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  1. #1

    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Posts
    480
    Location
    Iowa
    Tractor
    JD4310 eHydro with bells and whistles

    Default The truth: 4310: the good, the bad, mostly ugly

    I promised the truth about my purchase and can no longer wait to report my experience with John Deere and the dealer to date. I'll play Jack Webb at first; just the facts. Then, express my feelings about the matter. Also, I'll break this up a bit and reply to my own post to shorten the individual parts.

    The tractor and implements: 4310 eHydro, motion match, power match, autostyle cruise control, 430 loader with both 61" HD bucket/toothbar and 4in1 bucket, 4th and 5th diverter valve, 60"mmm, JD 660 tiller, Atlas boxblade, iMatch, top and tilt, JD ballast box. Note: tooth bar puchased from KC Canary in NY and sent to dealer in MO.

    The story: In brief, I researched all over the country and while on a family trip stopped at dealer in southern Missouri and negotiated my best deal. Tractor ordered by salesman April 9. Delivered 6/13/02. We agreed on a "prepped and out the door price" of right at $26,400. I will stipulate that this is a good price for the above and that is why I was willing to drive 350 miles from home to pick up the tractor at delivery. I also thought that if there were any problems, I would be at the dealer and have them remedied at the time.

    The seller thought the tractor would arrive within 2-3 weeks. I knew this was bogus, but wasn't concerned and was willing to wait. I kept in touch with the salesman on a weekly basis (my dime; he called me once in two months).

    Just before delivery, I called him and he requested money down in certified funds. A bit irritating (I have no credit problems whatsoever) but understandable. I had my bank issue a cashier's check for $6,400 -- wanted to take advantage of JD 5.9% financing.

    In brief, I did everything possible to stay in touch with the selling dealership. I was cordial at all times and wanted this hopefully one-time purchase, researched over about 4 years to be a pleasant one. If only, and only if.........................

  2. #2

    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Posts
    480
    Location
    Iowa
    Tractor
    JD4310 eHydro with bells and whistles

    Default Re: The truth: 4310: the good, the bad, mostly ugly

    Chapter 2: The problems at delivery.

    I arranged travel plans so that I could arrive in town the evening before delivery; agreed to meet salesman at dealership in early a.m. so I could check things out and be on my way home. Earlier in the week, the salesman told me he was prepping the tractor, washing it, etc., etc.

    Arrived at dealer at 8:15 a.m.; salesman had to be called by parts person. She showed me the tractor at an outside door. It still wasn't washed and while I waited someone used a power washer and blew a decal off where the 4in1 clamshell control was located ("we'll send you another one in the mail") The tractor had not been greased; there was a grease gun resting on L front tire.

    HD bucket story: The dealer hadn't installed a toothbar before. He called me earlier in the week asking if it was okay to "torch" a hole in the bucket to add the toothbar. I said call Mark Brucker at KC Canary on toll free line and ask how they install them. Later, he told me that he called, but the "mechanics" had torched the holes before he got off the phone. Result: torched holes in bucket, not painted around the edges at delivery. I haven't been able to bear taking off the tooth bar to see if the holes are round and if I'll need repairs there someday. Also, the toothbar wasn't mounted flush with the cutting edge.

    Mower: the mmm wasn't level under the tractor and I asked about it. It had not been tested; they feigned ignorance (actually, that was NOT feigned).

    Tiller: $3,300 list: scratches all over it. Salesman gave me a can of JD paint.

    Top and Tilt: major scratches in toplink cylinder. No comment from salesman.

    Although the ballast box was on the lot on April 5 when I met the salesman, the pin for the toplink hadn't been ordered. I had to notice that when we were almost loaded. "We'll send that to you in the mail."

    Many other noticeable scratches. I bit my tongue, but assumed that the tractor was in operating condition. This was a certified JD dealer, right!?

  3. #3

    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Posts
    480
    Location
    Iowa
    Tractor
    JD4310 eHydro with bells and whistles

    Default Re: The truth: 4310: the good, the bad, mostly ugly

    Chapter 3: Got home safely; but...

