How they get rid of snow in Hokkaido

[bigtiller]

Why not put the snow melting machine on a truck or a trailer and take it to the snow.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bX7g6BjmTVk

 

[3930dave]

Given the engineering prowess (perhaps I should try a google translation into Japanese for Git'er Done) in Japan they do some pretty amazing public works projects.

A lot of things don't get done in the USA (and by default, Canada), due to the EPA.

Rgds, D.

 

[Threepoint]

For your interest for and about snow melting tanks:

From APWA the American Public Works Association

The article is "Winter walking tour of Sapporo, Japan"

I wish I could make a link to it but my computer skills are poor.

If you can get the material to Garandman, I bet he'd be willing to help get it posted.

I've subscribed to this thread, BTW. There must be a business opportunity here somewhere.

 

[aczlan]

Link: APWA Reporter - Winter walking tour of Sapporo, Japan

The snow melting tanks are an elaborate operation for snow disposal from city streets. In Ottawa we have engineered sites where snow is piled and left to melt on its own. Apparently in Japan, unlimited amounts of land to dump snow are a luxury, so they have started to employ more of the snow melting tanks. These tanks occupy very little land, and the one we visited was capable of melting thousands of cubic meters per day.

Relevant quote that sums it up:

There is so much that I can say about this short trip. Aside from all the interesting technologies and advances, what struck me the most is the attitude of the people towards the service they receive from their winter maintenance operations. As I mentioned earlier, the people have a higher level of acceptance towards a lower level of service (by our standards). Instead they are in favour of other factors such as budget savings, shorter delivery time, and increased environmental friendliness. As well, the willingness of citizens to participate in programs such as placing snow in gutters helps their municipal and road authorities maintain the city. When it comes to winter maintenance, I believe that we have to work on education and training in the same way we approach technology. Enhanced education programs should include not only managers, staff, and operators, but the public as well. Elected officials and the media are also good groups to target for the improvement of winter maintenance.

Aaron Z

 

[leonz]

it sure would not take much

1. soil core drilling to see what is 60-100 feet below the surface of the location

2. driving sheet piling for the excavation

3. tamping and back filling the excavation with crushed stone or "Pop Corn Shale"
which is shale that has been cooked in a high temperature oven to make it
expand and create a huge cushion for the poured concrete slab.
I am not sure if the company that used to mine the surface shale deposit across the road
from the old Allied Chemical quarry on Rock Cut Road/Rte. 481 in Syracuse is still mining
that shale and cooking it to make the popcorn shale.

4. Installing rebar for the pump sump, foundation floor and sidewalls

5. Pouring the base foundation using sand mix concrete with an 8,000 pound strength
a. vibrating all the concrete for the floor as it is poured, screeding the slab to level it. Covering the slab with a heavy canvas tarp and operating sprinklers to wet the slab for the curing period
b. installing and bolting the tanks wall forms bolting them together to make an inner wall and an outer wall
c. install all pipe hangers through forms as the forms are installed.
d. install sump pump rails for mud pumps(to raise and lower air operated mud pumps when required to drain tank.
6. Pouring the concrete walls and vibrating the sand mix concrete as the pour rises to remove air pockets.
a.let wall concrete cure
b. continue to wet floor concrete in pit

7.after concrete is cured "PROPERLY" remove wall forms sprinklers and heavy tarps.
install temporary fresh air ventilation piping for pit work with a furnace to heat the air while
the pit is occupied.
a. lower scaffold sets and staging for first pipe sections
b. lower the first 16 80-foot long Victaulic pipes, 32 gaskets and 32 elbows for both long walls

8. install Victaulic pipe runs in pit adding scaffold and moving aluminum staging as needed.

9. When the pipe runs and pump rail installation is finished used compressed air at 120 psi
to test pipe and gaskets for air leaks.
a.remove all scaffolding and staging from pit.

10. pour slab for dumping shed, boiler room and coal storage.

11. install X number of boilers, hot water storage tank and wiring for stokers and water circulation pumps

13. fill boiler and melting pipe water system and pressurise it to 60 pounds for 24 hours to test for water leaks.

14. fill pit with water to half way mark to check for possible leaks
a. repair any water leaks with grout.

15. back fill to half way point and then fill melt tank completely to check for more water leaks
a. repair water leaks if found.

16 finish backfilling excavation

17. install barn building

18. order coal

Done.

 

[leonz]

Thank you for doing that Aaron.

 

[aczlan]

it sure would not take much

1. soil core drilling to see what is 60-100 feet below the surface of the location

2. driving sheet piling for the excavation

3. tamping and back filling the excavation with crushed stone or "Pop Corn Shale"
which is shale that has been cooked in a high temperature oven to make it
expand and create a huge cushion for the poured concrete slab.
I am not sure if the company that used to mine the surface shale deposit across the road
from the old Allied Chemical quarry on Rock Cut Road/Rte. 481 in Syracuse is still mining
that shale and cooking it to make the popcorn shale.

