kubota vs. Kioti?

[LD1]

Funny you say this, I wouldn't be apposed to buy a tractor because of its color. However, orange IS my favorite. So it does complement all my Stihl, Echo and Ariens equipment.

Stihl and echo dont have as much orange as dolmar:thumbsup:

 

[TSO]

Not everything is about the bottom line, my wife and I were looking at tractors not long ago and I happen to really like a couple of the bigger New Hollands, upon seeing them my wife announced, "Oh, I don't want a blue tractor", no point in even going to the LS dealer.:laughing:

$11k worth of Kubota orange paint then? Lol

I don't mind orange, but i hate green on a tractor!

 

[KenB2920]

Stihl and echo dont have as much orange as dolmar:thumbsup:

Ok, I am not familiar with Dolmar, so I completely apologize if I am off base. It appears to be more red. If that is the case, I would include my gravely as well. It's orange but has an almost red shade. Next to my old exmark it was clearly orange. If Dolmar is orange I apologize, looking at photos on my little iPhone.

 

[GManBart]

But... As an aside to that, was that the price with Kubota's 0% financing or the cash price? I believe there is a discount if you get your own financing. that was one negative to going with LS over Kioti, LS doesn't offer their own financing, especially the 0% ... although it's a moot point when comparing Kubota and Kioti, since coyote offers 0% also (i believe)

I asked for the cash price when I talked to all the dealers. I figured if I decided to finance, I could shop around for that, and compare with what (if any) the dealer/manufacturer was offering. R,

 

[LD1]

Ok, I am not familiar with Dolmar, so I completely apologize if I am off base. It appears to be more red. If that is the case, I would include my gravely as well. It's orange but has an almost red shade. Next to my old exmark it was clearly orange. If Dolmar is orange I apologize, looking at photos on my little iPhone.

They "call" it red, but IMO, it is orange. Just a darker version than husky/stihl.

 

[KenB2920]

They "call" it red, but IMO, it is orange. Just a darker version than husky/stihl.

An, I can Picture a deeper red color...

 

[94BULLITT]

I have not been on in a Couple days so..........................:laughing:

Also has cruise, tilt steering, rear remote and a 2700 lb loader which the grand does NOT have. Your machine is not worth the 50k they charge.

Mine was not 50K. You know what it cost me. You sent me a PM asking me when I bought it.

LOL... that's funny

---
I completely agree that the HST+ is great tech.. and if I could have it for + $1200 (like the jump I paid from shuttle to HST) Then I'd definitely have a hard time NOT seriously considering the upgrade. Especially after seeing how it works on Ken's L3540. I think it's a great mix, adding the convenience of HST and the rpm throttle benefits of gear. Do I need it? Nope, my HST does just fine. But it is definitely nice, to be sure.

Now BULLITT - besides a transmission upgrade, what features or other considerations are you talking about that somehow makes the Grand L series so much better than the DK... that it makes them NOT comparable? Don't forget that the DK comes with a standard remote, which was a $700 option as quoted to me by my local Kubota dealer. Also, I believe the DK also comes standard with draft control - and not so on the Kubota. (Disclaimer on that... I THINK it's standard on the Kioti... it is on my LS and I want to say the feature set was nearly identical when I was shopping).

Regarding the loaders... Kubota has more loader options to offer than Kioti, so you have to make sure you compare them fairly. If shopping between the DK50/L4740 for example --- the Kioti 401 loader is very closely spec'd to the Kubota LA854 loader.

MAX LIFT AT PINS, full height: Kub=2443 Kioti=2761. BREAKOUT AT PINS: Kub=3774 Kioti=3727. So it's very close indeed. Would the extra 318# of loader lift matter to anyone? Well, it's a big factor for me. My LS lifts 2638#, and I use every bit of that at times. For other guys, that may never be an issue.

