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  1. #1
    Super Star Member ovrszd's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
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    15,114
    Location
    Missouri
    Tractor
    Kubota M9540, Ford 3910FWD, JD2210

    Default slow FEL

    My L4400 has a 1495 Rhino FEL. I've always thought it was a bit slow. Doesn't like to curl and lift at the same time. Even slow when lowering the empty bucket.

    My Brother recently purchased an L3240 with kubota loader. His loader is twice as fast as mine. My cylinders are a little bigger than his. Both use a Joystick. Both use the same size hose to feed the controller.

    Could it be the flow rate of the controller?? I suspect a flow rate problem by it being slow to lower.

    Any ideas?? Thanks in advance.
    Richard

    "Happiness isn't having everything you want, it's wanting everything you have."

  2. #2
    Platinum Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
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    502
    Location
    Forfar, Ontario, Canada
    Tractor
    1947 Massey Harris 30, 1960 Massey Ferguson 35 (Perkins), 1995 TAFE 351DI, 1980 Bolens G174, 2005 Kubota B7510

    Default Re: slow FEL

    Try your loader with the 3 pt hitch at the bottom. On my Massey-Ferguson and TAFE, loader speed is directly tied to the adjustment of the various 3 pt hitch levers, though the Massey/TAFE system is quite primitive in comparison to most.

    According to Tractordata.com kubota pumps are powerful. There should be lots of performance there, though the guy who sold me a block splitter got rid of it because he couldn't get enough oil to it to make it work quickly. This was a newish, 35 hp Kubota, as I recall. His theory was that the lines are too narrow.

  3. #3
    Veteran Member
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    Apr 2009
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    1,023
    Location
    Port Angeles WA

    Default Re: slow FEL

    Quote Originally Posted by ovrszd View Post
    My L4400 has a 1495 Rhino FEL. I've always thought it was a bit slow. Doesn't like to curl and lift at the same time. Even slow when lowering the empty bucket.

    My Brother recently purchased an L3240 with kubota loader. His loader is twice as fast as mine. My cylinders are a little bigger than his. Both use a Joystick. Both use the same size hose to feed the controller.

    Could it be the flow rate of the controller?? I suspect a flow rate problem by it being slow to lower.

    Any ideas?? Thanks in advance.
    Since you cylinder are larger diameter...it seems to be that your pump flow is too low...need larger pump...
    Control valve is not your problem...
    You lifting force OK?

  4. #4
    Super Star Member J_J's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2003
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    18,923
    Location
    JACKSONVILLE, FL
    Tractor
    Power-Trac 1445, KUBOTA B-9200HST

    Default Re: slow FEL

    Quote Originally Posted by ovrszd View Post
    My L4400 has a 1495 Rhino FEL. I've always thought it was a bit slow. Doesn't like to curl and lift at the same time. Even slow when lowering the empty bucket.

    My Brother recently purchased an L3240 with kubota loader. His loader is twice as fast as mine. My cylinders are a little bigger than his. Both use a Joystick. Both use the same size hose to feed the controller.

    Could it be the flow rate of the controller?? I suspect a flow rate problem by it being slow to lower.

    The cyl should retract faster than extend.

    Any ideas?? Thanks in advance.
    If you know the GPM , and the cyl bore and shaft size, you can compute the speed of the cyl. To see if your valve or fittings have a restriction in them, remove one of the lift cyl base end hose. Start tractor and place hose in a clean 5 gal bucket and push lever to flow fluid out the removed hose for 10 sec. Multiply the volume by 6 for GPM's. If you get 1.5 gal in 10 sec. then you are pumping 9 gpm. If you pump 1 gal in 10 sec, then you are pumping 6 GPM.

    2 in bore, 1 in shaft, 9 GPM, the cyl will extend at 11 in per sec

    2 in bore, 1 in shaft, 6 GPM, the cyl will extend at 7.4 in per sec.

    Say your cyl are 3 in bore, and 1.5 in shaft, at 9 GPM. your extend speed will be 4.9 in per sec.

    Your cyl being larger will take longer to extend using the same GPM. You will have more force generated.
    J.J.

    When I works, I works hard. When I sits and thinks, I goes to sleep.

    Git er done.

  5. #5
    Super Star Member J_J's Avatar
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    Sep 2003
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    JACKSONVILLE, FL
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    Power-Trac 1445, KUBOTA B-9200HST

    Default Re: slow FEL

    You could have someone put a flow meter and gage on your system and check to see if the pump is pumping correct volume and pressure.

    L4400 hyd flow is 7.8 GPM

    L3240 hyd flow is 13.2 total GPM
    valve flow is 8.4 GPM
    J.J.

    When I works, I works hard. When I sits and thinks, I goes to sleep.

    Git er done.

  6. #6
    Veteran Member
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    Port Angeles WA

    Default Re: slow FEL

    Quote Originally Posted by J_J View Post
    To see if your valve or fittings have a restriction in them....
    So you assume PRV is by passing??

  7. #7
    Super Star Member J_J's Avatar
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    JACKSONVILLE, FL
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    Power-Trac 1445, KUBOTA B-9200HST

    Default Re: slow FEL

    His tractor performance may be correct. It would be hard to compare to another tractor with different pump size, and different cyl. The only true way would be to know the pump GPM, and see if anything else is using some of the total fluid like PS. If the pump is good and pumping at stated volume, and the valve and hoses are sized correctly, then he should expect the cyl to perform at a certain level. If not trouble shooting is necessary.

    The other tractor should out perform his tractor as to speed of cyl operation.
    J.J.

    When I works, I works hard. When I sits and thinks, I goes to sleep.

    Git er done.

  8. #8
    Super Star Member J_J's Avatar
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    Sep 2003
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    JACKSONVILLE, FL
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    Power-Trac 1445, KUBOTA B-9200HST

    Default Re: slow FEL

    Quote Originally Posted by AKKAMAAN View Post
    So you assume PRV is by passing??
    The PRV will not even come into play unless he overloads the system. If the PRV is stuck open, he should have some indication. Might even try removing and inspecting and cleaning if necessary, and then reset psi.

    If both tractors would go side by side and both active the valve lever to raise the bucket at the same time, the tractor with the smaller cyl will be faster, with all things working right.
    J.J.

    When I works, I works hard. When I sits and thinks, I goes to sleep.

    Git er done.

  9. #9
    Veteran Member MikeInEburg's Avatar
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    Feb 2008
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    1,040
    Location
    Emmitsburg, MD
    Tractor
    Kubota B7800

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ovrszd
    Doesn't like to curl and lift at the same time. .
    This issue is likely simple plumbing. Even though you have a single handle, there are two valves in series - one before the other. If one valve is diverting fluid for action A, there is no fluid flow for action B.
    Mike

    "As you go through life, make this your goal: watch the donut, not the hole"

    Kubota B7800
    BH-75A Backhoe
    Rhino 60'' finish mower

  10. #10
    Super Star Member J_J's Avatar
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    Sep 2003
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    JACKSONVILLE, FL
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    Power-Trac 1445, KUBOTA B-9200HST

    Default Re: slow FEL

    On my joystick, if I try and curl at the same time as lift, both will be slower that if one function is working. The GPM is divided.
    J.J.

    When I works, I works hard. When I sits and thinks, I goes to sleep.

    Git er done.

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