Cold start issues? on a International 684

[gatordog]

Gator dog !! Reading another thread I gather you have a 784 not a 684, so it will have the D246 engine.

Timing for the fuel pump should be 16degrees for both applications.

Tractors for Europe were fitted with the " thermostart" flame start device in the inlet manifold, for North America the ether start was preferred ??

Re oil I need to know the "American Petroleum Institute" API classification grade of the oil you suggest so I can better advise?

Re compression tester, any good dealer should have a universal tool which can be used or you could use a dummy injector???

It would also be useful to know if you are using a high or low sulphur diesel ???

Where abouts are you located???

I am using AG diesel, and plan on using Rotella diesel Oil non-synthetic, I am about as South as you can get, I can't see Mexico, but you can sure smell it. There are no Good Dealers down here, most of the mechanics are High school kids that can't spell CAT if you spotted them the C and the A.

 

[cyrush]

Try Messicks the hpco is listed on their parts site!!!

Tractor Parts

To me in U/K ag diesel means little ??? Is it high or low sulphur ???

Also she'll rotella is not listed for Europe, need all data off oil drum to advise!!!


Have googled rotella and find there are several different oils from full mineral to synthetic and mono grade to multigrade(s) ??? Need more input on specific oil you intend to use???

Your loader valve bank??, is it a two or three line unit (no of lines to valve bank from tractor) ??

 

[gatordog]

Try Messicks the hpco is listed on their parts site!!!

Tractor Parts

To me in U/K ag diesel means little ??? Is it high or low sulphur ??? AG diesel in the US is just has red dye in it. It was high sulphur, but now it is low.

Also she'll rotella is not listed for Europe, need all data off oil drum to advise!!! The rotella would be either the regular which is 15w-40, or I might use the full synthetic Rotella T6 which is 5w-40 in need to recheck.


Have googled rotella and find there are several different oils from full mineral to synthetic and mono grade to multigrade(s) ??? Need more input on specific oil you intend to use??? FYI, I and most people here across the pond use Rotella or Mobil 1 in our VW TDI's. They are much better oils than Castrol, Moto, Elf, etc and cost much less. It you want I can post a link from FredsTDI forum that has several used Oil analysis pages.

Your loader valve bank??, is it a two or three line unit (no of lines to valve bank from tractor) ??

It has 2 lines from the remotes. If I hold the handle on the right side of the tractor and use the loader. The loader will lift the tractor with no problem, so I just need to locate one of those High pressure valves.

Also, I have looked over here for glaze busters, but no luck. Is it, glaze buster, still available on your side of the pond?

 

[art]

When checking with a deealer have the serial number handy and look for the power beyond valve. It is relatively easy to install and will make your loader valve active at all times and free the rear remote of use.

 

[cyrush]

"Gator dog' I think you miss-understood. by 2 or 3 line i am refering to what the loader valve bank requires, bit what is on the tractor ????

First att shows auxiliary valve layout including end plate which will be replaced by the HPCO. (Picture actually shows HPCO but part no's listed are for a blank end plate.??

For correct part no's refer to 2nd att

3rd att shows large plug under axle on r/hand side to be used as return port, The size is 1 5/16inches UNF thread size not spanner size ?????? Due to size of this plug most people remove it then have a local m/c shop bore it and tap it to suit local adaptors, ideally 3/4 bsp or 1 inch JIC


Regarding glaze busters ?? do you mean a tool ?? or a fluid that can be added to fuel or oil ??

 

[huskerhayman]

Thirdly there is a thermostart heater mounted in the inlet manifold and fed by a pipe from the injectors and fuel pump. To use the thermostart turn on the ign switch then turn key firther(against spring pressure) and hold in this position for 45 seconds, then move key to start position and crank over engine, and it should start.

Do all 684s have this? I have one but have never heard this. I do have either assist but it doesn't work and I have never used it. Mine starts great and when it gets cold I have a tank heater on it that works great. Guess I will have to look at the operators manual.

I you need the wiring diagrams let me know. I have the factory service manual and could primly get you them.

 

[cyrush]

84 series were either equipped with ether start for the Americas or thermostart for Europe and other markets. They cannot be equipped with both as using ether and thermostart together would cause a massive explosion inside the inlet manifold.

 

[huskerhayman]

Makes sense. OP: These are great tractors and you will love it. I have had my 684 for years without any problems and I have a Case IH 885 which is practically the same tractor that has over 9000 hours and the only thing that has been done to it is new sleeve o-rings and a head gasket.



This is what my 684 looked like when I bought it. The picture makes I look like it needed more work than it did.

 

[huskerhayman]

Looks like I need a HPCO, It's going be fun trying to find one of those

On mine I added a power beyond plate on the end of the remote valve. I could not find one off of a 684 and IH wanted around $300 for one if I remember right. I ended up buying two valve and the power beyond plate off of an 86 series IH. On the 86 series the plate mounts on the opposite end if the valves and I had to have some oring grooves machine in it but it wasn't to expensive. I got the whole setup for about $120 off of eBay and I added one of the valves so now I have two remotes. It was well worth to time and money to not screw with tying the lever down.

 

[gatordog]

"Gator dog' I think you miss-understood. by 2 or 3 line i am refering to what the loader valve bank requires, bit what is on the tractor ???? There are two lines on the tractor, these are the remotes. I thought they only came in pairs?????



Regarding glaze busters ?? do you mean a tool ?? or a fluid that can be added to fuel or oil ??

I am looking for the fluid.


I went to change the oil yesterday and did not check on how much diesel and she ran dry, so it was a all day oil change. I did not want to damage my starter, so I bought one of those Mr gasket diesel fuel pumps and wired it in. Which was a good thing since the previous owner had the IGN switch wired all wrong. I have been meaning to get one of these pumps, since I have 5 diesels and my old IDI Ford Trucks only have a manuel pump, so when working on fuel system I can use this pump to save starters. Anyway, with the electric pump I discovered that the inlet fitting to the second bank of fuel filters was leaking, and is not worth repairing since the previous owner just used several layers of teflon tape to try and seal up the wore out threads. Need to get a new filter head, one that uses a good, cheap, and always available anywhere Fleetguard/fleetpride filter. I need to check today and see if the added fuel pressure will help on the cold start issues. I like this pump since if it is not on it still flows fuel, I just ran a switch and power comes from the IGN switch on the ignition terminal.

As far as the loader, I used the hold down bolt and the loader has plenty of power. No need for the HPCO, maybe later.