Buying Advice Pros and Cons on equipment

   / Pros and Cons on equipment #41  
Fun to read what some of the recommendations are and realizing what it will all cost. There isn't one machine that will do everything, but the full sized loader backhoe (TLB) is probably the closest to being able to do most anything productively. Especially if you get a tool carrier (TC) front loader. Being able to take off the front bucket and put on pallet forks, or a grapple is what makes it the most versatile and productive tool out there. With your budget of $25,000 grand, you should be able to find a decent, low hour machine in 2 wheel drive and an open cab. For the least amount of headaches and time repairing it, the lower the hours the better. Most rental yards sell their machines before they hit 2,000 hours. Anything under that is still in great shape. With proper care and good maintenance, you can get to 6 to 8,000 hours without any major problems. You sure don't want to buy a machine with 6,000 hours on it because it's nearing the end of it's productive lifespan and the repairs will start happening more and more often.

Ideally you would want 4 wheel drive and an enclosed cab. The 4 wheel drive option is what I really need more then a cab because it might be several days after a big rain that I just can't operate mine. The mud is too much, but my neighbor with a newer version of the same tractor that I have has 4 wheel drive and he's out there the day after a big rain while I'm just sitting.

The second tractor you will need will be for mowing and any type of field work that you want to do. The price will be based on how much HP you want, the extras you want and how new it is. I run a 6 ft bush hog with a 35hp 4x4 open cab tractor. It's a bit small for this, but I"m fairly flat and I maintain my trails and fields fairly often. I should have bought a 45 hp tractor, but mine gets it done, and I didn't have the money for a bigger tractor.

Once you move there, you'll need a small mower for around the house, so that's all I would buy to get started. Then take your time looking around and talking to people. Find out who is the best dealer to work with and go with that brand. There is very little difference in the brand you buy from when comparing similar HP and age.

As for the barn/storage building you want to build, let the contractor do all the dirt work. It's not something you want to learn how to do, or live with the results if you don't get the soil compacted properly.

Avoid buying a dozer unless you really need one. They are great for spreading dirt. For taking out trees, I've found that the backhoe is the best single tool for this. I can take out any sized tree with it, then pick it up and carry it to my burn pile without very little mess. The dozer tears everything up and twists all the trees together. Getting them to the burn pile means pushing them through the dirt, which means you get as much dirt on the pile as you do trees. I have a rake on my blade, but that just means a small reduction in the amount of dirt the trees are pushing. Overall, using a dozer to clear land takes twice as long as using the backhoe. An excavator would be even better, but they are too slow and moving material to the burn pile so you either have to burn close to where you are clearing or have something else to move the trees.

Eddie
 
   / Pros and Cons on equipment #42  
We own a valley with a stream running down it, house sits right above the stream (above the 100 year flood point). Limestone bluffs blend with the trees behind the house and across the valley, bottom of the valet is meadow. There is a cave behind the house with a lake in it which supplies the water for the house and pool. It is incredibly quiet at night (except in the summer, when the tree frogs and katydids make quite the chorus). In the winter you can just about touch the stairs! Living in Maine have you been seeing the aurora lately? I would expect that the recent solar storm would give an awesome display

I didn't see the solar storm but friends did and some got beautiful pictures .We love where we live as we get the wonderful sounds and see moose , bear , dear , fox , etc . etc . .
 
   / Pros and Cons on equipment
  • Thread Starter
#43  
Hi Eddie:
Thanks for the heads up on the tool carrier, will put it on the wish list - do you know if this is available with a 4-way bucket? If the bucket comes off I wonder if one might add a mulched attachment? The power Co has been using one for ROW clearance, it does a real nice job with no burn pile left behind. This would also work to release areas where trees have been planted prior to crown closure.

Steve
 
   / Pros and Cons on equipment
  • Thread Starter
#44  
Dave:
Yes, it is much more rural, our nearest neighbor is a bail bondsman, (hope to not see her professionally) about a half mile away. Fortunately we live in a smaller community here in Calif, but nothing like we are moving to. I look forward to clearing some walking trails, we can walk most of the day without leaving the place. I have a DR field and brush mower back there that works well for trails, pro is it is very maneuverable and can work well under trees and will digest stuff up to ~2" in diameter, con is you have to walk behind it and are uncomfortably close to the action when you hit a hornet's nest (experience speaking...). Living in Main you folks take winter much more seriously than we do here in Calif!
 