SO - WHEN IT ALL COMES DOWN TO IT... if the point of this thread is just "Kioti vs Kubota" then I think we can all say they're very close, with minor spec details favoring each one in different ways, for certain tractors. The "quality" argument is nearly moot, as they are both great tractors with excellent build & support quality. It's a whole different agrument when it comes down to what each specific person needs when shopping. I personally know that Ken shopped Kioti too, and compared the cab models of the DK vs GrandL... so his reviews are very qualified. I think he found them to be very comparable, but he liked the ergonomics of the Kubota better, and felt it had better fit & finish. While I might not agree on the "fit & finish" part, we also like different auto manufacturers products than each other too, so it ends up being just as much a "Ford vs Chevy" type argument (or in our case GM vs Toyota) than anything else... which we all know doesn't really matter because people buy whatever they want to buy anyhow!

lol... there, I just woke up and finished my 2nd cup of coffee too

I think the whole tractor is better. I had a Bobcat Ct235. It would not hold a candle to a L3540. The motor vibrated so much the fenders shook like a Harley. The opperators platform was well insulated so the operator did not feel much of it. The motor was louder than a Grand L or a Regular L and it sucked fuel. The Grand L is quiet and smooth running. I think once you add a Cab it sets the Grand L farther apart from a Kioti. The Kioti does not have auto throttle advance either. The seat on the Kubota rotates 15*, has arms rests and it reclines. The cylinders on the 3PH are external. I think the loader is nicer on the Kubota and the lines are hidden. You can get a optional TNT and 3rd function. I used to think there was nothing like the Bobcat til I got the Kubota.

I say buy the tractor that you like. I looked at Kioti but the dealer closed before I was ready to buy and prices weren't different than the Kubota tractors. As stated above the DK is in between the standard L and Grand L so it makes it hard for a direct dollar for dollar comparison. At the time Kioti's website sucked and the dealer had no clue if I could get a front mount snow blower. Since then two other Kioti dealers popped up then dropped the line. Now it seams like the dealers are much more stable. But once I had the HST+ explained to me so I understood it's value I lost interest in Kioti (and other brands). It's too bad that the EPA has bumped up the price of the Grand L tractors with the tier V requirements. Has Kioti started using tier V engines in their CUTs yet?

I think when you by a tractor you should look were your 2nd closest dealer is in case your dealer goes out of business.

I will soon have a Kubota engine in my Ventrac.4500 series

Don't get bit by the Kubota bug

I use it with my QH and all my implements save Brush hog are on wheels. So just wheel them to the machine lift up, lock down, connect PTO if used and go!

You are smart and got a QH. The telescopic lift arms and stabilzers and rear 3PH control are pretty much meaningless with it. They should come standard on a tractor. I just open the rear window and latch.

Another TBN member described to me how he uses a slotted piece of PVC pipe through his back glass to adjust the 3PH to help him hook up and save a trip around the side. I am use to improvising and regularly use canes, crutches, grabbers, sticks etc. to accomplish things so since Kubota doesn't offer the lever, there is a way around it. Agreed it could be handy for some and a great option, I just don't see me using one.

Post #73 contains a pretty good explanation, but it may not count as I have never "seen" one in person, apparently a significant point to some.

I have always thought the perfect tractor for me would be something along the lines of a JoKuoti hybrid or something like it.

In regards to draft control, I like it and my son doesn't, we have it on our M8540, cost will determine if I get it.

Before I got my QH I would stand on the lift arm and raise or lower it through the rear window.

6 is too much.

Where you are switching between 2 ranges I will be using one.

I'm totally not getting the math here. I shopped most of the big brands before I narrowed it down to LS and Kioti and simply didn't see how the math even remotely worked on Kubota. I just priced out an L4740 Hydro on their website, because it was the closest in specs to my LS, and it still makes me shake my head. Both 3,800lb tractors, with around 40hp at the PTO, lift capacity of around 2500lbs to full height on the loader, with dual rear remotes, rear work lights, QA buckets, R4 tires, similar warranty (by extending the Kubota warranty), etc, etc....as apples-to-apples as possible.

My LS was $21,500 delivered (Kioti was another thousand). The Kubota website comes up with $39,500, and everybody says to expect paying 85% of that, which is $33,500. I don't have the exact number the local Kubota dealer quoted me, but it was right around there...$32K or $32.5K....something like that.

Seriously, $11K more for similar capabilities? HST+ is nice and all, but I'm not seeing an extra 50%+ in cash outlay for it.

