Metal or plastic body?

[colwelltn]

Being the owner of an old Massey-Ferguson TO-35 and having numerous small accidents with it including having a fallen tree limb come up and bend the fender just the other day, I am not going to spend $30,000 for a tractor that I have to replace a fender or hood because it is plastic. The repair was easy and I fixed it with a pry bar. It is a tractor and I can care less what it looks like and do not have to spend hundreds of dollars when something like this happens that is not planned. The operator on the tractor when this happened owns a JD 4130 and had a hay bale fall out of the bucket and land on his plastic hood. Instead of paying $400 for a new hood, he now has a piece of sheet metal over the hole, and painted JD green, but still looks pathetic in my opinion. I know the world has changed a lot in the last 50 years since my old tractor was built, but instead of buying a JD with a plastic hood for my new 50 HP tractor, I will be buying a Mahindra which is less expensive, also built in India and assembled less than 50 miles from here, has a metal hood and fenders, a five year warranty, and is less expensive. Now the only problem is keeping it from fading to a pretty pink color over the years, but again, not really concerned with the look of the tractor. Make it safe, reliable, and owner maintainable.

 

[TSO]

Ok so your great grandpa is 100 years old now and still has a tractor he bought new when he was 25. Would you rather have a collector made of heavy metal that can be restored or old brittle plastic? Nough said. LOL!

However, sadly... yesterday's metal tractor hoods aren't anything like today's metal tractor hoods. Sheet metal everywhere seems to be getting thinner each year, tractors, trucks, etc.

I am firmly in the metal camp, but I wish the metal hood and fenders on my tractor were thicker. I would have gladly paid slightly more for heavier sheet metal.

 

[RPW]

If your not concerned about appearance why care about plastic? As you said your friends plastic repair looked pathetic. Seems contradictive.

 

[drizler]

Don't fool yourself into thinking all those old tractors had real nice solid steel hoods. I fixed one up on an old late 40's JD for a kid once. Whatever that thing was it wasn't aluminum and it wasn't steel. I guess you could call it pot metal as that's what it looked like. Whatever, it wasn't anything to brag about for the sake of being Green. I remember reading something about Fergusons once being made of old recycled bomber engines and such. Mine is solid steel being a 50 but I bet there are a lot of them out there that are or were a mix of whatever was handy.

 

[GManBart]

Being the owner of an old Massey-Ferguson TO-35 and having numerous small accidents with it including having a fallen tree limb come up and bend the fender just the other day, I am not going to spend $30,000 for a tractor that I have to replace a fender or hood because it is plastic. The repair was easy and I fixed it with a pry bar. It is a tractor and I can care less what it looks like and do not have to spend hundreds of dollars when something like this happens that is not planned. The operator on the tractor when this happened owns a JD 4130 and had a hay bale fall out of the bucket and land on his plastic hood. Instead of paying $400 for a new hood, he now has a piece of sheet metal over the hole, and painted JD green, but still looks pathetic in my opinion. I know the world has changed a lot in the last 50 years since my old tractor was built, but instead of buying a JD with a plastic hood for my new 50 HP tractor, I will be buying a Mahindra which is less expensive, also built in India and assembled less than 50 miles from here, has a metal hood and fenders, a five year warranty, and is less expensive. Now the only problem is keeping it from fading to a pretty pink color over the years, but again, not really concerned with the look of the tractor. Make it safe, reliable, and owner maintainable.

To a certain degree the plastic parts will take dings and dents and not show any damage (except maybe to the paint). Beyond that they can certainly crack/split/etc, but which event happens more frequently...the big hits, or small dings? I don't know that there's a perfect answer, and my Massey has pretty solid sheet metal, but there might be some good applications for plastic.

 

[fieldman12]

I agree that plastic in a hail storm will survive no problems compared to metal. I also agree about the corn heads using plastic (poly) is the way to go. You don't have to paint them after harvest also and I agree they are much more gentle on the corn. I am sure you are aware flex heads for beans, wheat etc. often use the poly underneath the head at all the wear spots. You simple replace the poly when it gets thin. We have ruined corn snouts though before but not often if the poly was gouged into the ground. I think the poly is a much better material than what the Deere hoods are made out of. I think everyone will eventually be more accepting of plastic hoods once they work out the get brittle and break issues. As another person posted on this message board they seem to break allot of times at hinge points. I have seen 5000 Deeres with the paint peeling off the plastic fenders. Really it all depends on the material they use and how they paint it and the thickeness in my opinion.

Twenty years ago we paid $18k for tooling to form the metal snouts on our new born head and the next year $250k for a plastic mold for the next gen. Yes, vacuum mold would have been cheap but you don't vacuum form a plastic that will take the beating of corn cobs being smashed against them. We tried literally hundreds of compounds optimizing the plastic - minimize corn damage compared to steel, minimize corn loss by cushioning the cobs so they don't bounce out of the corn head like with steel, lighter weight so the combine could lift adding 4 more rows.

