Case 450c Dozer $$$$

[johnnyringo]

Anyone have any experience with a Case 450c dozer? A guy down the road has one for sale - asking $17,000. It has 4100 hours and is in very good shape. He said when he bought it two years ago that the undercarriage was at 65%. He has used it alot around his place but that is one of the things that makes me trust it more than others is that I've seen him use it almost every weekend for two years. He just cleaned out his pond with it. He thought it was a 1986 model.

Does this price sound in the ballpark? I've looked at machinery trader and it seems to be but that site seems to have high prices. But asking and getting are two different things.

Reliability? Parts? Any info on this model dozer is greatly appreciated.

 

[Dargo]

/forums/images/graemlins/shocked.gif Unless those things turned to gold, that sounds extremely high! Before I had purchased my Cat 955, I had a nice Case 450. It too was an older one, but was in decent shape. I ended up having to repack the lift cylinders and had to replace the cutting brakes, which was a bit more of a PIA, but cost me less than $500 to do both. Anyway, this was about 10 years or more ago and I paid something like $7500 for it way back then. I used it for 2 years before I upgraded to the larger Cat, and was able to sell my 450 for $8000, and it only had 2200 hours on it. I was thrilled to get 8k out of it and it, and the guy is still using it. The only thing he has had to do since then was change one of the front idlers which cost him arounb $450. Maybe I'm way off on what current prices are, but an older Case 450 in decent condition would seem to be worth around 7k to 8k. Again, maybe I'm wrong, but he sounds nearly $10,000 high! Is he selling two 2000 hour units for that price? /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

** Oh yeah, I forgot, I had to also replace the hose that comes right out of the pump. The pump is right in the front, but you have to drop all the bottom skid pans to get to it. Mine was also a high lift machine with a 4 way bucket. Anyway, the total cost of the repair then was only $45, but was the biggest PIA repair I've ever done. I was cleaning out the crumbs in the bottom of my lake I'd dug and was scooping the loose stuff into the bottom of my island and using the island as a back stop to help fill my bucket. When lifting a full bucket against the island, the hose blew and the full bucked dropped with about 4000 pounds of wet sticky clay in the bucket. I had no hydraulics at all to lift the bucket or dump the bucket, and I was pointed down hill and into the bottom of the island sitting in 6" of cold muddy water. The dozer would not back out and all of the equipment I owned couldn't drag it backwards.

I had to lay under that dozer in 6" of water and use a 1" socket set to remove the entire skid pan under the dozer. When I got to the pump, it took a 60" aluminum pipe wrench to get the hose off! /forums/images/graemlins/mad.gif That sucked!!!! Anyway, as I said, I got it going with a new hose that cost me all of $45. Once I had hydraulics again, I was able to easily raise my bucket and back right out.

The only reason I mention these 'expected' repairs (expected on an older dozer) is to let you know that if you can turn a wrench yourself, parts and repairs are generally rather inexpensive and parts can be had pretty easily. I've since bought about 200 additional acres and would love to have another 955 Cat if I could get one for a decent price. I think the 450 Case had around 60 hp (just guessing from memory - don't kill me if I'm wrong), and the Cat had around 100 hp or so. On both machines it took very little money and just a bit of time to get all of the hydraulics really tight and they were a dream to operate. Repacking cylinders, changing pins and bushings sound like a daunting task, but is really easy to do once you buy the right size tools. You can generally find those in a pawn shop because people don't want stuff that big if they no longer have the equipment.

With digging my lake and completely changing the topography of about 12 acres around my house, I'd bet I have 3000 to 4000 hours on those machines. They are great to have. As I said, I wish I still had my Cat. However, I honestly think the price you are talking about is about double what it's worth. Good luck. If you have any specific questions, feel free to PM me. I bet I still have shop manuals around somewhere and I definitely recall how to work on them in my sleep. /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif


** edit **

Just to see if I was way off, I went to eBay to see about a Case 450 dozer for sale. Here is one that has no bids on it after a week and the opening bid is $8000. It is a 450b, so it may be a couple of years older, but still he is not having any bites at 8k. Here is that auction: 455b

 

[johnnyringo]

I just looked on the net and I can't find any priced for $7000 or $8000 but you sound like you definitely have experience with a 450c. We have a regional magazine here for heavy equipment and I think I'll pick one up tonight and do some more research.

What year was yours? The only years I have found on the net are around 85-90. Don't know if they made them before that or not.

