Farmpro 2430, Hydraulics stalling engine?

[rprecision]

Yesterday I was plowing snow with my 04 Farmpro 2430 (It's a 30 horse Jinma, I think). The tractor has about 50 hours on it and I regularly maintain it. It has a Koyker front end loader and I use a box scraper on the 3 pt.

Well, there I was plowing along and the tractor came to a stop made a hard moan and squeal and died. Truthfully, I thought the engine seized. After a visual inspection of everything I found all the fluids were normal in level and appearance, no fluid leaks, nothing hanging out the side of the block and not obvious missing parts.

I started it up and let it idle for a few minutes again looking for the source. It groaned pulled the engine RPM down and recovered. Puked out a good cloud of black smoke. I was initially thinking a problem with the Injection Pump.
I checked the power steering which worked and didn't cause any problems. As soon as I touched the front end loader controls it again loaded the engine and recovered.

At this point I was going to limp it to the shop and continue to work on this but I had the box scraper down. As soon as I engaged the 3pt it again over loaded the hydraulic pump pulling down the engine RPM and sounded pissed off at the world.

I thought, Ah ha! a stuck relief valve somewhere! The problem is clearly related to the hydraulics.

While limping the tractor to the shop I kept the RPM very low (500 ish) and was able to slowly raise the loader enough to get inside.

I have done some research and learned the system suffers from no relief valve on the pressure side of the pump which leads to the quick disconnects for the front end loader. I further found several cases of blockages related to the QD's (generally described as cheap Chinese crap). My QD's have been seeping for years but have never really caused any problems. Frankly, I never take the loader off so they never get used.

My theory at this point is a defective QD on the pressure side. My plan is to either (1) replace both QD's with quality American versions or (2) just ditch the QD's all together and use a coupler.

I checked briefly and found a few QD's. I could however not find a coupler to connect two male 1/2" FNPT hoses. I probably need to do some searching but the holiday doesn't leave a lot of options tomorrow.

Am I on the right track? Please any advise is greatly appreciated.

This seems like a good forum I am glad I stumbled on to it !

Thanks!

 

[mrmikey]

Darn near same rig as mine, a 204, I do believe you are on the right route. I think the coupler you're after doesn't exist, you'll need a #8 coupling and a #8 swivel to make a setup to join each hose....Mike

 

[RonMar]

While you are waiting for parts to bypass the QC's, you can easilly remove the part inside the QD that causes them to stop flowing... When the QC's are separated, an internal ball in each half seals the port and keeps fluid from leaking out. When the QC's are put together, the balls push against each other opening both ports for fluid to flow thru the line. Behind each ball is a spring. If one of those springs is weak or broken, one ball will overpower the other and one of the ports can close stopping flow. IT could also be that one of the QC's became partialy disconnected allowing the balls to close. A simple test is to just remove the balls in the QC's.

If you unscrew the QC's off of the hose ends, and look into the threaded hole you will see a snapring and a star plate. Under that starplate is a spring and a ballbearing. If you remove the snapring, all the internal parts just fall out. You of course must do this on both sides of the QC pair...

No more issue with flow stoppage. You still retain the ability to disconnect the loader easilly but the hoses will leak fluid till you connect them to their counterpart on the impliment or tractor which is how QC's should be stowed to keep them clean anyway. IF you should ever have a QC come apart, it will pump fluid instead of dead-heading and possibly destroying your hydraulic pump(female QC's should have a zip-tie behind their collar to prevent this from ever happening) And the best part is that you already have all the parts to do this. Did I mention that this is also a long term fix

 

[rprecision]

Darn near same rig as mine, a 204, I do believe you are on the right route. I think the coupler you're after doesn't exist, you'll need a #8 coupling and a #8 swivel to make a setup to join each hose....Mike

Thanks for the feedback

While you are waiting for parts to bypass the QC's, you can easilly remove the part inside the QD that causes them to stop flowing... When the QC's are separated, an internal ball in each half seals the port and keeps fluid from leaking out. When the QC's are put together, the balls push against each other opening both ports for fluid to flow thru the line. Behind each ball is a spring. If one of those springs is weak or broken, one ball will overpower the other and one of the ports can close stopping flow. IT could also be that one of the QC's became partialy disconnected allowing the balls to close. A simple test is to just remove the balls in the QC's.

If you unscrew the QC's off of the hose ends, and look into the threaded hole you will see a snapring and a star plate. Under that starplate is a spring and a ballbearing. If you remove the snapring, all the internal parts just fall out. You of course must do this on both sides of the QC pair...

No more issue with flow stoppage. You still retain the ability to disconnect the loader easilly but the hoses will leak fluid till you connect them to their counterpart on the impliment or tractor which is how QC's should be stowed to keep them clean anyway. IF you should ever have a QC come apart, it will pump fluid instead of dead-heading and possibly destroying your hydraulic pump(female QC's should have a zip-tie behind their collar to prevent this from ever happening) And the best part is that you already have all the parts to do this. Did I mention that this is also a long term fix

That is good to know. I seen the snap rings you mention and thought about what you suggest. I didn't know that gutting them would still keep them functional.

I was able to pick up some fittings to exclude the QD's. Once it gets above -15 I will give them a shot.

I am hoping this is the solution, furthermore, I hope the hydraulic pump isn't damaged. I guess the only thing I can do at this point is give it a shot and see what shakes out.

 

[RonMar]

Yea, you won't know that till you get the QC's bypassed. At least the pumps are not horribly expensive. One other thing to consider with it being so cold is that you developed some ice from moisture in the oil which clogged the QC's or the diverter valve causing the overpressure. With an open breather on the hydraulic reservoir, it is common for them to condense moisture on the inside. Since the hydraulics on these things rarely get a workout heavy enough to get the fluid warm enough to drive off the moisture, enough could have accumulated in the system to form ice crystals. IF the oil looks milky, that is a dead giveaway, but the oil can contain quite a bit of water before it starts to look milky. A quick check is to warm a piece of steel with a torch till it is very hot then drip a little bit of the oil onto the hot metal. If it just smokes, it is pretty low on water content. If it sizzles/crackels, that is the water in the oil flashing to steam. This is sometimes called the frying pan test IF the oil crackels, you can drain as much of the system as possible into a metal container. Then heat the oil to above 212F to cook the moisture out of the oil. I have done this with a metal pail and a propane campstove. Stirring helps with this process as the warm oil will give up it's moisture to the dry air so the more oil you expose to the air, the faster this occurs. Hold the oil above 212F untill the oil first stops making noise(popping sounds as water boils), then stops steaming. Don't burn anything down, this can be a little bit like the turkey in the deep fat fryer and may froth and react violently if there is a lot of water in the oil and you come up on 212F to quickly.

Good Luck.

 

[J_J]

Should not have QD's between the pump and first valve.

If you have QD just after the pump, you should get an external relief valve and install it before the QD.

Even if a QD does come loose, the relief valve will protect the pump.

 

[Soundguy]

I agree, the design of putting anything positively restrictive between the pump and relief is folly.

I'd for sure check to see if it was a bad qd fit that was stalling her out. If you are lucky the pump isn't cracked nor the seal leaking

 

[RonMar]

Tha is why it is just plain easy to pull all the guts out of all the QC's and not worry about it anymore