For 1.5 acres - premium vs. economy models

[canoetrpr]

I have about 1.5 acres of lawn to care for. My new Kubota CUT takes care of the other 25 . We have only about 20 weeks or so of grass cutting so I figure about 30 hours per year.

Since the bota drained out my chequing account, I'm being very price sensitive on the lawn tractor purchase.

My lawn is fairly flat - few trees. I am mowing it with a cheepo craftsman mower that I used in my old postage stamp sized backyard in suburbia but it takes FOREVER to cut the grass with it here.

I have found that there is about a 50% price difference from the economy models of lawn tractors to the premium ones.

A few good examples are the JD 100 series - 125 for example and the JD 300 series. Another two I have priced out are the Husqvarna YT1042T and YTH154XPT.

Now I really don't think I care about features like a hydro transmission vs. gear in my lawn tractor, or electric clutch vs. manual. I splurged for hydro on the CUT so I can live without it here.

I do notice other differences like the premiums tend to have Kawasaki engines versus Kohler Courage.

I'd love to go with a Kubota lawn tractor as well - but again the price is about 50% higher than a non premium.

I'd very much appreciate your input on whether the 50% jump in price is really going to be worthwhile to me for the basic things I care about. I want a good solid machine that I will take care of and I expect to last for a reasonable amont of time - 15 years.

How much better is that Kawasaki engine than a Kohler Courage? Axle's tend to all abe Cast Iron and the Husqvarna dealer tells me that the transmissions are the same too. Guage wheels tend to number 4 on the premuim vs 2 front on the economy.

If there are particular models that you thing I should keep in mind / avoid - do let me know.

 

[arthurb]

How about a finishing mower for the Kubota CUT? It would cost just about the same for a new lawn tractor. Maybe more, maybe less. It sounds as if you have the room on your property to operate the Kubota with a finishing mower?

 

[Fredex]

Well I mow about twice the area you do and have a longer growing season. Average about 110 hrs/yr. Halaf my mowing is free and easy (the vineyard); the other half is complicated, the lawn. For mowing around obstructions such as trees, flower beds, sidewalks, retaining walls, decks, etc., I wouldn't be w/o the HST. Means more to me there than on the real tractor, which in my case is gear drive.

As to cheap vs. premium I went with upper-middle: 20hp Kohler Command, shaft driven HST, 48" belt driven deck with manual lift & no pwr steering. That was Cub Cadet 2518 a few years ago.

 

[Fordlords]

For a good balance and value look at Cub Cadet's GT 2554 model- a bit pricier than the cheap LT jobs at $3399, but it has great credentials- Heavy frame, VERY heavy duty hydro, shaft drive, Kohler Command engine, and a deck with a cut quality that is hard to beat. It's a really decent machine that will endure, why waste money on a cheapo 10 year LT when for $1000 more you can get a 20+ year machine that can twist the cheap LT's into pieces performance wise? It really is a get what you pay for scenario, and the best values are in the upper-middle range of machines. I like JD, they are great machines, not brand bashing but when it comes down to equal credentials vs. value, new JD yard equipment IMHO is WAY overpriced compared to the offerings of others.

Kohler Courage vs. Kohler Command/Kawasaki/Honda/Briggs Vanguard engines?? The Courage is rated for 750 hours of life. It is built like the cheap Briggs Intek engines. The others are rated for 2000 hours of life- that's a big difference.

-Fordlords-

 

[canoetrpr]

Thanks for the response Arthur:

Back when I was pricing out CUTs I quickly found out that mid mount mowers - probably the best option for cutting around the yard - were pretty darn expensive. About $4k CND. I figured given the amont of lawn I had that regardless what quality riding mower I ended up with, I'd be much better off with a dedicated machine for the farm and a dedicatd lawn tractor. This also allowed me to go for a heavier CUT - L3400 vs. a lighter one - B3030, and industrial tires instead of turf.

My industrials will still tear up the lawn pretty good and I think that a rear mounted finishing mower would be a pain in my yard.

So now I'm back to the $4k I avoided spending. I'm sure it would be nicely deployed into a lawn tractor but I'm doing my best to find the right balance of price vs. quality utility.

That comment on the life of the Kohler courage vs. Kawasaki etc. did finally bring to light that there was a quality difference between the machines which may be justified in the end.

To be honest, I'm not considering Cub any more since it is now owned by MTD. This leaves me with JD, Kubota, Husqvarna - anything else?

Which brings me to another question. Would you folks consider that buying a 7 -9 year old premium machine would be better than a new economy one. E.g. JD LX178 can be had for about $1800 CDN here - not easy to find though - close in price to a new L125.

I hate the thought of a used lawn tractor sitting in a deales lot over the winter which is why I have avoided used. And private sales are hard to come by on good machines.

