divertor vs 3rd function valve for grapple FEATHERING

[opemeister]

I wish to place a grapple on Kubota L3830 HST with a LA723 loader rated at
(I believe) 8.3GPM flow. I have read various comments on Kubota 3rd valve sticking
and would lean towards WR Long 3rd function valve...I see how it has a toggle
switch that controls either opening or closing of grapple...I read how a 3rd function allows
me to run all movements at once IN THEORY...understanding how fluid starts at
first outlet and moves down to last....meaning that last will move if enough fluid
or GPM of fluid will allow it. So I think the diverter would work OK, but not as efficiently
but it would also cost less. I would spend extra money for ease. What I do not understand
at all, is why FEATHERING is possible on diverter system but NOT on 3rd function valve
systems. I have read further that one could put restrictors (.032) ... variable restricters
so could adjust to proper opening size if want...to keep grapple from at times
violently opening and closing...I will most often need to feather the grapple... but do not
understand why I CANNOT feather on 3rd function valve system.. I am not at all very smart on this
topic, but trying to understand it. What am I missing in how it works that does not allow
me to figure that out.

 

[katoomed00]

With the diverter valve you are using the FEL control to (lift or tilt whichever you choose) so you can ease into it just as you would working the bucket (this is the set up I have. Biggest issue is that you loose the lift or tilt function while the diverter button is detente.
Best I can tell for the 3rd function valve you use the Power Beyond supply on FEL controls, therefore not disabling the lift or tilt functions while using the grapple. Problem there would be just the function valve is either open or closed via the button, therefore no feathering. (I could be wrong)
You could always install a pressure gauge and monitor it and get an idea as to how much you are squeezing or releasing pressure on the grapple.

 

[ericm979]

You can't feather with an electronic 3rd function because the valve is either on or off. The two buttons on the joystick are momentary switches. One opens the valve, the other closes it. There are proportional electronic controls but they're real expensive.

Right now I have my dual lid grapple plumbed into a remote valve. I can feather with it but so far I've had no need to do so. When I am picking up wood rounds or limbs or trunks or firewood I want to close the lids all the way. With my setup and grapple it takes about two seconds for the lids to open or close completely. I think for my uses I'd be fine with a 3rd function that lacks the ability to feather the lids. Keep in mind that two lids mean two cylinders and twice the opening or closing time of a single lid grapple.

Also some loader valves when being operated will send all the fluid to the tank instead of the power beyond port. That's what my Branson's appears to do- if I operate the loader and try to raise the 3pt at the same time, the 3pt does not move. I think that loader valves that have regen (like some Kubotas) don't do this. If yours does then you probably won't be able to move the loader and operate the grapple at the same time. Even if your loader valve does send flow out the PB port while being operated, you're trying to move two (or three if you're curling) things at once from what's effectively a common pressure source.. the one with the least resistance will move first.

 

[LD1]

Pretty much what others said about the feathering.

3rd being either on or off.....only "feathering" is you toggling the switch on and off but that still isnt really feathering.

Assuming you have used your loader enough to be familiar with the control......lets say you want to raise or lower "slowly" or durp something gently.....when you ease into the joystick to control speed....THATS feathering.

So with a diverter.......you push a button buy you are still using your MECHANICAL loader valve to open and close the grapple. So you have the SAME feathering ability with the valve that you are already familiar with.

Hard to feather an on/off button. It would be like using your loader, but at full speed all the time.

As to less efficient........I have a diverter. I use the grapple ALOT. I cannot see how having a 3rd (if there even would be any flow left to truly operate a third function) would make my usage any more efficient at all.

 

[MinnesotaEric]

You must have a piloted valve. Even the new fly-by wire hydro systems don't have the control of old-fashioned piloted valves.

 

[Piston]

I’ve used the 3rd function and simply like how it is an easy toggle on my joystick. I have no need to function all 3 circuits at once, not have I ever once found the need to feather my grapple.

If I was picking up my chickens eggs off the ground, I would need the feathering ability, but since I’m not doing that, I haven’t found the need.

Edit: that doesn’t mean you don’t have eggs to pick up, if so, the diverted could be beneficial.

 

[teg]

So why don't more people plumb in another (remote) valve with 3 spools to use one for a grapple and one for top link and another for a side link? For about the same amount of money, you can do all 3???

I get that you get to press a button to close the grapple vs. me reaching for the valve stick...

 

[ericm979]

I have three remote valves. Two are the factory valves with handles beside the seat. The operate the top and tilt. The third is a dealer installed valve on the fender. It's one of those with a handle that can be mounted in two positions. I have it horizontal pointing at the loader valve's handle just in front of it on the fender. So it's not that far of a reach from the loader to the grapple control. It's still a reach though. Having the grapple control on the loader handle would save time. I'm still deciding if it's worth the time and expense of setting up a diverter or third function system.

 

[David_Kb7uns]

Have a L3130 Kubota never had a factory 3rd function valve for the Lxx30 series that I could find, they domhave a option for the three rear remotes but you cannot curl/clamp at the same time and operate the tractor.

Have the WR Long 3rd function valve mounted on the L3130 and like it very much. With the correct restrictor fittings on both the grapple cylinders you can slow down the closing of the grapple action, keep the cylinders synchronized and effectively curl/clamp at the same time while being able to feather the combined action by controlling the action by pushing the button while moving the curl function lever carefully.

David

 

[Piston]

So why don't more people plumb in another (remote) valve with 3 spools to use one for a grapple and one for top link and another for a side link? For about the same amount of money, you can do all 3???

I get that you get to press a button to close the grapple vs. me reaching for the valve stick...

I have 4 rear remotes and need one more, if I used a rear remote to operate a grapple, I wouldn’t be able to use all my implements. As Eric mentioned, there is also a convenience factor. This becomes more and more apparent the more you use it.

I remember going from a 4 stick control Dynahoe backhoe, to a 2 stick control Deere 410 backhoe. The difference is similar to that in my opinion. You don’t “need it” but it sure is nice to have that little button right on the joystick.