2012 NH Boomer 30 HST or Kioti CK30 HST? Value?

[IslandTractor]

All the new NH (LS based) compact tractors' engines are natural-aspirated. The Boomer 30 is using a Mitsubishi S4L engine while the Boomer is using a Mitsubishi S4L2 engine. The S4L2 has greater displacement than the S4L. The NH specs are screwed up on their website as the website states that the Boomer 35 is ~28" longer than the Boomer 30, yet the the NH paper brochure states they are the same length at 119". The same goes for the weight were the website states they are both 2913lbs, yet the paper brochure states the Boomer 30 is 3121lbs and the Boomer 35 is 3200lbs. I wish NH's marketing group would get their tractor specs consistent.

In addition, The Boomer 30 and 35 states the 3PH lift capacity is 1807lbs at the ball ends, so that means it has a lift capacity of about 1535lbs at 24" aft of the hitch (the NH Boomer 2035 3PH lift capacity was ~1925lbs at the ball ends and 1635lbs 24" out). There is about 15% to 20% difference between the ball ends and 24" aft lift capacities on a 3PH for this size tractor. It does not surprise me that the NH Boomer 35 is $2,750.00 more. It seems that anytime you move up a model size, NH will charge about $2,000.00 to $2,500.00 more, however, that dealer seems to be a little high with that price. JD and many other manufactures do the same thing, I guess except for Kioti.

NH must share website managers with Kioti. There are dozens of errors on that orange site too.

By the way, Kioti also tries to get a couple grand extra for boring an engine block an extra 200cc between otherwise perfectly identical models (DK).

 

[BoonDoc]

It will all come down to upcoming "road test". But on paper, comes down to almost identical features, dimensions, weight, etc. Only real difference ended up being 28HP NH vs 30HP Kioti. Point goes to Kioti, and Independent PTO, point goes to New Holland. So it's 2 HP vs Independent PTO. Otherwise, a draw. I doubt the 2HP is meaningful as the NH PTO HP is actually slightly higher (22.5NH and 22 Kioti), and because the NH has slightly higher 3PH and FEL lift capacities (again, very similar indeed). With all the inaccuracy in the literature, not sure I trust the numbers to be spot on accurate anyway.

Since this will be my first tractor, I don't know how important independent PTO is. Most brands still feature live PTO. In day to day use, will the NH's independent PTO end up making a big difference in ease of use or do I lump it together with the cruise control, tilt and beer-can holder?

 

[Guesseral]

All the new NH (LS based) compact tractors' engines are natural-aspirated. The Boomer 30 is using a Mitsubishi S4L engine while the Boomer is using a Mitsubishi S4L2 engine. The S4L2 has greater displacement than the S4L. The NH specs are screwed up on their website as the website states that the Boomer 35 is ~28" longer than the Boomer 30, yet the the NH paper brochure states they are the same length at 119". The same goes for the weight were the website states they are both 2913lbs, yet the paper brochure states the Boomer 30 is 3121lbs and the Boomer 35 is 3200lbs. I
wish NH's marketing group would get their tractor specs consistent.
In addition, The Boomer 30 and 35 states the 3PH lift capacity is 1807lbs at the ball ends, so that means it has a lift capacity of about 1535lbs at 24" aft of the hitch (the NH Boomer 2035 3PH lift capacity was ~1925lbs at the ball ends and 1635lbs 24" out). There is about 15% to 20% difference between the ball ends and 24" aft lift capacities on a 3PH for this size tractor. It does not surprise me that the NH Boomer 35 is $2,750.00 more. It seems that anytime you move up a model size, NH will charge about $2,000.00 to $2,500.00 more, however, that dealer seems to be a little high with that price. JD and many other manufactures do the same thing, I guess except for Kioti.

Looking at the above information and the LS web site it would seem that stepping up to the Boomer 35 would be going into an entirely different class of tractor. The information above (which I didn't varify) according to the LS web site would compare to an R3039 which I think is in atotally different class of tractor. The only other style of LS tractor it could be would be a G3038 but that has the L3AL engine. The R series tractor is a large step up in classification if I am not mistaken, no wonder there is a large cost increase. I really would think that you should be able to get a better price out of LS than what you have gotten, why not get a price on the larger LS also if they see you are really interested they may show a little more interest. In any event you can see the real or realistic specs on the LS site.