 

[arthurb]

Personally, I'm not an expert, it seems MTD has there hands in the manufacturing of different brands of lawn and garden tractors. If I'm wrong, I hope someone will correct me. Don't get me wrong, I've never had any real problems with their products. I've used a rear finishing mower on an older JD 350 or 450. Can't remember which /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif. I liked using it, but everyone has their own preference. It sounded at first that your yard was wide open without many obstacles. I was going to suggest a set of turf tires for your CUT with a rear finishing mower.

I own a Toro WH 520XI with a 60" mower deck. I have owned 2 Toro WH tractors in the past 8 years. I've been very satisfied with them. Look at their 300 and 400XT series of lawn and garden tractors. They seem to be in your price range. Toro makes the 400XT and XI series for New Holland. The only difference is they are painted blue. MTD makes the lower end of Toro's lawn tractors that you see in Home Depot, and not the 300, 400XT and the XI series.

Have you considered the following: Ingersoll, Honda, Gravely and Simplicity. I don't know if these four other manufacturers have any association with MTD. Also, I'm not sure if these four other dealers are available in Canada. What about a Craftsman?

arthurb,

 

[Fordlords]

MTD has been making the Cub Cadet lineup since 1981- that is a LONG time. Continued on the International Harvester tradition, MTD built Cub Cadet GARDEN tractors (2500-3000 series) are MTD's premium product line, and they are extremely well made machines with a high level of customer satisfaction, and parts and service are easy to obtain. MTD does make a LOT of the inexpensive LT's for many names, including Toro, YardMan, Yard machines, etc. But their high end shaft drive series can blow JD away, for a fraction of the cost.

Honda has discontinued manufacturing lawn and garden tractors, instead newly opting to be an engine supplier to popular brand names much in the way Kawasaki did. Honda GX engines are superb, and are going to find their way into many machines, I believe Toro-WH is the first taker short of Husqvarna commercial ZTR's.

Husky's top end lineup garden tractors are really not bad at all with the Kawasaki engines- I tested the 18 HP Kawi powered model, and it did impress me, very tight, real smooth, and looked to be quality built and had a reasonable price tag. Good buys are to be had on inexpensive LT's at Sears including the Husky LT lineup and Kohler Courage powered Craftsmans-- the 10 year throwaways if its all you need. Poulan Pro LT's are identical to Craftsman LT's available at Home Depot.

 

[Joe1]

I'm not sure how it is now, since I'm not in the market, but many manufacturers offer very attractive financing which may make it possible for your budget to buy a better machine as has been suggested here, and whith which I agree (for whatever any opinion is worth).

I'm on the other side of your coin in that I have a manual shift on my JD CUT and hydrostatic drive on my Toro 417 XT with 48" deck and 17 HP Kawasaki. I thought the curise control was a gimic until I used it, which I do all the time. I cut about 3/4 acre all year long and enjoy the quality of the Toro. I sat on a Husky tractor next to the Toro (not the cheap MTD Toro) and just rocked the tractor side to side with my body. The Husky rocked a lot, the Toro was solid with little lean. That stability, the Kawasaki engine and the Toro reputation sold me on the higher end tractor. Not knocking the Husky, the Toro was just a better tractor, all be it at a higher price.

You really do get what you pay for.

 

[canoetrpr]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( MTD has been making the Cub Cadet lineup since 1981- that is a LONG time. Continued on the International Harvester tradition, MTD built Cub Cadet GARDEN tractors (2500-3000 series) are MTD's premium product line, and they are extremely well made machines with a high level of customer satisfaction, and parts and service are easy to obtain. )</font>

Fordlords - thanks for setting me straight on this one. I thought Cub was a recent acquisition. I know several people who have been happy with old Cubs.

When I do the math for my growing season here - at the high end - I can expect to put no more than 450 hours in 15 years on any machine that I buy.... that's making me wonder if I can't just as easily get buy with the LT model of most machines.

No question you get what you pay for.. I went into debt - something I said I wouldn't do other than my mortgage - for my L3400 Kubota. I'm glad I did because it is one nice machine and I'm going to use it in the summer and in the winter for many years. The lawn tractor unfortunately does not have the same amount of use lined up for it.

 

[Fordlords]

We have been using our Craftsman LT with 42" deck and 16 HP Kohler engine for the light chores round the house (about half acre of mowing) for about 6 or 7 seasons now and have to say in all honesty it has never missed a beat or ever broken down once. My mom likes it because it is small and not as intimidating as the bigger Cub GT used for the heavy work. For a $1400 LT, it has served its purpose well, it can even pull a cart loaded with 800 lbs of rocks just fine. I can say I do recommend Craftsman for a cheap LT, but would stay with one using a Kohler engine over the Briggs found in the real cheap Craftsmans. I think I mentioned the Poulan Pro's are the same machines, they were both made by a company called Roper but are now under a different name- I think, but am not positive, this same company makes the Husqvarnas too. There are also many good buys to be found on used Cub Cadet and JD GT's that may fit your bill. You are right, a light use machine is not worth going into debt over. (But I'm one of the tractor's anonymous guys who would easily go into a LITTLE debt for a new CC 2500 series) /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

-Fordlords-