Crawler-loader-backhoes...

[cmsedore]

A little background: after I bought my Kubota L4610, I really wanted to add a backhoe to it. I looked at Bradco and Kubota hoes and thought for a thousand or three more than the $8-9k they cost, I could buy a mini-excavator or a older full-size TLB.

Recently, I've gotten more interested in a crawler-loader-backhoe. They seem to be uncommon and I assume there must be a reason.

My needs are not that dramatic--I have some field clearing to do, mostly small stuff up to 8-10", with a few trees going 15" (I've been pushing the smaller trees over with the L4610). I'd like to dig a fairly large pond (100x200 or maybe 200x300). On the hoe end of things, I have some stumps I'd like to dig out and some other cleanup tasks (I'd like to add a thumb).

Anyway, I thought I'd ask what these machines were built for (are they a compromise that noone wants?) and whether a CLB would meet my varied needs. The pond and field clearing are what leads me to the crawler--it seems like the right tool for that job. I think that most of the digging I have to do could be done with a smaller hoe or a mini-excavator.

Any thoughts or comments would be appreciated.

-Chris

 

[turbotec]

I have a JD455D with an old model 93 backhoe. A very stable and powerful setup. Backhoe can get in the way when using the loader. More space required to turn.
Tony

 

[RonL]

Chris

A crawler loader backhoe is perhaps THE universal machine if you have only one machine. But it is like the jack of all trades, master of none. With a four way loader bucket you can load, pick up objects, back drag, and doze. The problem with dozing with the four way bucket is that you don't have tilt and angle. The disadvantage of a crawler is that it is less efficient at transporting over distance. In other words, if you are excavating and then transporting the spoils a distance away, the wheeled loader is more efficient. I had considered getting a crawler loader backhoe to develope my property but ended up getting a wheeled backhoe ( Cat 416C IT ) and a small dozer with six way blade ( Cat D3G ). If I retire early I will keep both machines and do work on the side. If I don't retire early I will probably sell the dozer and keep the backhoe. A tracked machine is less usefull on a property that is already developed.

A crawler loader backhoe may be a good complement to a CUT for developing a property. It will have the power to do the serious work.

RonL

 

[theonlybull]

be carefull with used crawler loaders too, they tend to have alot of worn out parts. crawlers use alot of track parts, steering clutches, and such. it's had to beat a rubber tired hoe, and a tracked dozor...

 

[cmsedore]

That was one of my follow-up questions. I'm reasonably comfortable evaluating rubber-tired machinery, but know little about crawlers. I understand that the sprockets should not be worn to points, that the idlers should all turn, adjusters should be free and not fully extended, etc, but I'm not as sure how to evaluate the undercarriage more generally. I assume you need to drive it (not easy if you need to get it from some distance away--they seem expensive and rare in Update NY) and operate the loader and hoe to make sure they don't have too much slop.

Any tips here, or pointers to sites on evaluating crawlers/dozers? My fear is that you really need experience, and, as they say, experience comes from making mistakes. I'm hoping to avoid a 'great deal' that leaves me with $10k+ of repairs to do... On the other hand, if that is what is expected, maybe I should just look for an older TLB or a mini-excavator that I can get more history on and avoid the crawlers.

-Chris

 

[Dozernut]

Check the chain wear by using the most sensitive tool ever built by man, your hand. Simply reach in and touch the chain on the roller portion of the links. They should feel round, if they feel oval or oblong, then you have substantial wear on the chain. As you mentioned sharp points on the sprockets are not good. When the sprockets get too worn, the sprockets can skip or jump links. Be careful of shady dealers who will tighten tracks taught so the sprockets won't skip and they can load the machine for transport. Beware of a machine that has been freshly painted. Sometimes this is a five gallon overhaul. This is done by the shady seller to disguise a worn out machine. Look it over good, check for leaks and if possible have the oil checked by a lab, this will tell you a lot. Good luck!

 

[Egon]

Dozernut:

Long time since I've heard of the 5 Gallon Overhaul.

Egon

 

[puter]

After doing tons of research over the course of a couple years, a few months ago I picked up a JD-450c crawler-loader-backhoe specifically to be a "jack-of-all-trades" type machine (I don't have a CUT). I couldn't be happier. Since I plan to keep the machine for a long time, I opted for an older machine with seemingly sound engine, pumps and undercarriage, that hadn't been "prettied up." I haven't had to, but figured I could put several thousand dollars in repairs into the machine, making sure they were done right, and still be way ahead of the game.

If you have construction-type jobs and are operating in an area where you don't need to be overly concerned about messing up a groomed lawn, they're great machines. Spec-wise, about three times the machine of the new CUT I _really_ wanted, at one third the price.

Potential downsides: 1) No 3-point hitch, 2) Not good in delicate areas, 3) Possible big maintenance bills.

I've been ripping lots of stumps out of the ground, many 10-18" across and can't imagine doing that with a smaller backhoe. Plus, it's a blast.

The backhoe comes off with about 20 minutes work. Remember that even a pretty well used undercarriage could last a long time in a residential environment.

 

[puter]

Here's an article about evaluating track wear. If you're looking at a machine from a manufacturer with a large dealer network (like JD) you might want to consider paying for one of their mechanics to go look the machine over for you.

 

[cmsedore]

Thanks for your comments--they are very helpful. Where did you find your machine? Dealer, classifieds, ebay?

Thanks for the pointer to the article on track wear, too, there was quite a bit in there that I did not fully understand before reading it.

-Chris