Tractor Sizing Kubota L3800 -vs- L4600 For Stumping Etc.

   / Kubota L3800 -vs- L4600 For Stumping Etc. #1  

Konabrian

New member
Joined
Aug 21, 2013
Messages
8
Location
Burlington, VT
Tractor
Massey Ferguson 1635
We own about 35 acres here in VT and the wife has a LONG list of work to be done, once we choose the proper sized tractor with a backhoe.

I have some close-in work to be done around the house such as removing old porch posts to set new ones deeper, excavate along the foundation on one side to install a gutter drain, excavate along another side of the foundation all the way to the footings to re-seal a leaky basement and add drainage.

We do a lot of firewood so I have to get up into the woods to bring out cut firewood, make some small access roads, push around piles of rocks etc.

We'll be digging to plant trees for landscaping and ditching along the driveways and around our pond to help dry things out.

Finally, we want to cut and stump a few acres to open up a pasture for critters.

What I am told is the 3800 is better for close in work on the foundation and will be fine for everything except possibly the larger stumping.

So, I am looking for opinions on this from people that have actually done it. The price difference is a little over $10K so I don't want to purchase the bigger one if it's not required.

We've thought of doing the manageable stumping and leave the monsters for last and hire that out.

Thanks in advance!

Brian
 
   / Kubota L3800 -vs- L4600 For Stumping Etc. #2  
The L3800 would be fine for close in work, but with 35 acres of stoney Vermont soil and the development you have outlined the L4600's 46-hp and 3,200 pounds + four wheel drive are the minimum power, weight and drive force you need.

My B3300SU is 33-hp, 4-WD. My soil is rock free, Florida sandy-loam. Most of my work is in woods, tree related.
Thirty-three horsepower is insuffecient for over 3" diameter stumping here; thirty-eight horsepower will not be sufficient for stumping in The Granite State.

Most tractor "newbies" think they want a backhoe initially, research usually changes their mind. Backhoes are expensive, heavy and awkward to mount and dismount. For L4600 mounting or dismounting backhoe will require two strong people.

Tractors are PULLING machines; you pull implements on the three point hitch. With a backhoe mounted, the three point hitch is not available. You can buy four or five $ implements for what one $$$$$ backhoe costs. Far too many backhoes spend 95% of the time sitting in the garage, off the tractor.

However, people who operate backhoes on a CONTINUING basis sing their praises. Excavating stumps is a prime Backhoe job.

If you have been reading here long, you realize that that a Front End Loader (FEL) is the most useful tractor option. Probably 90% of T-B-N contributors have them. The only reason NOT to order a FEL is if order is for is a second tractor, especially a tractor for crop work, when the first tractor has an FEL.

Work on the manageable stumps. When you have done those you can have an Excavator or Construction Grade TLB (Tractor/Loader/Backhoe) come in for the larger stumps. You may be able to ditch with a Sub-Soiler opening the ground, then excavating with the FEL bucket and toothbar. If not, have Excavator do the one-time ditching along the driveway.

Here is my opening list of attachments, just four to start:

FEL

Bucket Toothbar for limited digging and brush removal.

Fred Cain Subsoiler (claw) for ripping around stumps and gutter installation; ditching prep.

Log Skidding Guard

(Fifth would be a "thumb" for the bucket. Sixth a Box Blade.)

Not an attachment but necessary: 5/16" grab hooks on bucket, plus 8' + 12', Grade 70, 5/16" chain, Grade 70 slip hook on one end, Grade 70 grab hook on the other end. So called Logging Chains are essential for stump removal and woods work.

You have not mentioned your driveway. What surface, how long?

Can you ignite burn pile(s) in Vermont or will you have to transport debris?

Why not post your wife's outside project list?

http://www.wrlonginc.com/stb.htm

Fred Cain Tractor 3 Point Hitch Subsoiler S-2

http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200335943_200335943

http://greens-machine.com

http://www.lsuagcenter.com/NR/rdonl...45263BDD8/11557/pub2917tractorimplements1.pdf


THERE IS NOTHING WRONG WITH A SECOND HAND, DIESEL, TRACTOR-LOADER.
 

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   / Kubota L3800 -vs- L4600 For Stumping Etc. #3  
For 35 acres, I would want as big as I could afford.

In close work with a backhoe sucks, no matter how but. The L3800 will do everything you mentioned. Even digging out stumps. BUT...the 4600 will be faster.

BUT, for the amount of BH work you describe, I'd be looking at a TLB, like the L45, or deere 110. They have WAY more power on the hoe, more lift capacity up front, and more weight.
 
   / Kubota L3800 -vs- L4600 For Stumping Etc. #4  
i was thinking he needs to go ahead an jump up to a mx5100.itll be all the tractor he needs an more.but i dont know how tight of an area he will be working in.
 
   / Kubota L3800 -vs- L4600 For Stumping Etc. #5  
Remember, this is a tractor novice.

