Adding FEL hydraulics to Kubota L3301

[Scott65]

Hello all. I'm VERY new to the tractor world. My wife and I just bought 10 acres and decided to get a tractor to help out around the place. Bought a Kubota L3301 brand new with the DPF exhaust (jury is still out on this, very lengthy, loud, obnoxious burn off's required), and the hydrostatic drive. I love the hydrostatic drive but I'm totally ignorant as to its functionality. As a matter of fact, that goes for everything on this tractor. I've lurked around here on the forums quite a bit and absorbed what I could, but I want to ask before I mess something up. I am thinking about building my own grapple for the front bucket so I can scoop up things that are longer than the bucket is wide, like tree branches and old fence posts, without it all just falling back out on the ground. I'm a mechanic, and fairly handy with nuts, bolts, welders, torches, etc. It won't be pretty, but functional. In my line of work, I can accomplish anything with as long as I've got the schematics to show how the system is set up. I can't find such a thing on this new tractor, or at least not with the hydrostatic drive. Can anyone point me in the right direction for where I might hook in to add my hydraulic connections for a single ram to operate this grapple (and later on, a DIY hydro post hole digger)? I've seen terms such as Power Beyond, and I believe that the 3 point uses the same hydraulics. And possibly the power steering. So I'm very confused as to where I can hook in for pressure, and where I should hook back in to return. I'm not sure what kind of pressure would be coming back out of my system after operating the grapple ram. If it goes downstream to the 3 point, does it still have to be full pressure? See what I mean? Lots of questions about the design of the system that I can't quite wrap my head around yet. I've only ever worked on very simple systems, like the lifts at my shop. Pressures the rams to lift, relieves the pressure to lower. The return plumbing is literally just that, only a return. There is no sort of pressure, it just DUMPS back into a plastic reservoir. I assume this isn't the case on my tractor.

Any insight would be great!
Thanks in advance!
Scott

BTW,
Since nothing seems to be marked on any of the valve bodies, or manifolds, or whatever the industry calls them, I'm not even sure where the in's and outs and power beyonds, etc are coming and going from. Very confused. If anybody has any pictures to give me a frame of reference or starting point, that would be great! I would upload my own but I had to take the tractor to my mothers to do some work and won't have it back for a couple of days

 

[J_J]

You probably have a hyd block in the bottom center of the tractor.

If you have a FEL, it feeds the FEL and the FEL returns the fluid to the hyd block.

Then the fluid goes to the back for the 3pt.

If you add a valve for the grapple, you would add a new valve in series with the flow path.

The PB from the FEL would go into the IN port of the new valve ans the PB from the new valve would return back to the hyd blk.

Do you want a lever valve or a 3rd function solenoid valve?

 

[Scott65]

I'm thinking a lever. Seems that would be easier to use later on for my post hole digger that I have planned. And from what I can tell, its cheaper anyways, rather than incorporating electronics in with it. I have casually been researching this for a month or so now, and I just "stumbled" across a youtube video of a guy installing one of the electronic versions on a kubota, and he said that the typical reference marks on this brand, instead of branding the metal blocks, they put colored tape on the lines, which I remember seeing on mine. So thats a definite help. He said green is usually the power beyond. So I think that points me in the right direction to start, plus your input, so thank you very much! So my concern at this point is the hydrostatic drive. Is it a self contained system, or is it somewhere down the line on this power beyond circuit, or something else? By me "intercepting" this power beyond circuit and drawing pressure from it, am I going to cause issues for the drive system that could be further down the line?

 

[J_J]

You can also use a divider valve to split the curl flow into two path, either curl or grapple..

Once you push the button on the solenoid divider valve, the joystick would control the grapple.

Release the button, and you have curl.

With another lever valve, you might need three hands to control the joystick, steer, and work the grapple.

So, there are options.

You tractor hyd block might look like this.

 

[Scott65]

I have read about and considered the switch to use the curl hydraulics but I think in the long run I would regret it and redo it. I feel I may as well just bite the bullet and do it the other way. I'm thinking of mounting the handle on the left side of the steering wheel rather than the right, to leave my right hand on the joystick. I've never used a grapple, maybe this isn't a good idea? Not sure if its common to want to grapple while steering or not. Is it worth the extra money to make it electric? My thoughts for the manual lever and the post hole digger in the future were that I would have some speed control. I assume that any electronic setup would be only on or off.

Also, the post hole digger is another reason to use the third function rather than tee-ing into the curl hydros. I plan to mount the digger rigid to have total control of the auger, none of this dangling around business. I would like to be able to adjust the angle of the hole as I'm digging. Not a huge deal, but I would have to stop digging, switch back to curl, adjust my angle, back to dig mode, etc. Just trying to plan for the future and do it right the first time

 

[J_J]

Very few people mount another valve up front and try and control it with the left hand.

I would recommend the 3rd function valve just for the grapple.

A valve for the hyd post hole digger or auger needs a motor spool valve. It can vary the speed and reverse the auger.

You could also mount a remote valve setup and control the grapple and auger using a two spool valve.

You can add one valve now ans another valve later to cover all operations.

The new valve should have PB for downstream operations.

 

[Scott65]

Sorry, I'm not familiar enough with the terms. I've seen products being sold with both of those names, the motor spool valve and the two spool valve. I guess I was thinking that the motor spool valve was kind of a two spool valve anyway, since it allows to reverse the motor. I agree this needs to be an available function. But I need to be able to reverse the grapple as well, for open and close function. So can the motor spool valve not also operate a hydraulic ram for the grapple?

I should clarify, these attachments won't ever be used together. The FEL on this kubota is one of those quick attach things like a skid steer. I will build the grapple onto the bucket (removable, but only attaches to the bucket itself), and the post hole digger will have a plate that attaches in place of the removed FEL bucket

 

[J_J]

A motor spool will let a hyd motor wind down after you put the lever to neutral.

A motor spool valve allows for fwd and rev.

A motor spool valve will not lock a cyl in place.

A grapple valve will need to lock the cyl and provide PB for downstream operations.

You can order a stacked valve with one spool a motor spool and the other spool a standard DA valve.

This valve can be mounted up front or at the back and control the auger and the grapple.

If you add QD's to the valve, you can plug any attachment into the remote valve.

 

[Scott65]

Oh I see, very good point! Thanks for clarifying that! So will the motor spool valve allow for the pb, even while it's allowing the motor to free wheel? Or is there some special plumbing involved with this one?

 

[J_J]

If the valve is setup for PB, with the lever in neutral, pump flow is passing through the valve. However, if the valve is using some of the fluid, then the rest of the pump flow will continue downstream. All valves in an open center hyd system should be in series, and the fluid is just flowing from pump to tank until a valve is shifted and the fluid is rerouted to a cyl or motor.