It's amazing what we think we need!

   / It's amazing what we think we need! #1  

Slippy

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 23, 2002
Messages
1,053
Location
Ohio
Tractor
Mahindra 6000 4wd; IH x2; NHTC40DSS; International 1086; JD 5115M
It\'s amazing what we think we need!

I have been searching for information about CUT in an effort to fill a void that I concluded existed regarding the need for a CUT. Day after day, post after post, we all read about new and old folks to this board looking for help in making a decision about what tractor to buy, just like I have been lately. I am especially grateful to this board and the folks who spend the time to help out neighbors in a neighborhood that has no boundries.

However, what we forget is how tractors, especially in the last 10 years, have changed, and what we really need to get the job done vs what good marketing by manufactures have lead us to believe we need.

I realized this today as I was using my very old, but faithful IN Cub High Boy, early 60's vintage, to repair some quad trails. No HST, sync gears, fancy seats, power reverser, 4wd, super steer, auto tracking gear, and the list goes on and on. Just the very basic transfer of power, and not a lot mind you, to one rear wheel, and using the dual pedal brake to transfer power to the other wheel when needed. You folks who have been around tractors for a while know what I am talking about. The tractor, other than the faded paint, is about in as good as shape now as it was when it was built. Why, because there really is not a whole lot that can go wrong with the very basics.

It might be helpful for all of use, when we feel we are overwhelmed with all the features that tractors offer today, to look back at history and realize what it is we really do need to get the job done. I will suggest it is a lot less than we lead ourselves to believe, assisted by the very refined manufactures advertising and helping us convince ourselves we need a lot more than we really do. Heck, its not like we are driving the thing to work every day, or transporting our family cross country on the thing. I bet for some of us, it is easier to buy a new car than it is to pick a new tractor.

Just think about it; this board itself has grown so large over the last few years from where it started, with a lot of the traffic posted in the buying sections. If there weren't so many features today to consider, and we weren't lead to believe we just have to have them, these sections would probably not have nearly the growth they have realized.

Don't miss understand me, I enjoy seat time as much as the next guy, and a nice product can make it enjoyable. But what I realized was that I was enjoying my $2000 tractor as much as I do the $20,000.00 tractors, especially considering the investment, or lack of it.

Oh well, I guess my point is that as we are looking for the absolutley perfect fit for our needs in a CUT, yet most people, regardless of their pick, end up being happy with their pick because it will accomplish the basics, and we learn to live with all the other stuff it comes with. Why, because it gets the job done, just like the basic tractors of years ago. We then realize that it is amazing what we thought we needed, what we really needed, and how well what we bought will get the job done, regardless of the color or fancy features.
 
   / It's amazing what we think we need! #2  
Re: It\'s amazing what we think we need!

Good points Slippy! Although, I find myself looking at ways to save time when it comes to decision making. I don't like spending 6 hours mowing pastures, or walking around with a backpack sprayer. The backpack sprayer is cheaper, but a spraying implement on the tractor saves me time. If I had an air conditioned cab, I might not mind 6 hours in the 90+ degree heat, but I rather save the time and use a larger mowing deck. Overall, I used to look at features, but you are right... A feature is a feature, not a function.

Good points!

Joe
 
   / It's amazing what we think we need! #3  
Re: It\'s amazing what we think we need!

I certainly agree that it is easy to become spoiled. Allot of these features were designed to reduce fatigue and increase convenience. Things that seem like frills now will be seen as necessities in a few years. My Dad bought his first Farmall Cub in 1947 to replace a Model A Ford "home made tractor." He got a new manure spreader so he did not have to shovel crap out of the back of his pickup. That Cub was 2WD with Armstrong steering and no live power. It had a pan seat and a 3spd. He said he paid an extra $45 for hydraulics. I wonder how many people would buy a tractor like that now? /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif
 
   / It's amazing what we think we need! #4  
Re: It\'s amazing what we think we need!

Of course everything you mentioned doing could be done with a maddock and a scythe, so I guess you should sell that fancy machine.


/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Durn new fangled contraptions, never replace a good team of horse's. By buggy whip stock. /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif
 
   / It's amazing what we think we need! #5  
Re: It\'s amazing what we think we need!

Most people make their buying decisions based on where they believe they are getting the best value for their money, but value means different things to different people. There are two basic types of buyers of CUTs. First is the group that places a high value on things such as comfort, convenience and styling along with the desired level of power and productivity. These people place a high emphasis on features such as deluxe transmissions (HST, synchro gear), tilt and telescopic steering, flex link ends, serviceability, fit and finish, swivel seat, foldable ROPS, and supersteer, just to name a few. Others believe that horsepower is the true measure of a tractor's ability to accomplish work and getting the job done for the least amount of money is foremost on their mind. This group of people wants a good, dependable, no frills tractor that is easy to maintain and simple to operate.