4. Installing rebar for the pump sump, foundation floor and sidewalls

5. Pouring the base foundation using sand mix concrete with an 8,000 pound strength
a. vibrating all the concrete for the floor as it is poured, screeding the slab to level it. Covering the slab with a heavy canvas tarp and operating sprinklers to wet the slab for the curing period
b. installing and bolting the tanks wall forms bolting them together to make an inner wall and an outer wall
c. install all pipe hangers through forms as the forms are installed.
d. install sump pump rails for mud pumps(to raise and lower air operated mud pumps when required to drain tank.
6. Pouring the concrete walls and vibrating the sand mix concrete as the pour rises to remove air pockets.
a.let wall concrete cure
b. continue to wet floor concrete in pit

7.after concrete is cured "PROPERLY" remove wall forms sprinklers and heavy tarps.
install temporary fresh air ventilation piping for pit work with a furnace to heat the air while
the pit is occupied.
a. lower scaffold sets and staging for first pipe sections
b. lower the first 16 80-foot long Victaulic pipes, 32 gaskets and 32 elbows for both long walls

8. install Victaulic pipe runs in pit adding scaffold and moving aluminum staging as needed.

9. When the pipe runs and pump rail installation is finished used compressed air at 120 psi
to test pipe and gaskets for air leaks.
a.remove all scaffolding and staging from pit.

10. pour slab for dumping shed, boiler room and coal storage.

11. install X number of boilers, hot water storage tank and wiring for stokers and water circulation pumps

13. fill boiler and melting pipe water system and pressurise it to 60 pounds for 24 hours to test for water leaks.

14. fill pit with water to half way mark to check for possible leaks
a. repair any water leaks with grout.

15. back fill to half way point and then fill melt tank completely to check for more water leaks
a. repair water leaks if found.

16 finish backfilling excavation

17. install barn building

18. order coal

Done.

So, $1.5 billion for Boston, plus 5 million per snow event to run it (if you can get the EPA to clear it) and then you still have to put the meltwater somewhere and filter the nasties out of it. They do it there because they don't have space to pile they snow and they regularly get feet of snow at a time.

Boston generally has enough space to dump the snow and it generally warms up enough for it to melt down during the winter.

Also, in step 9, they would test with water, not air. Less chance of problems if a line fails catastrophically that way.

Aaron Z

 

[Threepoint]

it sure would not take much

1. soil core drilling to see what is 60-100 feet below the surface of the location

2. driving sheet piling for the excavation

3. tamping and back filling the excavation with crushed stone or "Pop Corn Shale"
which is shale that has been cooked in a high temperature oven to make it
expand and create a huge cushion for the poured concrete slab.
I am not sure if the company that used to mine the surface shale deposit across the road
from the old Allied Chemical quarry on Rock Cut Road/Rte. 481 in Syracuse is still mining
that shale and cooking it to make the popcorn shale.

4. Installing rebar for the pump sump, foundation floor and sidewalls

5. Pouring the base foundation using sand mix concrete with an 8,000 pound strength
a. vibrating all the concrete for the floor as it is poured, screeding the slab to level it. Covering the slab with a heavy canvas tarp and operating sprinklers to wet the slab for the curing period
b. installing and bolting the tanks wall forms bolting them together to make an inner wall and an outer wall
c. install all pipe hangers through forms as the forms are installed.
d. install sump pump rails for mud pumps(to raise and lower air operated mud pumps when required to drain tank.
6. Pouring the concrete walls and vibrating the sand mix concrete as the pour rises to remove air pockets.
a.let wall concrete cure
b. continue to wet floor concrete in pit

7.after concrete is cured "PROPERLY" remove wall forms sprinklers and heavy tarps.
install temporary fresh air ventilation piping for pit work with a furnace to heat the air while
the pit is occupied.
a. lower scaffold sets and staging for first pipe sections
b. lower the first 16 80-foot long Victaulic pipes, 32 gaskets and 32 elbows for both long walls

8. install Victaulic pipe runs in pit adding scaffold and moving aluminum staging as needed.

9. When the pipe runs and pump rail installation is finished used compressed air at 120 psi
to test pipe and gaskets for air leaks.
a.remove all scaffolding and staging from pit.

10. pour slab for dumping shed, boiler room and coal storage.

11. install X number of boilers, hot water storage tank and wiring for stokers and water circulation pumps

13. fill boiler and melting pipe water system and pressurise it to 60 pounds for 24 hours to test for water leaks.

14. fill pit with water to half way mark to check for possible leaks
a. repair any water leaks with grout.

15. back fill to half way point and then fill melt tank completely to check for more water leaks
a. repair water leaks if found.

16 finish backfilling excavation

17. install barn building

18. order coal

Done.

Leonz, sounds like you're gearing up for that RFP from the Boston Dept. of Public Works!

 

[CalG]

The process list skipped right over the traffic study, along with the Enviornmental impact report.

Both of those should come in under the $10 million "Misc Costs" item. But don't count on it.

 

[aczlan]

The process list skipped right over the traffic study, along with the Enviornmental impact report.

Both of those should come in under the $10 million "Misc Costs" item. But don't count on it.

Also, 5 certified boiler engineers to keep the boilers running 24x7 during the winter and enough trucks to bring the snow there vs renting 2-5 semi truck sized melters that can sit over any clear stormdrain which can be run by most any fool with half a brain and can sit next to a snowpile so further trucking is not needed.

Aaron Z