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  1. #21
    Bronze Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    58
    Location
    Goochland, Va
    Tractor
    Bobcat 773

    Default Re: Winch

    I use a pull line to bring large trees down on a regular basis and have found that I have to rely on the tractor or truck to move fast enough to keep the line tight enough to guide the fall. Having 2 people is an absolute must - one on the saw the other on the pull line driving the tractor.

    I actually prefer using 5/8" bull rope (11K lb breaking strength) because I can toss a throw line into the canopy then use that to pull the larger rope into the tree and put a bowline (slip knot) in. This lets you get leverage MUCH higher in the tree which is a lot safer (as long as you dont pull too hard). I then secure the other end to my skid steer through a redirect (large pulley at the base of another tree) so that I am pulling outside the fall zone.

  2. #22
    Veteran Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Posts
    1,337
    Location
    Kansas...USA
    Tractor
    Kubota B2620 (2012)

    Default Re: Winch

    Quote Originally Posted by gwiley View Post
    I use a pull line to bring large trees down on a regular basis and have found that I have to rely on the tractor or truck to move fast enough to keep the line tight enough to guide the fall. Having 2 people is an absolute must - one on the saw the other on the pull line driving the tractor.

    I actually prefer using 5/8" bull rope (11K lb breaking strength) because I can toss a throw line into the canopy then use that to pull the larger rope into the tree and put a bowline (slip knot) in. This lets you get leverage MUCH higher in the tree which is a lot safer (as long as you dont pull too hard). I then secure the other end to my skid steer through a redirect (large pulley at the base of another tree) so that I am pulling outside the fall zone.
    That's my method also.....one person on the saw and me in the F250....with the rope attached to the front tow hooks. It makes for a controlled fall. But not every situation allows for the space and truck, however.
    Kubota B2620 HST

  3. #23
    Bronze Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Posts
    68
    Location
    Pakihi New Zealand
    Tractor
    YCT306S-S bulldozer Bobcat 743 skidsteer Leyland 344 tractor

    Default Re: Winch

    Quote Originally Posted by jake98 View Post
    Runva electric winches look a lot like a Superwinch, maybe they're made in the same place. After using mine for a couple hours, the idea that it would be a temporary installation is out the window. I think I'll order another snatch block so I can use two, one up high on the tree dragging end, and another down low, so I don't lift the tractor. Besides, using one looks too much like a sling-shot aimed at my head. I have to skid pan it too, to protect the wires on the bottom. I would have mounted it the other way, but that would have put the cable slot on top of the mount and weakened it. (probably could have wound the cable the opposite way on the drum, and run it backward, now that I think of it.. 20:20 hindsight) anybody know if the winch cares?
    On my Landcruiser I have a 9000-pound Come up electric winch that was made in Taiwan I believe they also make the gearbox and drum for Superwinch. I have been told Superwinch assemble with an American motor wire rope and a few other parts to get it up to the correct percentage so they can label it 杜ade in USA
    The Runva winch is of similar design but much heavier with cast steel casing痴 fine on a bulldozer but would be to heavy on a 4x4 front bumper the Come up winch has alloy casing and not so hard on the Landcruiser front suspension

  4. #24
    Veteran Member tungularafishcamp's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Posts
    1,318
    Location
    kodiak island, Alaska
    Tractor
    kubota L2800, 1/2 of a L48

    Default Re: Winch

    Quote Originally Posted by oldballs View Post
    That's my method also.....one person on the saw and me in the F250....with the rope attached to the front tow hooks. It makes for a controlled fall. But not every situation allows for the space and truck, however.
    That and you might not always have an extra set of hands available. I had a couple of doug firs leaning 180 from my desired direction of fall last winter and I just cut a small box into the backside of the tree with the tip of my saw so the backcut went thru the middle of the box, made the face cut, started the back cut so the chain past the box, then stopped and put a bottle jack in the box and just jacked the tree over in the desired direction. It was quicker and easier than using the winch and I didnt need anyone else to help, just go slow alternating jacking and sawing, maybe do a practice tree first. Take it safe, slow, and easy Jake and have fun!
    Rick

  5. #25
    Gold Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    378
    Location
    NSW Australia
    Tractor
    Tractors16-600hp Farm & Earthmoving Equip, Trucks etc.

    Default Re: Winch

    We regularly use winches to drop trees & apart from a logging winch attached to our D7 size dozer (which even I am sceptical about using as an anchor for larger trees) there's no way I'd advocate using a winch attached to any lighter machine or vehicle - people understimate the forces & loads even a relatively small tree can exert with catastrophic results

    Our experience has found the safest way to use electric winches, we use Warns a XD9000 & 120000 ( with either a stand alone battery or power cables running to machines) , is to mount the winch in a portable frame & anchor/chain to another tree away from your intended direction of fall running the cable through a snatch block pulley anchored to second tree where you wish to direct the tree you're felling, requires:
    - Two people, 1x operating the winch & 1x chainsawing who both know what they are doing & are coordinated with agreed hand signals/escape plans
    - Secure the winch & pulley as low as possbie on the anchor trees & the winch cable hook to a chain as high as possible on the main trunk of the tree you're felling
    - Initial winch cable tension only minimally taut (not fully loaded) on the felling tree
    - Usually a humbolt cut controlling the intended direction of fall which also minimises the risk of a barber chair/shattering &/or the tree bouncing on the stump
    - Gradually increase in the winch cable tension as the back cut commences, it's imperative that the hinge is even/square (from both humbolt & backcut) & that the tree is felled from increasing/continuing the winch tension pull until the tree is on the ground - and NOT by the chainsaw severing/diminishing the hinge (which can lead to the tree spinning/changing direction or shattering in a barber chair) .

