Bobcat Toolcat 5600 or Power Trac 1850 for 168 ac?

[BrianSouthernMD]

I want to maintain and enhance our 168-acre farm, incl. basic forestry management. I initially looked at CUT & ag/utility tractors such as Massey Ferguson 15xx & low-profile 4xx series (as well as skid steer loaders), but TractorbyNet forum reading over past six months and demos (thanks Charlie & TBNers!) point me to either the Bobcat Toolcat 5600T all-wheel steer, axle-oscillating 4WD utility work machine or the Power Trac 1850 articulated and oscillating 4WD loader tractor.

F/t farmers provide equipment for field crops raised on 65 level acres. My equipment will cover rest on 20 acres of hilly lawn & pasture (hills have 10 to 21 degree slopes), 60 acres of woodland and heavy brush (flat, gently sloping & steeply sloping; half harvested 7 years ago), 20 acres of marsh, a 7500 ft.-long gravel road, own gravel pit, 3500 ft. of shoreline, plus other field, forest and road edges/trails.

You can get an idea of initial projects by machines & front-mounted attachments I'm considering:

***Bobcat Toolcat 5600 Turbo [56hp Kubota diesel, 18gpm @3000 psi aux. hyd., w/opt. 26gpm high flow?, 1500 lb. ROC lift arm to 84", 4/wheel steering, oscillation, 4WD, HST, cruise control, passenger seat, w/free cab & HVAC]
**Bucket, 62"
**Box Scraper, 68"
**Pallet Forks, 48" teeth
**Auger Drive Unit w/6" bit
**TBD Root Rake Brush Grapple, 60"
**Bobcat Mower, 72" or 90" 3-spindle finish, or Bobcat Flail Cutter, 79"
**Ammbusher Brushcutter, 60"

OR ***Power Trac 1850 Slope Mower [65hp Deutz diesel, 18gpm @3200psi, 1200 lb. lift to 72", oscillation, 4WD, HST, duals] with seven front-mounted hyd. attachments similar to those listed for Toolcat.

TOOLCAT ADVANTAGES:
-Bobcat dealer full-service support;
-Rental of addl. attachments from dealers & rental shops;
-Many skid steer attachments work on Toolcat;
-Passenger seat so my aging father or other assistant can get all over the farm during projects (later for me!);
-Enc. cab with great HVAC, visibility & sound muffling;
-Dump bed to carry tools, fence posts, etc.
-More maneuverable in woods at 61" wide w/4-wheel steering;
-Just light enough to mow on turf, but heavier and well-balanced for more lift, push and pull capabilities;
-Has new 3ph rear PTO option if ever decide to pull 4000-lb. hay mower, conditioner or small baler.

POWER TRAC 1850 PLUSES:
-Purchase / communicate directly with manufacturer;
-Navigates steeper slopes with wider stance/duals;
-Lower COG, shorter;
-Lighter by 1000 pounds (4000 v. 5000) for turf work;
-Simpler design and less electronics for repair ease;
-TractorbyNet PowerTrac forum support;
-Most attachments a bit less expensive.

Beacuse of current Bobcat incentives and dealer discounts, price of the Toolcat package w/attachments above is only a couple thousand dollars more than the Power Trac 1850 package, even though list price difference is $9,000+.

Would you go with Toolcat 5600T or Power Trac 1850 or something else for our farm?

 

[cowboydoc]

I really like the Toolcat. My grandfather has one and it is amazing what it can do. I don't know much about the Power Trac. Every year I have debated buying one. Personally I would go with the Toolcat just because there are more dealers for them and it would probably be easier for service. Alot of people have the power trac and love it too. Both seem to be very reliable and has a good reputation. You aren't going to go wrong either way.

 

[kensfarm]

"My equipment will cover rest on 20 acres of hilly lawn & pasture (hills have 10 to 21 degree slopes), 60 acres of woodland and heavy brush (flat, gently sloping & steeply sloping; half harvested 7 years ago), 20 acres of marsh, a 7500 ft.-long gravel road, own gravel pit, 3500 ft. of shoreline, plus other field, forest and road edges/trails."

I would say w/ this much acreage.. you'll be crying yourself to sleep if you don't buy (65-75hp 4x4)utility size tractor. You'll need the ground clearance, traction, and pulling power.. rent or get a loaner for a week to try out some tasks you have planned. Ask one of the FT farmers what they think.. they know the land.

 

[bam747]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">(
-Has new 3ph rear PTO option if ever decide to pull 4000-lb. hay mower, conditioner or small baler.
)</font>

I had heard a rumor at a Bobcat dealer last spring that the Toolcat was going to get a rear PTO, 3ph, and hydraulic SCV(s) as options. I haven't seen that yet on their website.