   / Pros and Cons on equipment #45  
700 acres spread across 3 different properties with approx 5 miles between them...

cash/crop if you are not already doing so. the open fields you currently have. and let the local farmers do there thing with the given acreage. the good farmer, is going to spray for stuff in the fields, mow 1 to 3 times a year over all. around each given field. and you get some income with no work on your part. beyond dealing with renting the land out.

5 miles ok not real big deal. but it means driving the tractor on the road, trying to trailer equipment back and forth, you spend more time loading/unloading than anything else. vs time it would of taken just to drive tractor to given area. it also not the distance from each area, but your talking a couple miles easy on each property most likely, to drive around / through it, pending on the path ways. track units are good, but on roads, were ya driving a lot on the roads *big frown* a regular ag / R1 tire tractor will do you so much better and cheaper long run.

you will be looking at multi units. but to get you going i would look more into a TLB (tractor loader backhoe) in the 45HP to 90hp range. and more to the point backhoe needs to come off, to allow access to a 3pt hitch. a grabbel for FEL (front end loader) and/or a thumb for backhoe.
---you get a lot of "industrial" TLB for commercial work, but the backhoe does not come off, for access to a 3pt hitch. they normally all have a cab on them, with bare min heat, maybe a/c but hard saying if it works or not if buying used. if ya go over to agirculature and get away from industrial units) then the backhoes do come off with access to a 3pt hitch.
---when ya cross over into agirculature units, some do come with cabs and some that do not come with cabs. with amount of work you want to do, i would suggest a cab be a high priority. when it is early spring, to late fall. and your out and about with just the tractor and the rain starts in and yo don't have a cab. the cold you end up having and the doctor bills starting gong up. to spring/summer and dealing with dust and pollen / allergies. to winter and even if the heater does not work, and you have a cab, the cab keeps the bloody wind off you, that alone is night and day difference.
---stay away from track units for first tractor, tracks bring in a whole new set of overall costs / maintenance and knowledge you need to have to maintain and to check the tracks, that and you will most likely be driving on township/county/state roads, were it may be illegal to drive on road with metal tracts. the metal tears things up, not to mention wears the tracts down.
---standard 2wd drive tractor can do a lot of things. 4x4 / MFWD can help ya get through some areas, if you are doing FEL (front end loader work), dealing with hills / mud / snow it can be a nice thing to have to keep you going.
---pending on local laws, it may be illegal to drive tractor on road with chains on the tractor tires. in which case you may be forced more or less to seek a 4x4 / MFWD if need be to keep you going in winter, to wet springs and falls and getting through mud.
---to note it you don't need 4x4 / MFWD, to state it in a different way...if you need 4x4 / MFWD to get around, it is to stinking muddy to begin with, and all you are doing is tearing more stuff up (putting ruts in to the ground) that will take more time to fix later on, vs just waiting till things dry up. but it is though wet years, that 4x4 /MFWD shines, and ya gotta get to livestock, or fix something, and nothing will dry up enough to get it done easily.
---suggest getting larger alternator for tractor (a cab should auto come with larger alternator but not always so), if you get an electrical winch (dealing with logs), it means a tractor that gets turned off, will start backup. or needing to jump start the tractor. due to dead battery.
---pushing a bit more for a cab... the upper front work lights, and rear work lights. *awe* i can not live without them. i generally don't run tractor at night, but generally i might run right up into the dark, if it means i can complete a task, and doesn't mean i have to put everything away, bring it all back out, and put it all back away again, the next day. and that is were those lights come in handy, have used them more for "portable lighting" than actually using them while driving the tractor.

