Semi-New Member Returns after Building an ICF House

[sriddle1]

sld,

Nothing negative taken, as with most of the housing markets these days it would be hard to re-coup costs for almost any custom home. I suspect that's why so many independent builders have gone by the wayside. They say the market is picking up, didn't see it as I departed SW MN nor do I see it here in SW NH.

As you said; "A lot of times I will spend more on a project to do it a certain way" and I suspect that's true for my wife and I in this Retirement Home. After having used ICFs in SW Minnesota the last-go-around with their constant 25 mph winds & harsh winters (-25 to -30) we thought it would be wise to spend that 15% higher build cost now to mitigate future energy costs, who knows what it will be in 10 years. We just received our last Propane Fill and we still averaged-out a $10.00 a day usage for winter months, I'm switching over from the boiler fed in-slab and baseboard radiant to a forced air furnace as nightly temperatures remain above freezing.

 

[sriddle1]

Western,

If you're handy at all ICF might be a good route to take, not sure of the cost comparison of say ICFs vs havng a concrete sub with foundation forms doing the work. (I used Build Block ICF Mfr where retail pricing is on-line) You'd have to be sure you laid-out a very detailed Request for Quote (RFQ) and shop the job, I normally get 5 quotes and ask for references to review. Not only do you have to consider the shelter structure design with ventilation but also excavation, drainage, waterproofing, structure integration with the access hatch you've chosen, etc. Not hard mind you but it takes allot of thought to capture all the details down to using resistant hardware and PSI of the concrete. Look at your state's building code and see what pertains to concrete structures to get ideas of what needs to go into your RFQ then you're set.

 

[OldMasterTech]

sriddle1, outstanding craftsmanship! Nice to see a construction project done properly.

If you don't mind this is a perfect place to post a very related short story. In 1972 when ICFs were experimental, I was thrilled (as a 19 year old foreman of an eight-man framing crew) to construct the first home in central Mass using the product. Much to my dismay, as I had worked closely with the on-site manufacturers technician, my cheapskate, corner cutting boss instructed the pumper operator to fill the 20' ICF structure right to the top!
Yes, all the bottom blocks exploded and the basement quickly filled with concrete which he made us shovel out before it set. What a mess.

So it is nice to see what your research, planning and implementation produced, great job!

 

[Western]

I would build above ground DIY. Was thinking concrete filled cinder blocks which meet the FEMA diagram. Door I can make myself out of steel plate, or can order one if time doesn't permit. Cinder blocks are readily available, but I don't know what the price offset would be. Re-bar cost will be the same no matter which direction I go.

 

[sriddle1]

OldMaster Tech - From my calculation, we're the same age, 1972 was a mighty fine year, gas at $13 cents a gallon in Nebraska right before I enlisted, man we're old. Like the story, you really must have been on the leading edge of ICFs, I hadn't really heard anything about them until 2004. In my research there were many stories of "Blow-Outs" as they call them, failure in the ICF Block probably at a seam and as you well know cement everywhere, what was your boss thinking. As the most, my concrete sub who managed the pours said 12'6" height is pretty much the limit for their pours and all controlled with heavy duty vertical bracing and when they poured with a pumper (goose neck) they continually walked around the perimeter, always about 7 cement trucks sitting on the street waiting to place their load in the pumper hopper, like I know what I'm talking about. My wife and I basically stacked the block and added the heavy treated door and window bucks with the help of some young lads. In short I understand the basics of concrete but always deferred to the commercial company I sub'ed the work out to.

 

[sriddle1]

Western,
When you mentioned Storm shelter the first thing I thought of was for Tornados, I suspect in Wise County you get them on the open plains. In MN we had an EF2 blow through our small Farmstead picking up 120' high 80 year old cottonwoods with diameters of about 6 feet and throwing them about 500 yards.

Cinder blocks filled with concrete doesn't seem it would be as stout as say a solid formed poured wall with vertical and horizontal rebar integrated. To mitigate wind shear I would think you'd want the lowest profile above grade. I'd still cost out your cinder blocks, rebar and I bet your thinking bagged concrete (amount of concrete) vs a quote for the entire job from a concrete sub.

 

[flusher]

When I was getting ready in late 2004 to build on my 10 acre site, I considered ICF and DIY. I checked out several ICF building sites in the Sacramento and Placerville area. Looked like way too much work and to me for minimal payoff in heating/cooling costs benefits. I finally went with an 1800 sf manufactured home on a permanent foundation. A lot less expensive and the manufacturer and installer did the job right the first time (I would have screwed up something expensive for sure).

 

[dfkrug]

When I was getting ready in late 2004 to build on my 10 acre site, I considered ICF and DIY. I
checked out several ICF building sites in the Sacramento and Placerville area. Looked like way too much work and to me
for minimal payoff in heating/cooling costs benefits.

We have been in our ICF for nearly 11 years now, and the energy payoff is excellent. I have forced-air propane
heat, but I don't have to use it at all, since we have a 34K BTU wood stove (burns outside air and has after-burner)
that can heat the whole house. Furthermore, our mild climate and basement allow us to eliminate AC entirely, which
saves a bunch.

Not so much in Sacto, but the bennies of ICF construction even in hot places like yours can still be significant.

ICF construction is now commonplace, tho not so much here in CA. The only major thing I would do differently
is to go with an insulated concrete roof, too.

 

[Paddy]

We went with ICF as well. We went with a Spanish style and enjoy the feel of the solid home. Our floors are also concrete.

 

[sld]

We went with ICF as well. We went with a Spanish style and enjoy the feel of the solid home. Our floors are also concrete.

Very nice. I bet you forbid little kids from playing baseball around those windows!