Thanks for the help. I will definitely do some more research on prices. It's also nice to hear someone else gets involved in those nightmare repair situations.

Edit -

Just got your last post - $17,000 is starting to look high.

 

[EddieWalker]

Johnnyringo,

I think $17,000 is on the high side for that dozer. Too old, too many hours and too small of a machine for such a high price.

Machinery Trader is a real bad source for prices as are the other publications out there that are nothing but dealer ads. They just put their cream in the ads and prices are always on the high end for their very best stuff.

If you check out their websites in your area, you may find something more reasonable. That's how I came across my dozer.

Ebay is also crazy on prices. Not a good source unless you watch them to the end and see what they sold for. Usualy the real bidding happens in the last ten minutes.

Try http://www.equipmenttraderonline.com/ for prices in your area. This is where the dealers list just about everything they have along with the people who own the eqipment and are selling themselves.

http://www.americanclassifieds.com is also another good source if they have listings in your area. Ive found some really good deals on implements, tools and stuff I needed here. I check the website religously every Thursday morning.

Now to the size of the dozer. A 450 Case dozer is just about as small as you can get. Small is good if your hauling it around or smoothing out the dirt back into a trench, but not much else. Maybe cutting a trail through the woods if all you have is some shrubs and saplings.

Cleaning a pond means it was a very, very small pond, because the blade is way too small for moving any dirt. But if you got it stuck, it's light enough that it won't be too hard to get untsuck.

Before buying a dozer, you really need to know what you plan to do with it so you can get the right sized machine.

Once you determine how much HP you need, than you can figure out how new a machine you can afford.

And before you buy anything, bring somebody along who knows dozers. You said that little 450 had 65 percent left on it's undercairage when the neighbor bought it. What is it at now? Have the bushings been turned? Is the sprocket one piece or five? One piece sprockets are a real pain to change, five piece are real easy. The undercairage is where you will sink allot of cash and the main reason allot of dozers are sold. It isn't uncommon to spend $5,000 on them.

Good luck.
Eddie

 

[Chillimau]

Eddie

Do you ever to over to the auction in Idabel, OK? Wondering if that might be a good place to look for equipment.

 

[EddieWalker]

Gary,

I've been to a few auctions around my area, but that's about it. Of the tractors I've seen at an auction, it's only for those who really know what they are looking for.

My dozer was giving me some problems with the hydraulic pumps. All three of them, both drive pumps and the blade pump. I had the mechanic at Case look at it and he said the pumps all went out at the same time. Cost for three pumps is $60,000. No way I'm putting that much into a dozer that cost me $25,000.

Anyway, they said that I shoudl put the dozer up for auction and let somebody else deal with it. No gurantee at auctions and until the engine warmed up and ran for about an hour, it would have a total loss of power.

It ended up being a clog in the main supply line that ended up clearing itself, but what I'm trying to get across is that people sell equipment at auctions to avoid fixing them and not having to be responsible for lying about it being broken. Auction sales are "As is" and buyer beware.

I know not all tractors and equiment sold at action are hiding issues, but that's also why I said to be sure to have somebody who really knows the equimpment before buying.

Eddie

 

[Chillimau]

Eddie,

Thank you for the advice. I am just starting to educate myself on a loader backhoe. My wife has an uncle that has owned and used some heavy equipment. He lives in NC, might be out here this summer, hopefully I can talk him into showing me some things to look for on the equipment. I will keep reading and probably have more questions.

Thanks again,

 

[Syncro]

For what its worth on auctions, there is a better chance of getting a good used machine at utility co auctions or municiple (county, city, state etc) auctions. Most often gov't or company machines are well maintined with service records. Also, often good equip is sold because of excess inventory or other reasons and not because they were worn out, but of course not always.

 

[hutch8429]

this is high for where I am, just sold one for less than half that,,It cranked good ran good had breaks, undercarrage 60%.The only thing the tracks had 6 or 8 links that was stiff. I tried grtting them loose,ended up at ER with a peace on hammer in my ankle,so I let it go.It had a new crate 390 tubo in it. you can look around and find them for a lot less if you dont get in a hurry. I like case ,the parts are easy to get,The 450C has wet brakes, this is a big plus,I have had a 450B that was dry brake, I have had a 455c loader that had good brakes when I sold it.I dont think you will go wrong with a case tractor.

 

[20 20]

I'd say that is VERY high, did you check machine trader?