Progress Update on 2i70 Fuel-Inj install

[kingjames8283]

I wished the news could be better you know like oh the tractor is running but it's not. Idled for brief time last night and started to react to throttle input but eventually shut-down. This of course was after pulling valve cover, number one injector, and verifying pump timing with engine. I did discover that pump WAS 180 degrees out-of-phase with engine timing where the number one injector welled up on the number one cylinder exhaust cycle. What I did was bring number one cylinder to TDC on intake cycle, then removed fuel-inj pump and rotated by hand the front input one full turn in the same direction the engine turns then remounted fuel pump and verified timing which came through at spec which is 22 degree BTDC. Spec called for 22 - 28 on the TY290x2 engine.

As mentioned before, the tractor is trying to come to life but to me it acts as if it's loosing it's prime due to air leak. I have pulled both steel braided fuel lines, one coming from fuel filter, and the other going to fuel filter. They feel weak and not up to task of delivering fuel. I am going to attempt to replace these two lines with high-pressure rubber fuel lines. Got to go get them first.

When I pulled injectors, they (being hardly used) had a slight carbon buildup but nothing bad. I cleaned them up with a shop towel and reinstalled. After we go get these new fuel lines I'm hoping to have a successful start. The one thing I do love about this setup is the method of bleeding air from entire system. Time consuming but complete when it's done.

One questionable thought I have is turning hydraulic fluid pump off while I'm trying to start this tractor. I can hear it and have checked all the levers and nothing is on. Originally I hit one of the engagement levers when I mounted the tractor because I'm so tall it's difficult for me to mount / dismount the tractor without my legs or feet hitting everything in sight. It is rather comical but nonetheless aggravating because I have to reset all the controls every time. Nothing like operating the huge heavy equipment I used to run / transport. So that you know I ran my first Cat 983 at 12 y.o. and have since ran many excavators, backhoes, dozers, highlift, front-end loaders, cranes and just about anything else you can think of. I am not new to this game so when I say I've checked controls, I did just that. I just want to neutralize the hyd-pump to make engine starting easier.

I hope to give a positive conclusion to this episode on my next update. There is nothing else on this simple tractor engine that can be wrong. I have checked and put my hands on every inch of this engine and feel I have addressed all concerns except for why air keeps getting into the fuel system but these new hoses should fix that problem.

 

[tat2z1969]

you might want to start back at the fuel tank and check fittings there and the fuel bowl, they have been know to suck air.

 

[JINMA224XR]

Idled for brief time last night and started to react to throttle input but eventually shut-down.

Hey James,

Some of the Fuel PetCocks had some problems,, with fuel flow,, so if you haven't allready,, check to make sure that the fuel flow lever,, is in a maximum flow position. Or maybe just a restriction somewhere,, but this is just a guess.

Hope this helps,
Joe

 

[bluechip]

I'm guessing this is a Jinma or farm pro tractor, if so the hydraulic pump is engine mounted and cannot be disengaged for starting.
There is a thimble shapped strainer in the banjo bolt that attached the fuel line to the bottom of the lift pump portion of the injector pump, I would pull that and check it if you haven't and while you have it off, be sure the fuel runs freely when the valve on the sediment bowl in in the open positioin, you may have to adjust where open is to find the best flow. Also try running while pumping the hand pump. If the hand pump gets hard, like it is building pressure, check to be sure the check valve is on the right end of the injector pump head. the pump should just circulate throught the head back into the return lines along the top of the injectors and back to the tank.

 

[kingjames8283]

Chip, that is something I will check. This is a FarmPro branded tractor, (I'll be civil). And yes that hand-primer gets hard as a rock (no pun there) in fact using the force of my bare hand, I blew-up two fuel filters already so I'm trying to be more restraining. I will look to see if there is any blockage on the low-pressure return line back to the tank. If need be, I will also convert those rubber lines to the nylon lines with brass compression fittings.

I have decided to make a change in the OEM setup by replacing all rubber fuel lines with banjo fittings (I don't trust them) to the newer style nylon lines with brass compression fittings that are common today. The conversion is easy and much cheaper by comparison than using what the factory put on there. Next up, I will check all lines from fuel tank down including petcock and strainer.

I've now spent 4 weekends on this project and am very disappointed at the difficulty I've had on such a sweet design. I am determined to get this cute little tractor running and will not give up. The only way for me to learn the little quirks in these Chinese Tractors is to keep at it so I can learn where the problems are so that I can pass that information on which can help the next person down line who encounters the same issues.

Since we don't seem to have anyone in Central Indiana who works on these import tractors, I want to learn as much as I can about them so that maybe I can someday start a side business as a mobile repair and lube shop for these import tractors and related equipment. I would like to be able to actually start a full-service Chinese tractor sales and service facility. I've already got my brand name ready, and a theme to go with it. Right now my trucking business is slow and hurting me financially. I'd much rather be assembling tractors and running a tractor shop for my area. I'll keep my trucking equipment for transporting these tractors. Heck of an idea but need start up capitol first. Maybe I'll get lucky and someones rich uncle will leave me 3-40 foot containers (48-units) of unbranded Jinma tractors in his will when he passes on to the next life. Sorry, for the rambling. I tend to do that in my old age, LOL.