    The Trooper managed to pull the load on the rented 18' trailer. Arrived at the Land and figured out enough to get things off the trailer. Next day, I was sick. Closer inspection revealed that the mower wasn't useable as it was mounted. Center "roller" was almost brushing the ground and it was clear, even to a novice that something was wrong.

    Looked at top and tilt hoses and realized that two were damaged simply from raising and lowering the 3 point hitch.

    Saturday, 6/15. Drove 20 miles to local dealer, spoke to pleasant young manager of dealership (about 6 stores in the company). He agreed to send over someone to pick up the tractor on Monday. He thought to be safe, I should have the tractor PIDed again and I agreed (it was clear on my inspection that it wasn't completely greased and I was nervous about a number of areas).

    Wednesday, 6/19. Dealer in IA completed PID, including checking out the cruise control which wasn't working. The mechanic said that it looked as thought someone "off the street" installed the top and tilt. The mower was in the holes for the 72" deck, etc., etc. Salesman in MO told me he had their top guy install the hydraulics.

    Comments on the invoice from the local dealer:

    re: cruise control: "...went through diagnostic proceedures in the tech manual and found the brake switch was out of adjustment..." "...adjusted and tested the brake switch until the cruise control worked." Cost: $61.94 billed to JD under warranty.

    loader brackets: "...tied hoses out of the way."

    damaged hydraulic hoses: "Installed hose cover on the hoses and rerouted. Hose covers should have been installed at set up. Hydraulic hoses weren't cut - they were rubbing and had abrasions on them."

    mower: "Found the deck rear draft arms were in the wrong position. They were in the position for the 72" deck. Selling dealer should have moved them in the correct position when installing the deck. Also, the selling dealer put the spring pins in the wrong hole on the deck, making it so the deck wouldn't sit level and right."

    top and tilt loose hoses: "Found the selling dealer had the hoses positioned so they would bind. Repositioned the hose and tied all of the hoses together."

    MY COST FOR THE ABOVE CORRECTIONS: $440.04 (doesn't include the cruise repairs).

    I talked to mechanic who colorcoded the hoses for mower. My request: Want to be able to switch back and forth between loader and MMM, since I use the mower the most I didn't want to have to hook up the mower hoses every time I use it (3-4 days). He said that his arrangement would work and I would be able to use the top part of top and tilt and switch back and forth between mower and loader. Result: it doesn't work and as of this date, I must connect and disconnect the mower hoses. Haven't had time yet to call more dealers/mechanics for help. All that money for 4th and 5th diverter.......

  4. #4

    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Posts
    480
    Location
    Iowa
    Tractor
    JD4310 eHydro with bells and whistles

    Default Re: The truth: 4310: the good, the bad, mostly ugly

    Chapter 4: I try to remedy the situation. I talked with the young store manager in central Iowa, thanked him for setting up the tractor properly and expressed openly the fact that the tractor problems were not his fault, but that this was certainly a JD company problem. Although he knew his regional rep wasn't the same one that would service the area of Missouri where I made the purchase, he said that he would be seeing his rep the next day and would ask what to do. He would call me.

    He didn't call me. Again I called him and he reported that his rep had suggested that the best course would be to contact the JD customer service center (1-800-537-8233)

    6/24/02 I call the customer service center. After making the menu selections, I get a representative on the line. I explain my story, including the belief that I should be compensated $440.04 for expenses to properly setup the tractor. I give her numbers for the Iowa dealership and the Missouri dealership. I am professional, appropriate, but firm. She informed me that she would telephone the local dealer and the selling dealer and get back to me. I gave her both my home and office numbers.

    6/26/02 I telephone the customer center again and get a different representative on the line. He asks again for serial number of the tractor and I give it to him. He sees that the first representative took the initial call and asks if I would like her voicemail as she is in a meeting. No, I would not like her voice mail. I explained to the new representative the situation and he apparently took down more notes.

