one of the best alternatives. I'd really think about something like that 110 at H&M, I know as well as you that nothing beats new, but those tractors are close to $55k new...
Tractors for Sale| Used Tractors| Ford Tractors| Kubota Tractors| New Holland Tractors H&M Equipment, New York

EDIT: OOPS! Doesn't look like that link will directly go to the 110, but it's the second from the bottom.

 

[goosegbf]

Thanks very much all for you replies - helpful all.

I had started this process insisting that I would buy a used tractor. However, that was hijacked for several reasons. First, I realized that I didn't know how to look-at/test a used tractor and know what I was getting myself into. I can spot rust with the best of them, but this means very little. Second, the price of the new Kioti tractors surprised me after starting with Kubota's website pricing. Third, you aren't getting 0% for 72 months on a used tractor.

So, Martian, can you help me out here? It sounds like you bought your 110 sight unseen. How do you convince yourself you are getting a quality machine and not somebody else's cast off? In this case, I can go drive the one at H&M equipment. What should I look for & what should I ask? What do you think of the 1844 hrs? In theory these things are bulletproof if cared for, but I don't know how to view these hours. I have read some posts on hrs and what it means and in general the answer is go test out the tractor. Does the 110 have a category 1 3 pt hitch - in other words can I drop by BH and put a snowthrower/woodchipper whatever else back there? Finally, what does "TLB" really imply? Does it really mean a single seat for both FEL & BH? Whereas the compact tractors have two seats - one for FEL and one for BH?

This is an interesting option because it would blow the doors off a new GL TLB price. The new DK40SE price would be a little higher (I have a verbal quote for $23k for DK40SE+FEL add $9k for KB2485 w/out thumb and I'd be at ~$32k), but as you point out - a little less capable (but 0% would be an option and I would have a warranty). I have a verbal quote for the CK35 at $19k including FEL. Once I add a BH that will come out at the used 110 press for MUCH less capability. Decisions - gotta love em (although much better to have em).

Again - thanks!

 

[Don87]

Thanks very much all for you replies - helpful all.

I had started this process insisting that I would buy a used tractor. However, that was hijacked for several reasons. First, I realized that I didn't know how to look-at/test a used tractor and know what I was getting myself into. I can spot rust with the best of them, but this means very little. Second, the price of the new Kioti tractors surprised me after starting with Kubota's website pricing. Third, you aren't getting 0% for 72 months on a used tractor.

So, Martian, can you help me out here? It sounds like you bought your 110 sight unseen. How do you convince yourself you are getting a quality machine and not somebody else's cast off? In this case, I can go drive the one at H&M equipment. What should I look for & what should I ask? What do you think of the 1844 hrs? In theory these things are bulletproof if cared for, but I don't know how to view these hours. I have read some posts on hrs and what it means and in general the answer is go test out the tractor. Does the 110 have a category 1 3 pt hitch - in other words can I drop by BH and put a snowthrower/woodchipper whatever else back there? Finally, what does "TLB" really imply? Does it really mean a single seat for both FEL & BH? Whereas the compact tractors have two seats - one for FEL and one for BH?

This is an interesting option because it would blow the doors off a new GL TLB price. The new DK40SE price would be a little higher (I have a verbal quote for $23k for DK40SE+FEL add $9k for KB2485 w/out thumb and I'd be at ~$32k), but as you point out - a little less capable (but 0% would be an option and I would have a warranty). I have a verbal quote for the CK35 at $19k including FEL. Once I add a BH that will come out at the used 110 press for MUCH less capability. Decisions - gotta love em (although much better to have em).

Again - thanks!

This may answer a few of your questions:


JohnDeere 110 TLB Tractor Loader Backhoe Compact Utility Tractors JohnDeere.com

 

[IndyIan]

I'd go have a look at that 110, I imagine a dedicated TLB is pretty hard to break but go over it for cracks or extra welds, leaks, worn out pins, wrong coloured smoke, etc. There are lots of posts here on what to look for in a used tractor.

