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  1. #1
    Member
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    Apr 2008
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    49
    Location
    Millhaven, Ontario, Canada
    Tractor
    Massey Ferguson 1532, Bolens G174

    Default Loader Third Valve Function

    I am in the process of planning two projects for my tractor, one is a 4 in 1 bucket and a snowplow on the loader arms. Both of these will be built from scratch based on other models I have seen in real life and on other posts here. The first step is to get a third function somewhere on the loader to operate the rams of these tools. I have never had the oportunity to run this setup and was wondering which set of lines I should tie the third function into (Up/down or dump/curl)? Is there at standard? I am thinking it should be the dump/curl.
    Marc, Kathlin, Nathalie
    Kahlua (Chocolate Lab)

    Massey Ferguson 1532

  2. #2
    Gold Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
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    349
    Location
    South Texas
    Tractor
    2005 JD 5103

    Default Re: Loader Third Valve Function

    From what I have read, most use the curl function. I believe the grapples, etc. are tied into the curl circuit. I don't have one so I can't say for sure, just from what I have read.
    JD 5103, 512 FEL w/bucket, home-made front bale spear, 60" Armstrong Ag box blade, Rhino SE6 rotary mower, 5' JD 3-point disc, home-made 26'-200 gallon sprayer

  3. #3
    Super Star Member Diamondpilot's Avatar
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    Jan 2007
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    14,954
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    Daleville, IN
    Tractor
    Jinma 254/284 Ford 861 Powermaster at work

    Default Re: Loader Third Valve Function

    I would find out what valve you have on your loader, who makes it. The see if it has a power beyond option and tap off there for a 3rd function. On my valve for example I can still have lift and curl with a electric 3rd function that puts a rocker switch on top of the loader control to activate the 3rd function, what ever that may be. Seem to be the best option to me..

    Chris

  4. #4
    Elite Member Ductape's Avatar
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    Feb 2006
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    4,855
    Location
    Central New Hampshire
    Tractor
    Kubota B3030HSDC

    Default Re: Loader Third Valve Function

    They are run off the curl/dump circuit............... but I'm with Diamond pilot. I'd recommend you run an electric solenoid valve for true third function instead of a diverter off the curl/dump. Theres lots of reading here on the subject, so you can make an informed decision on whats best for you.

  5. #5
    Platinum Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Posts
    706
    Location
    Columbus, Georgia
    Tractor
    Kuborta B2400, L2900, L4330; Caterpillar D3B, John Deere 455D

    Default Re: Loader Third Valve Function

    Marc:

    There may be a terminology problem. "Third function" to most readers means a spool valve inserted in the power beyond circuit of the FEL valve. It is almost, but not quite, the same as if there were a third spool (and related handle) on the FEL valve body to control the plow, grapple, etc. Although the third function valve can be a simple manual single spool valve, it would require a separate lever to operate it and, for most of us, more hands than occur naturally. Therefore, most third function valves are electromagnetic; that is, they are operated with a switch on the FEL valve handle (joystick). The only disadvantage (if at all) is that the reasonably priced electromagnetic single spool directional control valves are not proportional; you flip the switch one way and the plow swivels left at full speed; you flip it the other way and the plow swivels right at full speed. Most people address this problem by using small (1/4") lines for the third function valve work circuit to slow down the fluid. For a few more dollars you can install adjustable flow control valves in the circuit, or for a very few dollars you can install fixed orifice flow restrictors in the lines to the plow.

    The alternate approach is to install a diverter valve (also called a selector valve) in either the lift or the curl circuit of the fel (usually the curl circuit). The selector valve is electrically operated (it can be manual, but those are awkward when you shift back and forth a lot). In one position (usually the rest position), it connects the curl spool (and work ports) to the FEL bucket, so when you move the joystick left or right it curls or dumps the bucket. But when you push the button (installed on the joystick) to activate the selector valve, it shifts the curl work ports to the additional cylinders, say the plow. So when the button is held down, moving the joystick left angles the plow to the left and moving the joystick right angles the plow to the right. The advantage of the selector valve is that the proportional flow control of the jolystick is maintained for both the original curl function and the new plow function. You can swivel the plow fast or slow, as you choose.

