Buying used? Check for liens

[ipwanab]

Your post gave me chills. I just went through a lien matter on property.I am getting ready to build and my bank did title work before giving me a bridge loan. (This after I argued over the cost of the insurance for the land), anyway the insurer had to rectify the problems before proceeding. In the meantime ( I had no idea how long this would take)I went to my county recorder and asked the person if I could lok at liens.She showed me how and I looked at myself first .Wow every loan I ever had was there ! I was amazed. I then looked up my property in question and the names associated with it and I kind of understood everything but a UCC from Deere for the guy filing the lien. It's amazing the things I have learned here.

 

[jfdlaw]

Sorry I haven't posted anything new on this. I've been working 12-14 hour days and haven't had a chance to spend much time on the computer.

The situation is still up in the air. I think they will probably work out some settlement, but it will cost my friend money. His great deal isn't great anymore. Instead he will probably end up paying (between what he paid the seller and what he's going to pay deere) more than a new tractor would have cost new.

Another thing that came up is that the seller lied about his address. Again this was all done over the phone, and he had his money wired to his bank. The address he provided was across the county line, so that if a title search had been performed, the lien would not have appeared. Deere provided a copy of the filed UCC statement, and it was filed in the adjacent county. I don't believe they filed it with the state.

Before I mentioned you needed to search for liens (both county and state) and run the serial number past a dealer to make sure their system does not show it was stolen. I think you also need to see if the dealer can tell you the address the original owner gave the finance company so that you make sure you search the right county.

As to "bona fide purchaser" rules, that requires that you be a bona fide purchaser without knowledge of the lien. The whole reason people file liens, deeds, mortgages, etc. with the county or state is that this is constructive knowledge. i.e. everyone is deemed to know about the filed records. The burden is place on the individual to perform a diligent search of these public records. The practical problem is where and how to do this search.

I'll let you know more as it unfolds.

Again, if it sounds to good to be true, it probably is.

 

[BIGUN]

I guess if he had never taken it in to a Deere dealer they would still be looking for it. Stories like this make you want to only buy new. /forums/images/graemlins/crazy.gif

 

[MDNY]

I guess it now becomes a fraud case and even more expense to sue to get his money back. This just stinks. /forums/images/graemlins/mad.gif

 

[jfdlaw]

MDMY - You got it. If Deere can't get their money out of the guy, and they have a collection department and in house attorneys, what chance does my friend have? As someone before mentioned, the suit would have to be brought where the seller lives, so he would have to find an attorney down there (in another state) to bring the action. At what point is it throwing good money after bad?

 

[Tornado]

It seems that the moral of this story is bad news for tractor buyers.

Never buy used tractor equipment, ESPECIALLY JD.

I think JD should reconsider the message they are sending here. JD made the deal with the first owner. JD made the sale. JD took the risk, and believe me, the risk for JD is well defined, and the numbers well calculated. For JD, the occasional ne'er-do-well is a part of the equation.

Visiting the sins of the few on to a potential good customer for life is simply bad business.

I have already had some bad experiences with JD equipment. Reading this thread has ensured that I will never make a major JD purchase.

In the days when information and events that affected only a few was hard to come by, mostly passed about by word of mouth and rumor, a company might get away with this. With the advent of the internet, no company is afforded that luxury any more.

I understand that JD wants it's money. If they want to do the right thing, then go get the guy that stiffed them. Maybe JD should be an industry leader and work with legislation on some form of title protection. What they need to do RIGHT NOW, is leave the innocent guy alone.

David

 

[fishman]

Well said Tornado.

 

[BillyP]

Actually Tornado, the tractor 'belongs' to JD until it's paid for. Now if the original owner had went to a bank and borrowed the money for the tractor and sold it, what do you think would happen? The bank would be looking for their tractor and the guy would have his butt in jail.

I would like to buy a tractor from you. On credit, of course /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif

 

[755inNY]

<font color="blue"> Never buy used tractor equipment, ESPECIALLY JD.
</font>
<font color="blue"> I have already had some bad experiences with JD equipment. Reading this thread has ensured that I will never make a major JD purchase.
</font>

Do you really think that JD is the only tractor manufacturer that would pursue this course of action? Get real.

Jeff

 

[Tornado]

Maybe you missed my point.

The innocent guy is caught in a game between JD and the guilty. Ultimately, it is JD's fault for offering the loser credit. They could have simply sold the tractor for cash.

JD is using the financing option as marketing. As such, there are certain risks. JD is assuming these risks. JD financed a tractor for a loser/petty criminal. The poor slob that bought the tractor is a victim of JD's marketing and the crooks' greed.

Leave the innocent guy out of the deal. JD needs to pursue the crook.

My $0.02 worth.
David