The thing I don't understand is how one company can sell a tractor for $11,000 less than another and still make the same quality product.

 

[TSO]

I think the whole tractor is better. I had a Bobcat Ct235. It would not hold a candle to a L3540. The motor vibrated so much the fenders shook like a Harley. The opperators platform was well insulated so the operator did not feel much of it. The motor was louder than a Grand L or a Regular L and it sucked fuel. The Grand L is quiet and smooth running. I think once you add a Cab it sets the Grand L farther apart from a Kioti. The Kioti does not have auto throttle advance either. The seat on the Kubota rotates 15*, has arms rests and it reclines. The cylinders on the 3PH are external. I think the loader is nicer on the Kubota and the lines are hidden. You can get a optional TNT and 3rd function. I used to think there was nothing like the Bobcat til I got the Kubota.


The thing I don't understand is how one company can sell a tractor for $11,000 less than another and still make the same quality product.

Being that I have no personal interest regarding the success or sales volume of either Tractor Company... I think I can take a pretty objective and open position regarding this topic. I'm going to play devils advocate and evaluate a few of your statements.

First off, "i think the whole tractor is better." I don't know how you can quantify this statement, it sounds like nothing but opinion and hyperbole.

You compare a ct235 to the l3540. That's pretty silly, they are not even in the same ballpark. The ct235 (Kioti ck35) compares more closely with the B series from Kubota.

You mention the better seat in the cab model, that reclines, swivels 15# and tilts, not to mention has arm rests. Now, I've sat in your exact same seat on Ken's tractor. its nice, definitely an upgrade over my basic suspension seat. I'm curious to know what dollar amount you would place on that specific seat. I agree that while it's a wonderful option, it has no bearing on overall quality.

You mention the external 3pt lift cylinders... in practice, I really don't see the advantage. I think it clutters up the rear a bit, it doesn't add any more lift, and I haven't noticed any other manufacturers doing this. All of that doesn't mean that I know anything about how it truly operates, but as a lay person I can't see any benefits that would justify the cost increase. Remember, we are trying to compare apples to apples... if you can explain what it does so much better than a standard 3 point lift, I'm all ears.

Finally, you suggest that it must be better, because it costs $11000 more than the Kioti. Though I'm assuming you must have been kidding when you made that statement, I might as well address it for the sake of discussion. Was the Lincoln Mark LT pickup truck any better in real life than a comparable F 150, even though it cost roughly $8 thousand more? Besides a couple interior elements and exterior pieces, is a Cadillac Escalade $12k better than a loaded up Avalanche? I'm sure we could all easily come up with a myriad examples of how this logic is flawed. Shoot, my LS is identical to the New Holland boomer 50, except that LS uses their own loader which is about 30% stronger than the New Holland version. But, my LS cost about 25% less because my stickers & decals don't say new Holland. Did i lose nearly $7000 of sticker quality?

 

[KenB2920]

94BULLITT,

Alot of valid points and I do want to comment on a few.

A). I agree, telescoping arms are pointless with a quick hitch. I hope to have one sooner than later. In the mean time they do naturally help. I would seriously love a quick hitch though. It would save alot of kicking to my lift arms.

B) I literally just had a friend leave and he commented on how quiet my tractor was. Granted it wasn't running wide open. I also don't know how other tractors sound when running at full bore

C) I use my seat swivel all the time and I forgot to mention that. It's another thing you don't know how nice it is until you don't have it. Just the little bit it turns is nice. Does any other manufacture have this? Along with tilt and arm rests? Obviously I am still driving a tractor and on rough ground you still feel bumps. However, when all is well its VERY comfortable.

D) you mentioned Harley so I have to run with this. 1) why do Harley's cost more than the competitors? I had a Harley and loved it. Some others drive motorcycles and they say "well it looks just like a Harley". Maybe Kiotis look like Kubotas . JK. I had to go there.

 

[k0ua]

I use my seat swivel all the time and I forgot to mention that. It's another thing you don't know how nice it is until you don't have it. Just the little bit it turns is nice. Does any other manufacture have this?

Yes that is a nice feature, my old New Holland TC33da had that feature.