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  1. #1
    Elite Member woodlandfarms's Avatar
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    PowerTrac 1850

    Default Valve Spool, Control Valve questions

    I have a very basic question to ask. What is the difference between various valve spool controls. I am looking to add another remote, and there appears to be 4 different types (or at least they are labeled that way).

    Log Splitter Valve
    Motor Spool Valve
    Control Valve (the most common)
    Electric control valve

    Log Splitter valves seem to be the cheapest, and motor spools the most expensive.

    I get what electric is (although I have a question, can you "feather" an electric valve - meaning slowly let the juice flow for precision work or is it just on and off)

    Can anyone help a layman get through these vageries?

    Thanks
    Power-Trac 1850, grapple, hoe, 90" mower, 72" box blade

  2. #2
    Silver Member
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    2009 JD 3520

    Default Re: Valve Spool, Control Valve questions

    I'm certain some of the experts will be able to answer your questions- however they may need more information.

    Do you have a specific need for a valve? or what do you want the valve to do??
    2009 JD 3520, 300CX FEL, I-Match, Frontier BB2272, Frontier AF11E, PHD, Rimguard ( 610 Lbs ) Ballast Box ( 510 lbs)

  3. #3
    Elite Member dfkrug's Avatar
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    05 Kioti CK30HST w/ Prairie Dog backhoe

    Default Re: Valve Spool, Control Valve questions

    Very briefly:

    A Log Splitter Valve will go into detent (stay in that position) when you
    first activate it (push the lever). What this does is extend the cylinder
    all the way until it hits the end of its stroke, allowing you to leave it
    untended while it does its work. When it reaches the end of its stroke
    it automatically goes out of detent and retracts, ready for the next log.
    You don't need these kind of spool valves for a log splitter. A simple DA
    spool valve will work.

    A motor spool valve is another type of spool valve that allows fluid from
    the motor to return to the reservoir after you return the control lever to
    neutral. You want this for some applications where the momentum of the
    motor will cause large spikes in the pressure as you close the valve.

    "Control Valve" is a generic term that could refer to many kinds of valves,
    spool valves, ball valves, solenoid-controlled valves, etc.

    An electric valve usually has a solenoid that acts directly on a spool or
    poppet. Most will be all on or all off, but there ARE proportional electric
    valves. Your common solenoid valves can not be feathered, but
    proportional electric valves do provide volumetric flow control. That's
    a whole new world of electrically-controlled hydraulics.

  4. #4
    Super Star Member
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    JD 4300, JD X485 JD 4x2 Gator, JD 425, JD455

    Default Re: Valve Spool, Control Valve questions

    And I thought the Log Splitter valve would NOT go into detent on the splitting direction/motion (for safety) but would go into detent on the return stroke.

    Upon return, it would kick into neutral.

  5. #5
    Elite Member woodlandfarms's Avatar
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    Default Re: Valve Spool, Control Valve questions

    dfkrug... thanks for the info. What is DA?

    Also, what this is for is a grapple control valve. The logs splitter sounded interesting cause I could "command" it to open and not have to keep a hand on the valve.

    The ideal valve body would be small. I am also trying to figure out how to mount it so I can position this control properly.

    JJ knows that space is limited on my tractor, and while I have to be economical on this project I have to also balance other factors.

    dfk, or anyone else. Can you explain a little bit more on the motor spool valve. I thought all valves (if open center) would send fluid back to the tank in "nuetral".

    Ahh,,,, jeez... one more question. When you say volumetrics, you mean if I momentarily open and close the switch it will let fluid through... The electric system seem to me to be not a great control for running stuff as it would be jerky, not chance of feathering. BUt I see lots of heavier equipment using it so clearly I am missing something.

    ps... Trails. I was raised in Powell, WY. I SOOOOO miss that part of the world.... You are a lucky guy even though it is Lander ;-)
    Power-Trac 1850, grapple, hoe, 90" mower, 72" box blade

  6. #6
    Elite Member dfkrug's Avatar
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    05 Kioti CK30HST w/ Prairie Dog backhoe

    Default Re: Valve Spool, Control Valve questions

    Quote Originally Posted by beenthere View Post
    And I thought the Log Splitter valve would NOT go into detent on the splitting direction/motion (for safety) but would go into detent on the return stroke.