 

[Martian]

Goose,

I did buy my 110 sight unseen. It was really tough to do it, but there is very few in the country. I have 1 for sale anywhere near me and it was priced the same with none of the options, doesn't even have the rear work light. It was being sold through one of the largest Deere dealers in the country and the guy had assured me, sent me records and so forth. Plus I had the gurus here check it all out and they thought it was a good idea. I've had tractors all my life and know what to ask about and look for, I wouldn't recommend someone like yourself to do the same.

They do have it listed on eBay as well, and they have 4.9% for 60 months. Not 0%, but it's a lot more capable tractor.

The backhoe does come off, about 5 minutes is the norm from what I've seen. The (cat 1) 3 pt links come with the one at H&M ($1000+ add on if they don't come with it) and has the top and tilt, so a couple of the links on the 3 pt are hydraulic for better control of you 3 pt implements. You can't get the hydraulics after the fact on the 110, only from the factory, and the one at H&M has all of them.

I wouldn't be worried about 1800 hours, if it was well taken care of. If its never been serviced, avoid it like the plague, but 1800 hours well serviced, no reason to fear.

Yes, a single seat. The seat actually flips over, so no need to get off and crawl around onto the back.

It does also have whats called creep to reposition, you can move the backhoe from the backhoe. That way you don't have to turn back around to move 3' farther to keep trenching. Really nice feature, JD introduced it with the 110 and now it's in their 4520 and 4720, and something similar in the Kubotas TLBs but no one else haves it. So, in theory you can drive from the tractor facing backwards on the backhoe, really nice feature.

I was really considering getting a tractor similarly sized to the DK with a backhoe, but the add on backhoes just weren't near as strong as the one on the 110. It has a much bigger breakout, dig depth and has a thumb. As nice as a the DK series backhoes are, not near as strong as a dedicated TLB.

If you can afford a new Kubota L45 that would be ideal, but at near to upwards of 50 with all of the hydraulic options, that's the reason I went with the 110.

I think a DK40se could work for you, definitely wouldn't recommend a CK. Although a CK would likely work for you, you'd be working all day struggling on tasks the 110 or DK40 do in a couple hours. I would imagine if you got a CK or similar sized you'd be upgrading to a larger size shortly.

I'm not trying to sway you one way or another, but just giving you some options.

Good luck!

 

[jenkinsph]

goosegbf,
If I could only have one tractor it would be the 110tlb, very versatile machine. The hoe comes off easily and the 3PH arms pin on with very little effort. I would atleast look into the 110 Martian has mentioned.

 

[jenkinsph]

Hey folks,

I am a tractor newbie. My wife and I recently purchased 17 completely wooded acres in upstate New York. I cleared the lot (without a tractor) where the house is located (~1 acre), we had a house built, and we now are onto the taking care of everything tasks. Hence, the tractor search has commenced in earnest.

So, based on local dealers I am looking at primarily Kioti and Kubota (New Holland is also an option). I drove a Kioti CK35 and a DK40SE this morning and I learned something that I thought I already new. I am short. In this case short means 5'7". When I drove the CK35 I didn't move the seat fully, but I could definitely drive the tractor comfortably, including practice for turning around to snow throw (700' gravel driveway). When I drove the DK40SE however, I had the seat weight all the way dialed down and the seat as low and as far forward as it would go and I still could not comfortably reach the forward/reverse pedals. I had to sit half way forward on the seat. Is this what I can expect if I go up to the DK or grand L size? This seems a tad ridiculous. My wife is only 5'2" and she would also like to be able to drive the tractor.

Anybody have similar experience? Is there a cure other than the rack for us (or blocks ALA Short Round in Indiana Jones)? I am planning on driving the Kubota next weekend.

Thanks for any comments

I am short too (5'7") and haven't had any problems adjusting tractor seats to fit properly on any tractors I have seen. I suspect the seat wasn't setup properly. About the only time I move the seat forward is when using forks on my 110. Have to lean forward to see the tips while still keeping the seat switch depressed. For most work my seat is in the middle position.