3pt hitch stuff.... check out Tractor Attachments And Skid Steer Attachments For Any Tractor Or Skid Steer they give a good amount of text and videos on everything, and should help get you started in figure out what is out there.
--rear blade, possibly a offset rear blade
--box blade
--rotatory cutter (bush hog = brand name), possibly a single deck width of tractor tires, and then a bat wing deck (2 or more decks behind tractor)
--landscaping rake, the old metal garden rake with handle. (manual labor) in the garden. but a much bigger version for the tractor.
--PHD (post hole digger) most likely a down force kit for PHD.
--forks (for pallets and like) though forks for FEL more likely better choice to remove pallets or like off a trailer or out of a truck.
--backhoe with sub-frame, you can get backhoes without sub frames, but you will more likely damage the tractor, as in split it in half (shearing bolts) to destroy the 3pt hitch parts themselves. sub frame adds the extra structural support to keep things together and working like they are suppose to.
-----backhoe buckets, a 6" to 12" trenching bucket, you really do not want a wide bucket, generally there is a min width (to small and mud / dirt never wants to come out),
-----backhoe buckets, the 16 to 36 inch width buckets, are more geared for basement digging, or digging into an area, the FEL (front end loader with general duty bucket) can not dig into easily itself. the backup comes to the resuce with wider bucket, and breaks up the hard compact dirt, to create a pile of dirt, that is much easier to drive into with with FEL. ((been known to make a large pile of dirt with backhoe. grab a bucket full of dirt with backhoe and put it in lock position, and then turn around and load up the FEL with dirt, and drive 1 plus mile. to were i needed to place the dirt. it would be nice to have a dump truck for this to make it even more quicker and cheaper, but does the job, it is not like i need to do this every day or week or month, just when various projects come up that needs dirt brought in, or removed in small amount))
--TNT (top n tilt) replacing the manual turn buckles on the 3pt hitch (1 top link, and 1 or 2 side links) with hyd cylinders. with amount of roads (gravel, dirt, paths) you will most likely have. if time is money, TNT most likely save you cash long run. do you need it no. does it come in handy and make many jobs easier and quicker? yes. it gets rather time consuming getting off tractor adjusting the 3pt hitch linkages, and getting back on tractor. you can only adjust so many times, before your entire day is just eating away by manual adjusting the 3pt hitch linkages.
--carry all. (think mini trailer but connects to 3pt hitch), hey it comes in handy, for a variety of projects, dragging a small little 2 wheel trailer can be a chore, more so backing up on uneven ground (ruts) and having the stupid trailer jack knife on ya constantly. 3pt carry all, toss a gas generator on it, some power tools, maybe a small air compressor, strap the stuff down, attach it to the 3pt on tractor and off you go, with a on the go tool box ((kinda like tool box for a truck, but built for a tractor, and more universal)). have lugged a small generator around the 80 acres here, multi times, for those odd projects, battery operated drills, saws, etc.. only cut it so far.

buckets in general FEL (front end loader bucket) to backhoe buckets....
--one of them should have some teeth on it. for me i prefer backhoe bucket in the larger 20 to 36" width. i generally don't dig that much into fresh new ground with the FEL. and in that rarely have need for a tooth bar on the general duty FEL bucket. but i do a lot of "back dragging" with the generaly duty fel bucket, and for that reason alone "back dragging" i really do not need a tooth bar on the bucket, on other hand a teeth on wider backhoe bucket does come in handy, for those times i need to get through some tougher compacted dirt, it is there to puncture and tear up the compacted dirt. it takes a couple minutes to set out riggers out and deal with backhoe, but once a given project is over it is over. that and, most of the time, if i am moving dirt from one place to another. the place i am moving it to. i end up dumping the dirt and back dragging with general duty FEL bucket. and then run over it a few times with TLB to compact it. not to thrilled having teeth from a FEL bucket tearing up areas i just ran over a few times compacting it....

trailer....
--i would not look for a trailer just to for hauling the tractor. it would be nice to have, but rather, a flat bed trailer, with removal side panels with 2 axles. this is more meant to be a generic trailer to haul stuff (lumber, bricks, twigs from trees that were cut down, pallets of stacked firewood, etc... something in the 12 to 16 foot range.
--you can always get a bigger trailer to haul a bigger tractor on, but when ya get up there in HP (horse power) of a tractor, the overall weight also goes right on up. requiring extra licenses requirements, etc... to deal with a truck that can handle the trailer and tractor on it. by the time you get up there, the trailer itself weighs so much and becomes so long, that it becomes harder to maneuver it into close quarters were you want it, and move stuff off of it / on it. (in the woods / pasture, driving along fence lines in softer mud, etc...) to note it again, with amount of land and distance between properties, you will most likely be driving the tractor on the road, vs ever trying to trailer it back and forth. and if tractor does break down. the local dealer, will have ability to deal with tractor and hauling it, for those hopefully vary rare occasions it needs to be brought back to the dealer for a fix.
--duelies stink, i hate them. granted there nice for commercial vehicle trucks for hauling trailers back and forth for work sites, with heavy loads. but for agriculture work, when ya running the trucks into wet grass, mud and on hills, even with 4x4, you more likely get stuck. ((the 4 tires in back, just float the truck on the ground, and you never get any traction. on pavement ok, but not in grass/mud. with that a generic 1/2 to 3/4 to 1ton truck. with 4 wheels (2 front, 2 rears) and 4x4. for the material handling trailer noted above. granted you could always pull trailer with tractor, but generally, at least with me, it ends up being a 2 person team, and one person on tractor, and another person driving a truck with trailer. when working out in pasture, fence lines, etc...