    6/26/02 Late in the afternoon, the first representative called me back and stated that my "Case" had been assigned to the Missouri regional rep. I asked who that person was and she informed me that she couldn't give out that information. I explained more firmly and, still politely but not nearly as nicely, that I had significant concerns about rectifying the situation. I asked her when I might expect to hear from the unknown Missouri rep. She responed that it was a big territory and she wasn't at all sure when he might be calling. I became more firm and explained that I had been trying to be as mature and patient as possible, but that I felt discouraged and irritated by how I had been treated by the selling dealer. I told her about TBN and how I felt compelled to let members know of my experience and that I had been holding off doing that to see if JD could handle this problem quickly and efficiently. I asked for the name of her supervisor, so that I could follow-up later. She did give me that name and I had the impression that someone gave her the "high sign" to give it out (calls are monitored). However, I can't be sure that that happened.

    So, here we are on Friday, 6/28. I haven't heard from the rep, but remember it's a big territory. I will keep you all informed and I remain hopeful that I don't have to take further steps. See next chapter.

  5. #5

    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Posts
    480
    Location
    Iowa
    Tractor
    JD4310 eHydro with bells and whistles

    Default Re: The truth: 4310: the good, the bad, mostly ugly

    Feelings, nothing more than feelings. Trying to forget my feelings of...............

    Well, I remain hopeful that John Deere will conpensate me for expenses that should not have been incurred ($440.04) and rectify other problems with the tractor.

    Just wondering.... Does it make sense to charge consumers as much for a CUT as my Honda Odyssey van and then have scratches all over the equipment at delivery? Wouldn't corporate want to make calls as quickly as possible so that dissatisfied customers wouldn't communicate their problems/displeasure to others who are interested in similar products?

    What is the profit margin on a typical CUT? For the sake of my venting, let's say that 100 consumers participate/research on a website devoted to CUT pricing and use. Let's say that each is trying to decide among the "big three." Let's say that all 100 individuals, all tractors being more or less equal in quality and performance, decide to NOT purchase a particular brand of tractor, based on negative customer experiences. Let's say that conservatively the profit to the company on each tractor is $3,000. Let's see: $3,000 X 100 = $300,000. Let's say that the company can rectify the problem with the customer fairly easily by rapid and attentive response to the customer's concerns. In fact they could at least temporarily mollify him by compensating him $440.04. Next question: Which is greater $300,000 or $440.04?

    Feelings, Whoa, whoa, whoa feelings..........
    I am discouraged and uneasy about what other problems may emerge with the tractor. When it was delivered by the local dealer, they sent again a nice, young salesman to demo the tractor for me. He told me he had spent a week learning about the new 4x10 series -- I'm a novice and I knew more. He dropped the imatch on the tiller trying to show me a "cool" way to detach the implement quickly.

    I have used the 4in1 all week moving brush piles that were waiting for the arrival of the tractor. I notice that the boxblade "droops" on the hitch after a few minutes of using the loader and I have to switch back and forth with the diverter to raise up one side again before going back to work.

    In summary, I was so excited and now I am resigned, frustrated, disappointed and angry. I will continue the saga and if JD takes care of this I will certainly let everyone know.

    Let the debate rage on buying locally. If this works itself out, I still made a good deal. I am most hopeful that the tractor itself turns out to be a wise investment. If not I will NEVER purchase another JD product and I will do my best to inform others.

    I'll respond privately or on the forum. I'll be asking lots of questions of those of you who obviously know more about tractors than JD salespeople.

    Bill

  6. #6
    Super Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2000
    Posts
    6,737
    Tractor
    JD 8320 MFWD, JD 6415 MFWD, FEL, and cab, John Deere MFWD 4600, John Deere 4020, John Deere 4430, John Deere 455 mower, Deutz, and Gehl 4610 perkins skidsteer

    Default Re: The truth: 4310: the good, the bad, mostly ugly

    Unfortunately this is where the price issue comes in. There's usually a reason that dealerships sell for less money. When I buy stuff through the local dealer he knows he doesn't have to mess with me. Most of the time I pick stuff up in the crate and assemble it myself. They know I don't expect them to wash my new equipment, etc. They also know I'm not going to come back and complain about this or that and the only time they will see me complaining is when it's an actual deere issue. When that happens they readily accomodate me and fix the problem. I think it's pretty hard to expect #1 service if you are more concerned about price. I'm certainly not putting down your experience at all Bill. This is just where that service part that so many people rave about really comes into play. There is no excuse for what you are going through and price aside they still should have done things right the first time. I"m not making excuses or anything for them, really is none. I really hope that they do come through for you and make it right.