 

[jenkinsph]

It will all come down to upcoming "road test". But on paper, comes down to almost identical features, dimensions, weight, etc. Only real difference ended up being 28HP NH vs 30HP Kioti. Point goes to Kioti, and Independent PTO, point goes to New Holland. So it's 2 HP vs Independent PTO. Otherwise, a draw. I doubt the 2HP is meaningful as the NH PTO HP is actually slightly higher (22.5NH and 22 Kioti), and because the NH has slightly higher 3PH and FEL lift capacities (again, very similar indeed). With all the inaccuracy in the literature, not sure I trust the numbers to be spot on accurate anyway.

Since this will be my first tractor, I don't know how important independent PTO is. Most brands still feature live PTO. In day to day use, will the NH's independent PTO end up making a big difference in ease of use or do I lump it together with the cruise control, tilt and beer-can holder?

As long as you like both tractor layouts after operating them and still had to decide the independent pto would definately get my vote. I have both independent and live pto models and the live pto is more trouble to use.

 

[BoonDoc]

As long as you like both tractor layouts after operating them and still had to decide the independent pto would definately get my vote. I have both independent and live pto models and the live pto is more trouble to use.

Noted. Thanks!

 

[madmax12]

As long as you like both tractor layouts after operating them and still had to decide the independent pto would definately get my vote. I have both independent and live pto models and the live pto is more trouble to use.

If u already explained this, I apologize. I have only experienced Pto on the max and in tractor trailer pump situations. Max is live, I believe, with a clutch. And the trucks, I think, r the same. They have a switch, but u press clutch before engaging and before disengaging. Pressing clutch would relieve "stress/tension" and (I thought) be less harsh on Pto "stuff" both on the tractor and the implement.

I thought there was a recent thread about the independent/lack of clutch utilizing a clutch break, and the poster was concerned at how much tension that put on the tractor and implement.

It's a question, not an opinion. Any insight would be appreciated.

 

[BoonDoc]

It's my understanding that a two stage live pto uses a single pedal that when depressed half way disengages the transmission. Depressed further, the pto is disengaged. One pedal sounds simple. Reading further, I saw that independent pto Uses a separate clutch or on/off selector. Two pedals That the pto is independent of the tranny sounds similar to my JD lawn tractor mid pto mower engagement lever. Similar? Regardless, on paper, Both sound easy. What exactly makes the independent easier for day to day use?

 

[MrWhippy]

On my WM 55 (which I believe is considered independent PTO), you can engage and disengage the PTO while the tractor is moving. Very handy for mowing and PTO driven manure spreaders.

 

[madmax12]

It's my understanding that a two stage live pto uses a single pedal that when depressed half way disengages the transmission. Depressed further, the pto is disengaged. One pedal sounds simple. Reading further, I saw that independent pto Uses a separate clutch or on/off selector. Two pedals That the pto is independent of the tranny sounds similar to my JD lawn tractor mid pto mower engagement lever. Similar? Regardless, on paper, Both sound easy. What exactly makes the independent easier for day to day use?

When I test drove the LS 27hp, independent PTO -- same motor as Max 28 -- (new holland is same tractor, I think), it had only the "electric" switch. No clutch at all.
The Max 28, even though it is an HST, still has a clutch. It's two uses, that I know of, are to start the tractor, and to engage/disengage the pto. I could be wrong, but since it is an HST, I am not aware of the clutch use regarding the transmission.

 

[madmax12]

On my WM 55 (which I believe is considered independent PTO), you can engage and disengage the PTO while the tractor is moving. Very handy for mowing and PTO driven manure spreaders.

hmm... well, I think, if I press in the clutch on the max28, the LIVE pto would "coast", but I wouldn't expect the transmission to coast. Maybe it would. I'll have to test that out in the future. I have also not tried to disengage the pto switch while moving, with the clutch pressed in. I've never thought about all of that activity at once.