 

[bluechip]

just be sure the banjo bolt with the check valve is on the same side of the pump that it was on the old pump. The bolts could have been reversed during the injector pump change. One of my guys did this on the first injector pump replacment we did and the tractor would run a few seconds then die, pump it up and it would start again, then die. took me an hour to figure out what he had done. The one I did was a 3 cylinder and I don't have any 2 cylinders left to look at to see if it is the same, but as I recall the check valve should be in the flow after the head of the injector pump, not before the head.

 

[Diamondpilot]

I see you are in Indiana. I live in the Anderson Muncie area and have been around these tractors for the last 4 years as a owner and helping other owners with repairs. If you need a hand and I am near let me know. There are 3 mechanics in my area that I know of that work on these routinely. Maybe they can help. Another place you might try for help is Chinese Tractor Owners Association - Helping Each Other With Knowledge

Chris

 

[kingjames8283]

Hey Chip, to reiterate I think you've just hit upon something that I and probably others may have been blind to. What you refer to as a check valve is listed in the parts catalog as an "Over-Flow valve". This bolt has a spring loaded ball inside but according to pictures found this valve is found before the fuel injection manifold head. I've got the valve in my hand right now, and looking at this setup it shouldn't work, period. According to their pictures, fuel would be stopped before it can reach the injector pump. Your idea of this overflow valve being mounted aft the injection pump on the low pressure return line back to the fuel tank makes more sense. This line I'm not going to change and will leave as a banjo fitting. All other lines from fuel tank, and to / from the fuel filter and line to fuel intake manifold I am switching to brass compression fittings with nylon fuel hose.

Remember that someone else had attempted work on this tractor before I got to it, and in fact had mounted a new hand primer. They also had changed fuel lines around which was my first order of business when I started working on this tractor. With that said, when I get back to working on this tractor, I'm going to remount this "Check Valve / banjo bolt on the side of the fuel pump manifold that sends the fuel back to the fuel tank. Thank you for the clue because I would have never thought to check that. I guarantee this tractor will be running this weekend and the owner will be so thrilled to have her back running again for the first time in over 9 months. Thank you Chip, you are a godsend.

 

[kingjames8283]

Hello everyone again, I have some new information I just learned that could've been the reason why this mans tractor will not start anymore. Following Chips lead, I have done everything and checked everything that I've been instructed to except for one critical component. The steel braided / rubber fuel lines. When I continued to get a rock hard (no pun intended) primer pump after all the work that I've done then I did one more step, I pulled that fuel line off the positive side of the booster pump. The primer instantly relaxed and I pulled the other end off the fuel filter housing and attempted to blow through the line, NOTHING Happened. Went to the local hydraulic shop to have new fuel lines made this time out of fuel/chemical grade nylon tubing. While there we took one of the fuel lines and cut it in half and low and behold there was our problem the entire time. The rubber inside the hose had deteriorated and collapsed. Mind you this is a new FarmPro tractor with only 24 total hours on the meter. This tractor is still like brand spanking new, hardly used when it shutdown almost a year ago. It has taken me 5 weekends to find this problem. I am now removing all the steel braided rubber fuel lines off this tractor and replacing with Nylon Tubing used exclusively for chemical / gas / diesel / kero / hydraulic fluid. My word of warning to everyone with these tractors, be prepared to spend some money to upgrade away from the rubber fuel lines that your tractor was shipped with. My new problem is to find special brass adapters that will convert fuel injection pump from Chinese threads to American treads. The hoses are made with American S.A.E. grade hoses and fittings but to use them with Chinese fuel systems requires special adapters with a Chinese male threaded end, and an American female threaded end. Once these adapters are installed, they never ever have to be removed ever again. They are treated as permanent fixtures in the fuel system plumbing.

I will not be able to start engine until I have found the adapters but I'm confident that once completed it will be a thing of the past and never to be dealt with ever again. For those of you that have knowledge of working with steel tubing, consider replacing your rubber fuel hoses to all steel just like your high pressure lines to the injector nozzles. Just remember to reinstall the check-valve on the out port of the injection pump manifold for the low-pressure return line going back to the injector head overflow and back to the fuel tank. Do not attempt to by-pass the check-valve, and never close off that port. Excess fuel must be able to escape back to the fuel tank, if not it will destroy your pump and nozzles, and could potentially explode and catch fire and if you think it won't believe me it will. Years ago we lost a very large Caterpillar front end loader to such fire. It happened so fast the operator had to leap from the machine while it was still rolling. Within minutes the huge tractor tires exploded and melted the machine into the ground.

If you don't know fuel and hydraulic systems, don't mess with them. Let an experienced mechanic or certified shop repair or modify them. The higher up front costs could save your life on down the line. I do not joke when it comes to safety. If your not sure about repairing or servicing your own tractor, have someone show you or let someone else with that knowledge do it for you. Don't put your life at risk. I have 23 years experience with diesel rigs and heavy equipment and I still get hurt.

 

[greg_g]

I blew a flex line with only 8 hours on my KM454. Mowing along, then all of a sudden there was an eight foot cloud of diesel fuel spraying off the right side of the engine. Took the bad hose to the area hydraulic shop to replace the flex section with new. They were able to use the original banjo fittings, so no adapters were required. It just took a little grinding to separate the hose from the fittings, stuck the fittings onto the new section of hose, and sealed them up with machine-pressed stainless clamps

//greg//