  7. #7
    Elite Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2002
    Posts
    4,383
    Location
    Janesville, Wisconsin
    Tractor
    None -yet. Until then FunBuggy (EZ-Go) will have to do!

    Default Re: The truth: 4310: the good, the bad, mostly ugly

    Bill,

    I deleted my earlier post because I decided it didn't belong in the middle of the most eloquent description of a royal screw job that we've seen for quite awhile.

    There have been a number of similar threads posted over the last few months. But I can't remember any that were so well put together, so succinct, and so <font color=blue>controlled</font color=blue>. WOW [img]/w3tcompact/icons/shocked.gif[/img]

    If it had been me, I think I'd have been absolutely ranting about what had been happening. I bow to your restraint and composure.

    Most of the folks that have posted their feelings about waiting for their tractors have been fun and enjoyable to follow. But your thread, Oh Boy, Oh Boy... was truly exciting to read. You had so much enthusiasm and excitement that it was contagious.

    And now to have all of these problems to deal with is very disheartening. I sure hope JD comes through for you and makes everything right. I know you'll get reams of support and advice from all the loyal TBN'ers. I have a feeling this is going to be a record breaking thread!!

  8. #8

    Join Date
    Nov 2000
    Posts
    361
    Location
    Virginia
    Tractor
    TC 40D w/ SuperSteer

    Default Re: The truth: 4310: the good, the bad, mostly ugly

    Bill,

    I really hate to hear about all of your problems. Hopefully it will all turn out good in the end. It sounds like you got a very nice package there. Once everything gets straightened out you'll be set for many years. I've found that a little time on the tractor makes your troubles fade away.

    Did you get a quote from your local dealer? How big of a savings did you get from buying out of state? I'm sure you probably said in the past, I just don't remember. As long as your repairs don't get much more expensive you'll probably still come out in the long run. Plus it doesn't sound like your local dealer has any hard feelings, he's just glad to be getting your business now. Buy an implement or two from him and he'll really like you.

    Hopefully big JD will do the right thing and help you out. But, if not, I'd still say you've got a fine tractor there.

    --Brad

  9. #9

    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Posts
    75
    Location
    Illinois
    Tractor
    JD 4010

    Default Re: The truth: 4310: the good, the bad, mostly ugly

    After I read that post I decided I had to register. I have been checking out this forum for past several months in anticipation of my new purchase. I am really sorry to here about all of your difficulty. I am purchasing a 4010 w/mmm and FEL with ballast box and imatch. Hopefeully this is an isolated incident. I hope somebody forwards your posts to somebody at Deere. My dealer has been good to me so far. While I have been waiting for my tractor he dropped off one for me to use until it arrived. Hope things turn around for you. Sometimes it might be worth to pay a little more to have a dealer closer to home.

  10. #10

    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Posts
    480
    Location
    Iowa
    Tractor
    JD4310 eHydro with bells and whistles

    Default Re: The truth: 4310: the good, the bad, mostly ugly

    <font color=blue>"I think it's pretty hard to expect #1 service if you are more concerned about price."</font color=blue>

    I appreciate the support cowboydoc, but I couldn't disagree more. With the amount of money involved and the purchase from a "reputable" company who certifies dealers, the attention to detail and service to the customer should be there, REGARDLESS of the deal offered by the seller. The question is whether the company in this case will honor their reputation by taking care of the consumer -- that's ME in this case, by the way. The attitude that quality doesn't matter because one can negotiate a good deal fosters this kind of treatment and will ultimately damage companies. I could go on and on. The Trooper I used to pick up the tractor has 157K with no problems. I researched it and bought FOREIGN because I wanted to drive it this long. I feel the same about my tractor purchase. While I absolutely believe in free enterprise, I also believe that companies build reputations on how they deliver products in appropriate condition. There was no informed consent to me that my tractor wouldn't be assembled properly or be adequately setup simply because I negotiated a good deal for it. That's absurd.

    Bill

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