PTO revisited

[Gramps in NM]

Mentioned this problem with another query. Lost track of it. Have a Task Master 425A, (Dong Feng DF254 I believe) with a Jinma Y385 engine. FEL & rear blade. Just purchased used and everything functions, no leaks. The PTO runs constantly when the engine is running. Manual shows two stage clutch, when engine off and clutch depressed the PTO shaft will not turn freely by hand. Speed selector 540/1000 seems to have a neutral position and I have tried all three with no apparent speed change in shaft turning. It does seem to be changing position internally. I have only tried changing position when engine is off, a little scared to try with engine running but believe that to be my next step. Clutch housing has only a small 3x5 inspection port although there might be a larger adjustment opening that is covered by the FEL mounting. It seems to this non mechanic that the second stage clutch is stuck, would that be possible. The shaft that the cluth pivots on also has another lever mechanism on it that is not pinned to the clutch being depressed, another words when the clutch is depressed the cluth mechanism moves as it should but this other setup does not. It in turn goes to a component (cast box) mounted on the left side of the 3pt. Non of this seems to move at any time and I find no reference to it in the manuals. Will attach pics of this other item. Other solutions? All suggestions welcome. Help please and thanks in advance.

 

[greg_g]

Not to say that something couldn't be wrong, but in most cases this is a common misperception held by novice Chinese tractor owners. Engaged or disengaged, there's going to be rotation of the splined PTO stub. Engaged, it's because the gear train is driving it. Disengaged, it's because of parasitic rotational forces from the circulating gear oil or UTF.

To confirm that it's truly disengaged, some brave (or foolhardy) folks will try to stop it by hand - or with a piece of wood - when the engine's running. The correct - and safest way - is to do it with the engine NOT running. Push the lever and speed select to their respective engaged positions, then try to turn the stub by hand. It should not move. Disengage either of the PTO levers, you should now be able to rotate it by hand.

If it passes both tests, it's working correctly. If not, we'll THEN start looking for the reason why.

//greg//

 

[Sweden-Art]

Check your clutch pedal free play.

On my DF254G2 I owned before the PTO shaft never stop spinning when using the clutch. I had to move the selector to neutral to disengage the PTO (but still rotating by drag). My DF came from the manufacturer with about 2"-3" free play on the clutch pedal, it should be ~1". I adjusted the free play to spec and it worked as it should do. But still, as Greg mentioned, with a little rotation by oil drag.

Be careful.

 

[Gramps in NM]

I am for sure a novice in Chinny tractors. Thanks for the input. At no time and in no configuration will the PTO stub turn by hand with engine shut off. In what appears as neutral, low or high RPM. Clutch in, clutch out. Today I tried moving the speed (540-1000) selector while the tractor was running, with the clutch in, then the clutch out. No clashing of gears, no noise, and no change in PTO. Yet the PTO will not turn by hand, even with a pipe wrench when in neutral and clutch depressed. Do not have a PTO implement to try out the system. Main concern was if it's in some locked position it would create a h-ll of a drag when engine starting would it not.
ANYONE have an idea as to what the component was I asked about? Pics were not good, tough place to get a camera.
Thanks
Gramps

 

[Bob Rooks]

At this point I'm speculating that it's stuck in gear (probably 540) and there is either a roll pin sheared off or a set screw has come loose at the shift rail.

 

[Affordable]

If they use the same Spline sleeve and shift lump set up as Jinma,you prob. have a broken shift lump which will not let it dis-engauge

Tommy

Affordable Tractor Sales

"Your Jinma Parts Superstore"

Home of compact Jinma, Foton, and Koyker Tractors and Parts, Wood Chippers, Backhoes - Affordable Tractor Sales Company

 

[greg_g]

Even if there was a roll pin or shift lump issue, you still should be able to turn the stub by hand with engine off, transmission in neutral, and clutch pedal fully depressed. Sometimes during prolonged periods of inactivity the PTO friction disc will stick to the flywheel face. But before going into it that deep, I suggest you check to see that the clutch pedal stop bolt isn't screwed out too far.

And when you look through the clutch inspection window, do you count three clutch release fingers? or six?

//greg//

 

[Affordable]

The spline sleeve connects the 2- parts of the PTO shaft,when the engagement lever is in neutral or dis-engaged position the rear half of the shaft can be turned by hand, clutch has nothing to do with that.The spline sleeve connects the 2-half shafts to engage the PTO.
So if it's not moving due to a roll pin,shift lump the PTO shaft halfs will still be locked together = PTO shaft always turning with the engine running
I would remove the sump from under the seat and see whats going on,it will cost you a couple of gaskets and some of your time,you will be able to see first hand

Tommy
Affordable Tractor Sales
"Your Jinma Parts Superstore"
Home of compact Jinma, Foton, and Koyker Tractors and Parts, Wood Chippers, Backhoes - Affordable Tractor Sales Company

 

[studor]

I noticed you talk about the speed selector but not the lever that engages/disengages the PTO -- is that lever in or out? On mine, both levers need to be in or out to fully engae/disengage the PTO -- just a thought

 

[Gramps in NM]

Thanks all for the replies. i was on the verge of leaving things as is since the present operation is seemingly doing no harm. when the last post came up could this be the answer???? I can find no other lever that would engage/disengage. It appears to me that the speed selector lever has a center position that is neutral. Can you help me out as to where another lever might be. Could that connection I mentioned on the clutch mechanism have something to do with it??
thanks all
Gramps