Backhoe Older John Deere backhoe Hard Starting Question.... Please

[Dusty1]

Ok, I own a 1974 John Deere 410 TLB. It's a pretty large machine and runs pretty well once I get it started, but every time I crank on the engine when cold, I have to fire it about 3 times using starting fluid to get it to go. The first 2 times it starts for a second, and then dies, 3rd time usually being the charm. If I crank without starting fluid it just pretty much keeps turning over without catching.
To me it sounds like it dosen't have fuel, and the starting fluid is running it just enough to pump up some diesel. Now I'm fairly new to the diesel world so excuse my question if it seems dumb, but a while back I replaced the fuel filter and later got it started, so running it should bleed the rest of the air out of the fuel lines, right? Is it possible that the air has stayed in there and needs to be blead even now? I have looked over the lines and it dosen't appear to be leaking any diesel so the lines shouldn't need to be blead otherwise. I know starting fluid isn't good on this motor, so the less I use the better. Any suggestions?

Thanks!

 

[Egon]

How many hours on the engine?

 

[Dusty1]

Hour meter stopped not too long ago, but roughly 3000

 

[kennyd]

Does it have glow plugs:

If Yes-then you need to verify that they are a working properly

If No-then you may need to do a compression test to ensure the engine is healthy.

Another thing to check the the fuel return system, it takes excess fuel from the injectors back to the pump...if the hoses(13) or caps(12) leak, then the fuel drains back after it's shut off making starting hard, common problem on the IH 7.3L engine Ford used from '84 to '93.5.

 

[Egon]

Sounds like the way to go Kenny.:thumbsup:

 

[brin]

I have an old JD 3020 and it does not like to start in cold weather..I will pass on to you what a JD dealer told me years ago..he said do not use ether or starting fluid in the intake to get it started it can explode and blow your engine...On my 3020 there is a cap on the dash to unscrew and insert the starting fluid but I never tried it due to his warning. Instead.. I hook up a charger to just one of the batteries and set it on " fast start " and it starts right up...This is just the way I have done it over the years.

 

[Dusty1]

Yeah, the 74 is before glow plugs, if the rings are warn out it will have to stay that way. Thanks kenny, I'll check the return lines for fuel but at the very least I would have smelled it I think. The guy I got it from always used to adjust the injector pump all the way up to cut compression to the hydrolics to let it turn a bit better, but that dosen't always work. So bleeding the lines, is it necessary after it's been started?

Thanks for all your help so far!

 

[AKfish]

How many hours on the engine?

Ol', tired engine... (Just like me!) Back in the day - even with glow-plugs - still had to use starting fluid.
Especially with those high-hour farm tractors.

Something to consider with starting fluid. It's the ether vapors that ignite. Problems occur when the fluid is squirted directly into the engine and puddles or pools of fluid build up in the intake or cylinders.

You get "oil washdown" and/or explosive ignition!!

Use sparingly and direct the spray along the side of the air cleaner near the outside entrance so that only the vapor is pulled into the engine.

Kenny's suggestion to check for fuel "drainback" is very good advice as well.

AKfish

 

[kennyd]

Yeah, the 74 is before glow plugs, if the rings are warn out it will have to stay that way. Thanks kenny, I'll check the return lines for fuel but at the very least I would have smelled it I think. The guy I got it from always used to adjust the injector pump all the way up to cut compression to the hydrolics to let it turn a bit better, but that dosen't always work. So bleeding the lines, is it necessary after it's been started?

Thanks for all your help so far!

You won't smell the fuel, the leak is not external-it drains (usually) back to the tank.

Bleeding of the injector lines is not necessary after the engine is started and running well.

 

[Thomas]

This maybe worth checking..two main problem areas for fuel are #1 the fuel fitting at the tank-bottom, and #2 the plastic dampener inside the fuel-injection pump.