    Upon return, it would kick into neutral.
    Actually, that is how I would set it up, too (for safety). I wonder if you can
    plumb these valves 2 different ways? I admit I have not played with them
    much, but I do have one here that I repaired....a HF unit with a gummed
    up internal ball valve that kept it from springing back to neutral when
    it hit relief.

  7. #7
    Elite Member dfkrug's Avatar
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    Default Re: Valve Spool, Control Valve questions

    Quote Originally Posted by woodlandfarms View Post
    dfk, or anyone else. Can you explain a little bit more on the motor spool valve. I thought all valves (if open center) would send fluid back to the tank in "nuetral".

    Ahh,,,, jeez... one more question. When you say volumetrics, you mean if I momentarily open and close the switch it will let fluid through... The electric system seem to me to be not a great control for running stuff as it would be jerky, not chance of feathering. BUt I see lots of heavier equipment using it so clearly I am missing something.
    In the motor valve, the WORK PORTs can return fluid to the tank when
    the valve is OFF, In a simple spool valve intended to control double-
    acting (DA) cyls, the work ports are cut off when the valve is OFF (neutral).
    The pump sends fluid to the tank or next valve when your valve is OFF, in
    an open center system.

    Proportional controls are not fully off or on, as your solenoid valves are.
    Also, heavier equipment often uses variable displacement hyd pumps for
    additional hyd control.

  8. #8
    Silver Member
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    Default Re: Valve Spool, Control Valve questions

    Quote Originally Posted by woodlandfarms
    .....
    ps... Trails. I was raised in Powell, WY. I SOOOOO miss that part of the world.... You are a lucky guy even though it is Lander ;-)
    I was raised in Casper- So I think I moved in the right direction- I guess you went a little further West than I did

    It nice to hear from other Wyomingites- there arent many us around

    Go Pokes!
    2009 JD 3520, 300CX FEL, I-Match, Frontier BB2272, Frontier AF11E, PHD, Rimguard ( 610 Lbs ) Ballast Box ( 510 lbs)

  9. #9
    Veteran Member
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    Massey Ferguson model 85, Allis-Chalmers WD-45

    Default Re: Valve Spool, Control Valve questions

    The solenoid, electric, whatever you want to call them valves, can be opened a pre-determined amount by controlling the voltage to it. Let's say your system is 24 volts. Applying 24v would open it fully, 12v halfway. The more voltage, the more open. The voltage creates a magnetic field. The magnetic field pulls the valve off of it's seat and lets fluid flow. So, the more voltage, the more magnetism, the more fluid flow. I know AKKAMAAN must have a drawing on this. He must be sleeping today.

    Carl, sounds like a detent valve may work for you. Hit the lever into detent and it opens all the way. Might even be good for closing too. Would only let it close to a certain force to prevent wrecking your equipment. If you need more holding force, you could hold the lever manually.
    Knowing is not enough, you must apply.
    Willing is not enough, you must do.
    Bruce Lee

  10. #10
    Super Star Member J_J's Avatar
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    Power-Trac 1445, KUBOTA B-9200HST

    Default Re: Valve Spool, Control Valve questions

    Carl,

    Do you have the QA hyd circuit? If so, then I would use that for the grapple by diverting the fluid from the QA circuit for the grapple. There are selector/diverter valves, that will switch the fluid from the QA circuit to the grapple circuit, using a switch to switch circuits. .

    https://www.surpluscenter.com/item.a...name=hydraulic

    You can do it cheaper with this. Manual control,
    https://www.surpluscenter.com/item.a...name=hydraulic

    You could also switch the hose fro the QA cyl to the grapple cyl,for a real cheap way to control the grapple.

    On my three gang valve, two are for th joystick, and the other one is for the aux circuit.

    I use the third lever for my tree snipper, or grapple.

    The most convenient way is the solenoid valve setup.
    J.J.

    When I works, I works hard. When I sits and thinks, I goes to sleep.

    Git er done.

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