You are both recommending pretty large, intimidating, equipment for a tractor novice.
 
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   / Kubota L3800 -vs- L4600 For Stumping Etc. #6  
Can't go wrong with either! I almost bought a L4600. My bro-n-law has one a loves it.

We have 400 acres and I bought a L3800DT a while back. Great tractor! Love it! :D

Sure, I could use a larger one sometimes, but the L3800 does not ever let me down. I like the smaller size for logging in the woods. I process 15-20 cords of oak a year and supply my brother's sawmill with logs.

I could use a backhoe a couple times a year, but I don't want to own one.
 
   / Kubota L3800 -vs- L4600 For Stumping Etc. #7  
Many people doing firewood have found that using a grapple, or forklift forks to bring out long sections works better than bucking where you fell the tree. I drop them, sometimes cut them into two or three big pieces, and then carry those large sections to where I buck them down for loading (I'm giving away most of the wood at this point). My tractor is heavier, and has roughly 1,000lbs more loader capacity, and it's still not close to being too big. Tractors magically shrink when you bring them home.

For the prices you're looking at, I'd also consider something new....there are some brands offering great deals now, and others have zero percent financing (or very low rates) that might put you into a new machine for around the same as what you're looking at now. The nice thing there is that they come with a warranty.
 
   / Kubota L3800 -vs- L4600 For Stumping Etc. #8  
Welcome aboard Vermonter!
How is that UVM football team doing?

When I graduated in 1973 they started on a long undefeated record.

Anyways - about tractors

We own about 35 acres here in VT and the wife has a LONG list of work to be done, once we choose the proper sized tractor with a backhoe.
Is is flat? Swampy? Hilly? All 3?
pics help.
IMG_0424.jpg
Or like mine near Stowe, all of the above.

I have some close-in work to be done around the house such as removing old porch posts to set new ones deeper, excavate along the foundation on one side to install a gutter drain, excavate along another side of the foundation all the way to the footings to re-seal a leaky basement and add drainage.
For that I'd suggest renting a mini-ex.

We do a lot of firewood so I have to get up into the woods to bring out cut firewood, make some small access roads, push around piles of rocks etc.
What weight do you envision LIFTING vs dragging? Compare that to the specs on the tractor FEL. One of my specs for my second tractor was able to lift a 10' log on the 3pt, about a ton. (Overshot - lifts 2 tons on the 3pt and 1 ton on the FEL)
We'll be digging to plant trees for landscaping and ditching along the driveways and around our pond to help dry things out.
How deep (vertical) do you need to go? Planting trees may be better done with a posthole digger (PHD).

Finally, we want to cut and stump a few acres to open up a pasture for critters.
What's a "few" 2 or 20? A dozer can take care of them quickly.

You don't mention one of the things Vermont is famous for - it's frozen precipitation from October to May and the length of your driveway.

If $$ are a concern I'd suggest focus on renting a mini-ex if logistically feasible and getting other implements, such as a snowblower, log-arch, PHD, pallet-forks, sawmill, trailer, tiller etc. instead of a backhoe. A backhoe and bucket runs about $8K and is nowhere as versatile as a rented mini-ex. And that is about the list price difference between a L3800 and an MX4700/5100.

Stumping with a backhoe is FUN. But there are many less expensive methods.

Are you buying new or used? A good used machine can save big $$$ over new if you can take time to search for a deal. A lot of people buy tractors that are "too small" and move up, selling the small one.

And also - Why Kubota? Kioti makes a heavier tractor for about the same price/performance range.

In summary I suggest you price out mini-ex rental and what experienced operators are charging for land clearing. A backhoe on a tractor has no where near the range of motion of a mini-ex. I bought my backhoe because I want to do trail maintenance and ditching half a mile in from where I can park a trailer.

For the tractor bigger is better. Look for something w/ at least 40HP able to lift a ton on the 3pt.

Good luck!
 
   / Kubota L3800 -vs- L4600 For Stumping Etc. #9  
Check out T-B-N box "Similar Threads" at bottom of this page. There are five L4600 threads.
 
   / Kubota L3800 -vs- L4600 For Stumping Etc. #10  
FWIW, I have a L3700SU. This would be comparable to the L3800. All in all it is a decent, no frills machine. I'm somewhat disappointed in the loader lift ability and my BH pin broke 30 minutes into its first stump, causing catastrophic damage and replacement of the BH. ( under warranty) the3 point hitch is jerky as all ****, as are most. But it is what it is. Stumping with the BH77 is not fast by any stretch of the imagination. For example, last week I had to remove 2 pine trees from the edge of my driveway. Had I cut them and dug the stumps with the BH.. Each one would have taken over a hour. Instead, I bent them over with my skidsteer and then lifted the stump/root ball straight up. Took about 10 minutes total. A mini ex would have been even faster.
 
 
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