And since my last post on this thread I got caught in a fast developing hail storm with what I later found reported as up to 4 1/2 inch hailstones. Hood, half of the roof, and trunk lid all dented. Plastic and glass no damage. The hood on my car is stiffer than the steel hood on my Kubota tractor. I suspect that my steel hooded Kubota would have been dented in that storm while my plastic hooded Kubota would not have seen any damage. That's just a guess - I would not want to go through a storm like that again.

 

[fieldman12]

As far as plastic being quiter in some cases yes and some no. Seems like the thinner and more brittle the plastic the louder it is. Also if noise is a concern I have seen on metal and plastic hoods a foam insulation glued to the under side in spots. If this was a big worry a guy could do more of the underside. It also depends on the engine and muffler setup. Seems like our 3 cylinder tractors are allot more louder than our 4 cylinder engines.

Interesting discussion. I think that each has their advantages. As for cost of production who cares. That's not my problem. I want a tractor that is reliable and still has value after I'm finished with it. Is metal really easier and cheaper to fix vs. just going and buying a new hood? I like the fact that my 4410 hood and fenders have the color molded right in. I also like the fact that plastic absorbs more of the sound and makes for a quieter machine.

 

[drizler]

Back around 1990 GM had one of it's few good ideas in decades. Plastic body panels. Here in rust country they are the greatest thing that ever happened. Nothing will take the beating they do and they fix far easier than sheet metal. I found also that they hold paint far better as well for some reason. The best part is that they don't degrade over time in the constant slop of road salt . As they make metal panels thinner and harder they rust out all the faster. Granted galvanizing inhibits it somewhat but still they don't hold a candle to plastic panels. Like all good ideas though they went away, probably due to weight / mileage / epa considerations so we are back to paper thin super hardened steel.
In the FWIW department I just discovered a number of dent removal methods not requiring repainting (hopefully). Google / Utube them up if you have any shallow dings you hate to look at on your tractor hood. You would (as I was) be very surprised at how effective a hair dryer can be in removing / reducing dents. I see they had some very interesting plastic repair videos on there as well. I haven't tried any but a couple of those seem to be quite effective. I did notice one where you prep with a V as in steel welding and then sprinkle on a powder or tiny pellets. THen you spread the goo over them and they melt down chemically. Who knows if it is some grand solution to plastic cracking but it does look interesting.
For a long time the car manufacturers have glued many body panels on rather than weld. Whatever it is seems to do the job very very well. Fusor is the company that makes similar products for auto restoration . Good stuff but not cheap.

 

[fieldman12]

In my opinion I would like to see more cars with plastic body panels for the very reason they don't rust. I know the plastic panels on the Saturns seemed to be pretty good. I am not sure why they have not got it right on tractors yet. Still though for the most part tractors rusting is really not an issue unless you just plain abuse your tractor.

Back around 1990 GM had one of it's few good ideas in decades. Plastic body panels. Here in rust country they are the greatest thing that ever happened. Nothing will take the beating they do and they fix far easier than sheet metal. I found also that they hold paint far better as well for some reason. The best part is that they don't degrade over time in the constant slop of road salt . As they make metal panels thinner and harder they rust out all the faster. Granted galvanizing inhibits it somewhat but still they don't hold a candle to plastic panels. Like all good ideas though they went away, probably due to weight / mileage / epa considerations so we are back to paper thin super hardened steel.
In the FWIW department I just discovered a number of dent removal methods not requiring repainting (hopefully). Google / Utube them up if you have any shallow dings you hate to look at on your tractor hood. You would (as I was) be very surprised at how effective a hair dryer can be in removing / reducing dents. I see they had some very interesting plastic repair videos on there as well. I haven't tried any but a couple of those seem to be quite effective. I did notice one where you prep with a V as in steel welding and then sprinkle on a powder or tiny pellets. THen you spread the goo over them and they melt down chemically. Who knows if it is some grand solution to plastic cracking but it does look interesting.
For a long time the car manufacturers have glued many body panels on rather than weld. Whatever it is seems to do the job very very well. Fusor is the company that makes similar products for auto restoration . Good stuff but not cheap.

 

[Tompet]

However, sadly... yesterday's metal tractor hoods aren't anything like today's metal tractor hoods. Sheet metal everywhere seems to be getting thinner each year, tractors, trucks, etc.

I am firmly in the metal camp, but I wish the metal hood and fenders on my tractor were thicker. I would have gladly paid slightly more for heavier sheet metal.

I was reading through thread and thinking the same as this TSO comment.

I've used old ferguson fender as a foot hold to reach out and over for something on a shelf or crawled over hood...wouldn't even think to do that with a new tractor as it would result in bent fender or hood.