Are cabs useful under say 30-35 hp?

[patrick_g]

wolc123, I don't want to start a fight but I do want to say something based on over 5 years experience using a HD box blade with hydraulic scarifiers, a HD 6 ft brush hog taking down trees up to 4-6 inches in dia, the HD FEL with bucket, pallet forks (1300 lb cap), and hay spike (handling round bales over 1000 Lb). I also have various dirt working tools like tiller, sub soiler, middle buster, disks, PHD, angle blade, etc.

I work the tractor hard, like recently when repairing some erosion damage for a friend who was helping me log some big cedars on his place where I followed my usual method which is to first fill the bucket and then the box blade to carry two loads to the depression I am filling. This is quite a load and sometimes at full throttle in low range, especially up grade, the tractor just can't go any more and I have to ease up on the down pressure on the box blade to be able to make forward progress.

I have done this with A/C and with it switched off. The difference in HP required to do the hard work and the A/C requirement is so great that turning off the A/C makes no noticeable difference in the "stall point." I'm sure a sensitive dyno can measure it as the A/C takes a a few HP but in my experience once you get that close to the edge of the envelope you need to lighten up on demand by way more than the A/C uses.

In lower power units the effect would be greater as max HP was less and A/C takes a larger percent of available HP but at 39.5 HP on my Kubota I haven't found A/C to limit my work output noticeably.

I can't say what would happen with a JD, or a brand X tractor but with my 39.5 HP Kubota the A/C is not a major limiting factor. As for needing 50 HP to run A/C and HST??? Maybe with some brands or models but not for the Kubota L-4610HSTC.

As to the need for a lot more HP to run the HST... My Kubota is 39.5 HP with HST and the geared model is 40 HP. It is possible (but unlikely with GOOD brands) that other tractors lose much more power in the HST or have less efficient A/C that requires significantly more HP but again, probably not in the NAME brands.

Of course for a specific task like running a baler that is over sized for the tractor when you are at the edge of the envelope ANY extra power requirement could be the straw that breaks the camel's back. Can't comment on how frequently it happens that an implement takes ALL available HP and any extra load stops progress and there isn't any way to ameliorate the situation.

Pat

 

[MossRoad]

Here in Northern Indiana, an un-airconditioned cab will kill you in the summer. The heat frequently tops 90 and so does the humidity. It really is heat stroke friendly.

I had to take the doors and rear window off my un-ariconditioned cab in the summer or I would have died without air. That is why I went with a canopy on my PT425. Just enough to keep the snow off my head in winter and the sun off my head in summer. Also keeps branches off my noggin as well in the woods.

 

[gemini5362]

.



As to the need for a lot more HP to run the HST... My Kubota is 39.5 HP with HST and the geared model is 40 HP. It is possible (but unlikely with GOOD brands) that other tractors lose much more power in the HST or have less efficient A/C that requires significantly more HP but again, probably not in the NAME brands.


Pat

Interesting comment what do you call a good brand ?

 

[patrick_g]

Interesting comment what do you call a good brand ?

My comment intended to convey that it was unlikely that other "GOOD" brands would lose much if any more percentage of their power to HST than Kubota does. HST isn't so complicated that it can't be duplicated by lesser brands (they just might not do as good of a job on the allocated budget.) This allows for the possibility that some maker somewhere might make a really inefficient HST.

What do I think good brands are? Well, from my earlier comments you can read that I think Kubota and John Deere are both good brands. I am not particularly knowledgeable about a bunch of the lesser known or lower quality imports. Sure I can name a lot of brands but to what end?

Price does not guarantee quality but if you ranked all small tractors (under about 50 HP) into three equal sized lists of names by price/feature, owner satisfaction, and such the top 1/3 list would include JD and Kubota. The bottom 1/3 would contain Belarus and some of the Chinese cheapies. I personally don't know where to put things like Mahindra except not in my barn. I'm sure there is a cachet not unlike early VW beatle ownership to having a rare off brand tractor curiosity but my interests don't incline in that direction.

Luckily I don't have to be the "Consumers Reports" of tractors nor do I need to be able to rate them in any particular order. My selection task was much easier. I just had to find a tractor that had a good reputation and did what I needed. My selection process could have ended up with an Italian tractor, or a White, or any of a number of brands had my prejudice (influenced by user reports) not leaned me toward JD and Kubota. If the JD dealer had taken my two visits to his operation and my questions more seriously it would have been a tougher decision but I didn't like the attitude at the JD boutique. I tried several times to by a used low hours tractor coming in off lease in Idaho (used for potato harvest and then turned back.) The dealer never acted quickly enough and after months I gave up on him and bought new.

Pat

 

[patrick_g]

MossRoad, That sure is a cute lil feller, what will it be if it grows up?

Pat

 

[MossRoad]

MossRoad, That sure is a cute lil feller, what will it be if it grows up?

Pat

Here's a link to his daddy!

 

[MossRoad]

Here's a link to his daddy!

And a link to his grandpappy.

 

[IslandTractor]

And a link to his grandpappy.

Ya gotta be careful picking on these PT guys. They are a small but fearsome tribe. They'll change implements faster than you can get off your tractor and you definitely don't want to get into a lifting contest with grandpa! (10,000lbs to 62")

 

[CharlieTR]

Ok after wandering around the big farmshow up here,and seeing all the emphasis on the smaller tractors this year,I started wondering about the factory cabbed ones. What I was wondering is: If a factory cab was available on everything but the SCUTs would they sell enough to make them worthwhile to the manufacturers? Sure they'll sell up here,but we are a small part of North American sales. What about in the South,or West,MidWest? Also how many cabbed tractors would it take to pay-off the cab investment I wonder?

Would I buy one? Yes, every tractor I've seen can't out-run Killer Bees, or any other flyin' stingin' thing. Hope it would have AC.

Not sure about your last question, "how many would it take to pay off..."

 

[MossRoad]

Ya gotta be careful picking on these PT guys. They are a small but fearsome tribe. They'll change implements faster than you can get off your tractor and you definitely don't want to get into a lifting contest with grandpa! (10,000lbs to 62")

Yeah, that grandpappy is one tough dude!