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  1. #1
    Platinum Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Posts
    864
    Location
    Raleigh, NC USA
    Tractor
    Massey-Ferguson MF 1220

    Default Hydraulic remotes vs hydraulic PTO?

    Hi folks:

    I'm just curious in general about CUT's that have "hydraulic remotes". I'll give my understanding, and someone please correct me where I'm wrong.

    In general, hydraulic remotes are designed to handle low-flow/high-pressure things like cylinders (like the lift and curl cylinders on an FEL). They are not designed to turn hydraulic motors like you might find on a hydraulic stump grinder attachement, hydraulic post hole digger, etc.

    Is this correct? Or does it vary by brand? How do you know which hydraulic remote is designed for which type of application? On Power-tracs (which are completely hydraulic, including the drive system), there are hydraulic connections to power cylinders, and seperate "hydraulic PTO" connections to power hydraulic motor-based attachments. You can't mix the two because the hydraulic PTO isn't reversible and it provides a constant 8gpm flow, which the hydraulic remotes are reversible but have a low flow (I believe).

    Anyway, I know that "hydraulic remotes" are options on many CUT's, but is "hydraulic PTO" an option as well?

    Someone clear me up!

    Thx,
    Dave

  2. #2
    Veteran Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2000
    Posts
    1,720
    Location
    Columbia county NY
    Tractor
    87 Ingersoll 444, 84 Ingersoll224/'44 GreavlyL/60'sGreavlyL/49 Ford 8N

    Default Re: Hydraulic remotes vs hydraulic PTO?

    <font color=red>You can't mix the two because the hydraulic PTO isn't reversible and it provides a constant 8gpm flow, which the hydraulic remotes are reversible but have a low flow (I believe).</font color=red>

    My Ingersalls have a hydro PTO, and they work with eather a cylinder[I have a wood splitter] or a motor[vac, and tiller] it is also reverseable. I think the key is the valve. Mine, when off, still flows through the system.[open center??] And the valve deverts it eather one way, or the other through the outlet hoses depending on what way you move the handle. Don't know if this ansors anything. Just the way mine works.[img]/w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif[/img]

  3. #3

    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Posts
    873
    Location
    N Central Ohio
    Tractor
    NH TC35D/SUPER H&M/F-20/JD B&D/FORDSON/JD250 SSL

    Default Re: Hydraulic remotes vs hydraulic PTO?

    The remotes on NH and kubota as well SSL have a fixed flow rate,
    the specs list this and they are reversible.
    They will run hydro motors and cylinders (at the same time w/ multiple remotes),
    GPM just tells how fast they will run or move.
    On the NH 35D has 9.8 GPM and some SSL go to 30 GPM+, this is available at the remotes.
    On your power-trac u don't have a mech PTO so all your attachments must use
    hydro to run them.

  4. #4
    Platinum Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
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    864
    Location
    Raleigh, NC USA
    Tractor
    Massey-Ferguson MF 1220

    Default So, it sounds like...

    ...the only real difference here is the flow rate. If a "hydraulic remote" has a flow rate of roughly 8gpm, then it should be able to power a hydraulic stump grinder or hydraulic PHD that expects roughly 8gpm, assuming the same PSI.

    Thx!
    Dave

  5. #5
    Veteran Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2001
    Posts
    2,200
    Location
    Montana (Near Bozeman)
    Tractor
    PowerTrac 425 (September 2003)

    Default Re: Hydraulic remotes vs hydraulic PTO?

    Dave,
    I can just feel the wheels turning in your head. Your question about hydraulic remotes and your PowerTrac must mean that you have a project coming up. Care to shed some light for the rest of us?
    PJ

  6. #6
    Platinum Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Posts
    864
    Location
    Raleigh, NC USA
    Tractor
    Massey-Ferguson MF 1220

    Default Re: Hydraulic remotes vs hydraulic PTO?

    Hey PJ:

    No, not really any project on the horizon. Time like this when the PT is broken down and I can't fix it myself make me realize that there's vast amounts of info that I simply don't know. I guess my current project is the quest for more knowledge...[img]/w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif[/img]

    Dave

  7. #7
    Epic Contributor MossRoad's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2001
    Posts
    22,519
    Location
    South Bend, Indiana (near)
    Tractor
    Power Trac PT425 2001 Model Year

    Default Re: Hydraulic remotes vs hydraulic PTO?

    Dave,
    My PT425 has the <A target="_blank" HREF=http://users.beanstalk.net/godollei/pt425/PT425Pictures/PT425VarVolPump.jpg>variable volume pump</A> for powering the wheels. That's the transmission.

    There is a <A target="_blank" HREF=http://users.beanstalk.net/godollei/pt425/PT425Pictures/PT425PTOPump.jpg>second pump</A> with two sections which provides power to the hydraulic PTO from the front half of the pump and power to the steering rams, lift/tilt mechanism and auxiliary PTO from the back half of the pump. You can see by the picture that the PTO section has the large hoses and the other section has the small hoses. The PTO is rated at 8GPM. I don't know what the other section is rated at. This might be a good question for Power Trac.

    As for your original question [img]/w3tcompact/icons/grin.gif[/img] my IH2500B is a large hydrostatic tractor. The PTO is a standard 3pt hitch/PTO setup that runs at 540 RPM; pretty standard. The hydraulic section runs the steering cylinder, the lift cylinders on the FEL and there are remote hydraulics on the rear. They look just like your hydraulic connectors, only larger. It has one valve that controls the direction of the hydraulics, with off in the middle. I don't know the flow rating, but it will push big cylinders with ease. I'd assume that it would power a hydraulic motor as well.

    I have seen somewhere on here a hydraulic PTO. It had two hoses and a standard PTO shaft on the end of a motor. As long as the tractor could put out enough GPM at the needed pressure, it would work just fine.

    I think the reason most CUTS don't offer hydraulic PTOs is there is no need. The shaft drive of a standard PTO is about as efficient as you can get(read no hydraulic loss here) and the old tried and true design works perfectly well, until you want to change implements in a hurry or run an implement that would require really long drive shafts. Where the hydraulic PTO really shines is the quick attach features, no shafts or belts to hook up, no complicated linkages or gearboxes; just run the hoses to where you need the power and install a hydraulic motor. If you design the main engine to power the pumps to flow enough juice to the hydraulic motors for the intended purpose of the machine, the question of hydraulic loss becomes pointless. The machine was designed to do a job and it does it.

    The machines that really are the missing link between the standard CUT and our Power Tracs seem to be the Ingersolls. I wish I could see one up close. They really look interesting and powerfull. None of the Ingersoll owners here seem to complain, either [img]/w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif[/img]

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