Have you seen or do you have conformation that these options are now available on the Toolcat?

If so, do you know what the specs are for lifting weight on the 3ph and a HP rating on the PTO? Do you know if the PTO is mechanically driven or hydraulically driven?

BTW, other rumors were a larger model Toolcat and a telescoping lift arm for the loader (not unlike current tele-handlers). Haven't heard anything further about these rumors though...

 

[BrianSouthernMD]

bam747,

The formal announcement and presentation of the Toolcat rear 3pt. hitch 540 rpm PTO option was made to Bobcat dealers in June 2005. I believe it has just made been made available as an option on the 5600B and 5600T series, but not the A series. <font color="red"> The rear PTO hp on the Turbo model is 46hp! </font> I'm going to get more details and its specs later this week.

 

[BrianSouthernMD]

Ken,
I'll consider a 4WD utility like the new MF 4xx low profile series.

I also agree nothing beats extensive testing on your own property. I had the Toolcat in a demo last week for four days and 13.8 seat hours and used a wide range of attachments. It handled the tasks and we were favorably impressed.

After seeing Toolcat in action, it is hard to consider anything without 4-wheel steering and front-mounted attachment capability (esp. for mowers and brushcutters).

 

[Charlie_Iliff]

<font color="red"> you'll be crying yourself to sleep if you don't buy (65-75hp 4x4)utility size tractor </font>
Ken: I beg to differ. When Brian test drove my Power Trac, he had a chance to see a number of conventional tractors we have available. Since I got the PT, I thankfully leave the three John Deeres to others.
Certainly, there are jobs that a muscular 4wd farm or utliity tractor can do better than my 45 hp PT. They are few, however, and the PT will do a wide array of chores that a big ag or utility tractor won't - or won't do as well. Brian's looking at the 60 hp Power Trac, and at the Toolcat. He won't find many people who have significant experience with both conventional tractors and articulated/4-wheel-steer implement carriers. I'd venture that those who do will say he's going in the right direction, and with either the PT 1850 or the Toolcat, he'll never cry himself to sleep wishing he had something else.

 

[Charlie_Iliff]

Brian:
I've not driven a Toolcat. Over the weekend, I mowed for 3 1/2 hours in 90 degree heat. I'd probably have been a tad more comfortable in an air conditioned cab.
After your hours on the Toolcat, if you want to take another ride on the PT for comparison, I'll be happy to have you visit again. (My son's getting married in three weeks in our front pasture, so I'm trying to keep a bit shorter than usual. Any volunteer mowing will be appreciated. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif)
I'm partial to the Power Tracs, of course, but I can't think of much to criticize on the Toolcat. I'm sure you're having a great time in the evaluation process.

 

[BrianSouthernMD]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( <font color="red"> Brian:
I've not driven a Toolcat. Over the weekend, I mowed for 3 1/2 hours in 90 degree heat. I'd probably have been a tad more comfortable in an air conditioned cab.
After your hours on the Toolcat, if you want to take another ride on the PT for comparison, I'll be happy to have you visit again. I'm partial to the Power Tracs, of course, but I can't think of much to criticize on the Toolcat. )</font> </font>

Charlie,
Thanks for your honest response to how a Toolcat might suit my needs, even though I know you'd like another Marylander on TBN with a Power Trac 18xx series nearby.

And thanks again letting me try out your Power Trac 1845 and your recent added offers. I'll let you know.

The combo of online discussion and on-tractor testing in real working environments is unbeatable. Topics throughout TBN have led me to a choice (articulated PT 1850 or 4-wheel-steer Toolcat) where I won't go wrong for my needs.

 

[kensfarm]

My reasoning would be..

1. He has a farm.. he'll have one machine.. and eventually will want to(or have to) do farming stuff.

2. Logging.. pulling power.. higher FEL lifting capabilities..

3. Ground Clearance.. I've seen skid steers get stuck in mud or manure where the trench would only be a foot to a foot 1/2 deep. Once you bottom out.. you're stuck.

4. Mower Size.. mowing a 20 acre field w/ an 8ft mower will def. be a chore.. need to size the equipment to the tasks at hand.

A question: Why does the 60hp Power Trac's lifting capabilities seem so low.. my 35hp TC35D lists higher lifting capabilities.. are the specs listed in a comparible format? I'm I reading it wrong?

Charlie.. these are just my thoughts based on my experiences I've had.. situations and goals of others will determine the best equipment choice for there needs. I don't doubt that the PT is a great machine.