I think what varmintmist was trying to point out is there has been a transition for the latter group to the former... and this is definitely a valid point. I would certainly put myself in the category of CUT buyers who values the comfort, convenience, and styling, etc. features. It is just individual preference of what YOU value on your tractor. Look at a 2005 F150 vs a 1985 F150, the same transition has taken place in this product as well. Nowadays, buyers place more value on "status symbol" products, not on the "no frills get the job done" products of yesterday. To say one group of buyers is incorrect in their value preferences is a ridiculous!!!
 
   / It's amazing what we think we need! #6  
Re: It\'s amazing what we think we need!

4wd - no you don't need it but in many areas it sure extends the usefulness of a tractor. Grampa put the 8n away in the winter and brought the battery inside. We need to get out of our driveway in a car.

Grampa added chains and weight to his once he started needing it in the winter. Cans of ether piled up and gas got sloshed down the carb. 4wd isn't much more than a decent set of chains on many models of tractor.

Grampa didn't have much trouble getting around in the wet ground because he had a horse. Once he started using his 8n to drag the fire wood out, he still didn't have much trouble because he had no loader on the front to bog the tires down. Plus he still had a horse to pop his little tractor out.

Grampa didn't worry about shuttle trannies etc because he didn't have a loader. He didn't because old joe up the road put a pipe frame loader on and broke his tractor in half.

Grampa didn't worry about hydrostatic because he lived on the flat ground. He could push the clutch in anywhere and leave his machine anywhere without a problem.

Grampa didn't worry about live or independant pto because he drove the tractor enough to jump it out of gear and get teh clutch back up in neutral without grinding it one bit.

Grampa didn't worry about power steering because he did manual labour all day and was strong. Also, the only reason the steering would be heavy was if he forgot the suitcase weights on the front after taking the plow off yesterday.
 
   / It's amazing what we think we need! #8  
Re: It\'s amazing what we think we need!

Slippy, you make some excellent points and I think slowzuki really makes some strong counter-points.

For me a lot of things boil down to time, comfort and ease. I don't have time so I want a tractor that will do things as fast as I can get them accomplished. Ease, at 44, I am tired of doing manual labor and hurting my body (I was also diagnosed with RA at the age of 23 and have been on treatments to arrest the bone/joint destroying effects of the disease). I want a quick hitch or extendable lower links because it takes less time and less effort to hook up implements. I want a cushy seat (especially the suspension type) when bouncing around the field so I am not sore at the end of the day. I love HST on my hills and when using a loader and a tiller and a mower; it speeds up the work while making it easier and safer.

I will totally agree that I get a great big smile on my face when I even see an antique go down the road, and better yet when I am on that antique iron! But while I could do the job with an old style very basic tractor, part of the reason I play with these things is very practical and the modern "features" do help get the job done quicker, easier and with a great degree of safety & comfort. Heck I love to read Soundguy's posts, as he uses pretty basic equipment, but it was intersting to read his post after he finally got a FEL. It was like a big light bulb was illuminated.

I do agree, we could get buy with far less, but the whistles and bells are something I choose to have. Without them, I probably wouldn't maintain my property to the same level and certainly with the same joy. I'm certainly not argueing with you, I just have a different set of needs.
 
   / It's amazing what we think we need! #9  
Re: It\'s amazing what we think we need!

Actually I kind of think of them as "working machines" and "cupholder tractors". /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

And no, I really dont care if yours has a cupholder or not, you got what you wanted. And you cant have my shuttle shift back /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

What I was implying is that technology changes and although the old stuff will do the same job, the new will most likely do it faster and more efficiently. There is absoultley no put down to old tech. It is great stuff and 1/2 the time I wish I could get a 351 with a coil and points ignition, or a 350 with a Rockchester Quadrajunk on it. They work, period.
So does a horse and buggy but I am not running around advocating horsepower. I have plowed behind a horse, I like tractors.
 
   / It's amazing what we think we need! #10  
Re: It\'s amazing what we think we need!

- No ROPS
- Poor brakes and brake locks that would not hold on a hill
- PTOs that would not stop
- tricycle fronts that were very unsteady on uneven land
- gas tank explosions on old gasoline run tractors
- hand cranks
- cabs that were not ROPS designed
- hydraulic system failures that caused an implement to sud-
denly drop

All of the above have killed or injured many a farmer/operator when operating an old classic tractor. A couple weeks ago a local retired farmer was killed when his Farmal H rolled over while he was cutting road ditches. If he has been driving my new Kubota L3430 with a ROPS cab and seatbelt, he most likely would not have rolled over, and even if he did, he 'd have a **** of story to tell as the fire department extracated him from the cab.

I have some old tractors that I have been driving for more than 40 years. I much prefer the safety of the modern tractors. I would not even want to see a first time tractor driver buy on old classic. Buy a modern tractor and live to a ripe old age.

OrangeGuy
 
 
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