    Take care.
    Last edited by MBTRAC; 12-11-2012 at 10:30 PM.

  6. #26
    Elite Member Baby Grand's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    3,791
    Location
    Windsor, CT.
    Tractor
    Kubotas: L3240GST B2320HST B5100D & G5200H

    Default Re: Winch

    Quote Originally Posted by MBTRAC View Post
    We regularly use winches to drop trees & apart from a logging winch attached to our D7 size dozer (which even I am sceptical about using as an anchor for larger trees) there's no way I'd advocate using a winch attached to any lighter machine or vehicle - people understimate the forces & loads even a relatively small tree can exert with catastrophic results

    <snip>
    Thanks for confirming my suspicion. Something about having a 5000# tractor directly attached to a 10000# tree that is in free fall with the chain making a 30 degree angle to the trunk makes me think you're going for a fast ride to wherever the tree is inclined to take you if you don't have some kind of fuse (shear bolt, clutch, etc) to let go for you.
    That's the problem with trouble.
    It always starts out as such fun."
    - Randall Brown

  7. #27
    Elite Member johnk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Posts
    2,624
    Location
    western NY
    Tractor
    Kubota GST Grand L3130 w/ 723 loader, Ags

    Default Re: Winch

    Quote Originally Posted by Baby Grand View Post
    Thanks for confirming my suspicion. Something about having a 5000# tractor directly attached to a 10000# tree that is in free fall with the chain making a 30 degree angle to the trunk makes me think you're going for a fast ride to wherever the tree is inclined to take you if you don't have some kind of fuse (shear bolt, clutch, etc) to let go for you.


    I second those feelings............. Have to be careful out there. Can't underestimate safety...
    Kubota grand L 3130; 723 loader; Hinged back Box Scraper; 7' HD Back Blade; Tooth Bar; PHD w/ 9 & 12 Inch Auger; PEC; Carryall

  8. #28
    Veteran Member jake98's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    1,910
    Location
    Dingmans Ferry PA
    Tractor
    53 Cub, 70's JD 410, Kioti 25hst

    Default Re: Winch

    I put the bucket up against another tree, (I'm not a total idiot..) that's why I put the winch on the front.
    Kioti CK 25 Hydro: box blade, brush hog, rake, roto-till, grapple, bucket forks, de-stump cyl, Wallenstein Chipper
    John Deere 410 Backhoe Loader: 25 hoses ready to blow


    Thus by the beneficence of Providence, we shall behold our empire arising, founded on justice and the voluntary consent of the people, and giving full scope to the exercise of those faculties and rights which most ennoble our species.

    Samuel Adams

  9. #29
    Veteran Member jake98's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    1,910
    Location
    Dingmans Ferry PA
    Tractor
    53 Cub, 70's JD 410, Kioti 25hst

    Default Re: Winch

    Quote Originally Posted by tungularafishcamp View Post
    That and you might not always have an extra set of hands available. I had a couple of doug firs leaning 180 from my desired direction of fall last winter and I just cut a small box into the backside of the tree with the tip of my saw so the backcut went thru the middle of the box, made the face cut, started the back cut so the chain past the box, then stopped and put a bottle jack in the box and just jacked the tree over in the desired direction. It was quicker and easier than using the winch and I didnt need anyone else to help, just go slow alternating jacking and sawing, maybe do a practice tree first. Take it safe, slow, and easy Jake and have fun!
    That's an interesting method Rick, thanks, I'll maybe try that some day.
    Kioti CK 25 Hydro: box blade, brush hog, rake, roto-till, grapple, bucket forks, de-stump cyl, Wallenstein Chipper
    John Deere 410 Backhoe Loader: 25 hoses ready to blow


    Thus by the beneficence of Providence, we shall behold our empire arising, founded on justice and the voluntary consent of the people, and giving full scope to the exercise of those faculties and rights which most ennoble our species.

    Samuel Adams

  10. #30
    Veteran Member dstig1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Posts
    2,213
    Location
    W Wisc
    Tractor
    Kubota L5240 HSTC, (Kubota L3130 HST - sold)

    Default Re: Winch

    The jack method is a pretty common one for large trees. Like this:



    Or you can just do it old school with wedges :-)

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=leM-d2tIZts
    (can't put more than one video in a post I guess...)
    I love this video every time I look it up. Don't worry, it was a dead tree which is why they were cutting it. That is why all the water is pouring out of it during the cuts.

    From a winch standpoint, a PTO logging winch works great for this. Still a 2-person operation (not possible with one person as you have to be holding the winch rope for it to do anything), but if something starts going in the wrong direction, you let go and the winch can freewheel out so it won't drag your tractor around. Plus they pull a lot faster than normal electric winches, so you can keep ahead of the early moves of a tree tipping reasonably well. OBVIOUSLY you need to use your brain on this. When I have done it with a friend, we used a long rope to attach to the tree and the tractor was far enough away that it could not be hit. Allowing plenty of cable left on the drum to pay out if trouble strikes is another key point. It is felling trees - there is always something that can go wrong, but you can do a lot of things to put the tree where you want it and do it pretty safely with some experience and thinking it through.
    -Dave

    "Being a pessimist is great. You can't lose. Either you end up being right...or you are pleasantly surprised."

    L5240HST, QA, 824 Loader, 48" Forks, 48" Grapple, rear blade, box blade, landscape rake, Ancient Farmi Skidding winch
    Trailer - 10k/16' twin axle w/elec brakes
    2005 F250 5.4V8(3V) 3.73/4wd tow vehicle

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