    The commonly stated objection to the selector valve is that you can't operate the curl and the new function at the same time. Whereas, with the third function, you can activate the third function while activating the curl (as long as the curl spool is not fully shifted; that would block all fluid flow to the downstream third function valve). But there are selector valves that allow you to select either function separately (curl or plow) or both functions at the same time (curl and plow). That is, if you select both functions the curl and plow for example are connected in parallel, much like the curl and lift circuits in most FEL's. It requires a slightly more complicated switch.

    I use the selector valve because I like the proportional control of the added circuit and because with the grapple it is easier to pick up objects like rocks with the curl and grapple circuits in parallel. But I am in the minority; most readers, I think, prefer the third function valve. I am sure you will hear from them on the benefits of that method.

    Good luck and send pictures.

  6. #6
    Advertiser kennyd's Avatar
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    Westminster, MD
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    John Deere 4110, 455

    Default Re: Loader Third Valve Function

    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
    What FF wrote is EXACTLY the proper reply to your question Millhaven. I would only add to it by suggesting your search in the Hydraulics forum where these questions have been asked/answered 100's of times.

    Some search terms include:
    diverter
    3rd function
    remote
    snowplow
    grapple
    wr long
    markham
    millonzi
    tatro
    KennyD
    www.boltonhooks.com



    Bolt On Grab Hooks, Weld On Grab Hooks, Specialty Chain and Rigging Accessories, Specialty Hydraulic Components.

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  7. #7
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
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    49
    Location
    Millhaven, Ontario, Canada
    Tractor
    Massey Ferguson 1532, Bolens G174

    Default Re: Loader Third Valve Function

    I was planning to use the electric solenoid activated "selector valve" as Farmerford described and he seems to have answered my dilemna. I want to do exactly as he does...Divert the joystick dump/curl to operate either my plow or 4 in 1. I don't have the full manuals for my 1532 so I don't know what the hydraulic circuit is like but I can't even get a straight answer out of the dealer as to whether or not I have a power beyond circuit available. All they want to do is sell me the kit for $1000 that gives me all the pieces for a dual rear remote setup.

    I have searched the forums and read many posts but was basically looking for which circuit to divert... Thought people may have regretted one or the other.
    Marc, Kathlin, Nathalie
    Kahlua (Chocolate Lab)

    Massey Ferguson 1532

  8. #8
    Super Star Member J_J's Avatar
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    Sep 2003
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    JACKSONVILLE, FL
    Tractor
    Power-Trac 1445, KUBOTA B-9200HST

    Default Re: Loader Third Valve Function

    Quote Originally Posted by millhaven_nice_guy View Post
    I was planning to use the electric solenoid activated "selector valve" as Farmerford described and he seems to have answered my dilemna. I want to do exactly as he does...Divert the joystick dump/curl to operate either my plow or 4 in 1. I don't have the full manuals for my 1532 so I don't know what the hydraulic circuit is like but I can't even get a straight answer out of the dealer as to whether or not I have a power beyond circuit available. All they want to do is sell me the kit for $1000 that gives me all the pieces for a dual rear remote setup.

    I have searched the forums and read many posts but was basically looking for which circuit to divert... Thought people may have regretted one or the other.
    Are you talking to the salesman or the mechanic in the shop. If the mechanic doesn't know, then he should not be working there.

    As far as proportional movements go, the electric valve can be bumped in small amounts or held down longer. The smaller lines just give slower movement. The buttons on the switch should be momentary, and spring centered, otherwise, no movement will occur unless you touch the switch,
    J.J.

    When I works, I works hard. When I sits and thinks, I goes to sleep.

    Git er done.

  9. #9
    Member
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    Aug 2010
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    38
    Location
    angleton texas
    Tractor
    john deere 990 & 5310 new holland tn 65

    Default Re: Loader Third Valve Function

    I want to build in the electric operated valve, found one, but now I am looking to add the switch, does anybody know where you can find the switch with goes over the joystick handle to operate the third function?
    Pete.

  10. #10
    Super Star Member J_J's Avatar
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    JACKSONVILLE, FL
    Tractor
    Power-Trac 1445, KUBOTA B-9200HST

    Default Re: Loader Third Valve Function

    J.J.

    When I works, I works hard. When I sits and thinks, I goes to sleep.

    Git er done.

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