atv / utv
---a 30 gallon sprayer (to deal with various weeds that you don't want, to spray fence lines and like) there realitvy fast, there small, do not use that much fuel, get into places tractor, truck, etc... most likely not be able to get into. 30 gallon sprayer sounds small, but can go pretty far, for hand wand spot spraying, and when ya run out, of chemicals / water, you can get back to were ever fairly quickly to load backup, and go again. and when ya need to get off, it is a quick easy step, vs trucks and tractors that are abit more complicated. and if you need to leave tractor running to spot spray, ((it is way to easy to hit a lever and have tractor take off on you, been there done that, *shakes head* i do not want to try it again)) just say it gets deadly risky.

skid steers,
---i would stay away from if i was you. they are to slow. MPH (miles per hour) wise. they can be mighty beasts. but more geared for work sites. were distances travel is not very much, and trailer-ed in as needed for specific job.
------------------
for agricultural equipment.... it sells a lot of used stuff but also new stuff shows up. it is a good place to get your feet wet, and learn what is out there and is available.
Used Tractors For Sale at TractorHouse.com: John Deere Tractors, used farm tractors and farm equipment, tractors for sale, Case IH, New Holland, Agco, Kubota

for industrial equipment.... TLB (like what you might see local city/township drive around, dealing with city / town ship up keep), backhoes do not come off. wheel loaders, dozers, etc... mostly commercial work.
Construction Equipment For Sale at MachineryTrader.com: Dozers, Scrapers, Wheel Loaders, Excavators, Motor Graders, Caterpillar, Komatsu, Case, John Deere, Volvo

TractorData.com - information on all makes and models of tractors ... gives very basic info, but used as a tool to compare the basic stuff between tractors.
 
   / Pros and Cons on equipment #46  
i would look for a full sized used backhoe (case 580, jd 310, etc) it would be nice if you can find cab and 4wd, but i wouldn't worry too much. even a older, used full size backhoe will work circle around a new(er) compact tractor with a hoe. AND look for a used CUT 30ish PTO HP (it would be great if you could find one that included implements). you can get your shop space done, the Mother-in-law quarters done, your driveway fixed, and your grass cut you should be able to find both for your $25K budget. you won't be out as much as buying new and if/when you sell them you should be able to get close to your money out of them.

as you figure out more stuff to do, cross projects off your list buy and sell equipment as you see fit
 
   / Pros and Cons on equipment
  • Thread Starter
#47  
Ryan:
Thank you for taking the time to pull together such a well organized discussion! Yes, I was leaning to having a cab with heat / AC - being from southern CA I am not sure how well I will adapt to hours in the sun at 95% humidity or 0 degrees in the winter - probably just fine, but why stress it. Additionally it needs to have ROPS, I will be the poster boy for an inexperienced operator, I would like to survive to becoming an experienced operator! I share your thoughts on tracks, its a new skill to maintain them and running them over the roads for any distance is not going to be popular with the road commissioner. Have started exploring the farm tractor site you provided, lots to learn there, have also been watching eBay - just to see what comes up and what the selling prices are. Great point on bucket width, many have 24" buckets (or wider), I was thinking that something narrower would be more useful for general digging, one probably ends up with a collection. I think 4X4 is a must, both for use in our rolling terrain, cleaning up after an ice storm and for the occasional summer when it just can't figure out how to stop raining. I had noticed that some TLB's were called "farm tractors", I believe these are ones where the backhoe is removable - definitely want that which rules out many of the construction machines.

I had shied away from skid steers due to the concerns with the narrow wheel base and turning over on rough land, was also concerned with the long term reliability of the rubber track equipment also, just looks like something that is going to fail in an expensive way at some point in time.

I the past I have allowed one of the local farmers to cut our fields for free, he got the hay and it kept the field from turning into a brier patch. Unfortunately he has stopped doing this and, a number of fields in the area have gone fallow so it would appear farming may be on the ebb in our area. With the drought out west this may turn around.

I had planned on adding a trailer to the collection, something small to draw a UTV around and something larger for serious hauling, first thing though is to get a truck. My thought was to start with a TLB, then add attachments / pieces as we better understand our needs.

Steve
 
 
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