2320 hydro drive shaft just snapped off !!!

   / 2320 hydro drive shaft just snapped off !!! #101  
I'm sorry, but it is absolutely plain as day what happened there. Numerous other posters pointed out the same thing. Anyone who's worked around machinerey, or cars and trucks for that matter could see this, and has seen this many times over.

Not sure what being a metalurgist has to do with anything.

Glad to hear that JD is covering it. I would not have expected that!

i'd agree.

anyone who has been around u joints much would know thats markings of a joint being run while worn out. What kind of metal it is don't mean squat...the u joint wore out, period.

On the other hand, i do think it should be pointed out in the manual to watch for these things, as many ppl would not know that they are even there.

But then again, these are tractors, and if you own one you should probably be aware of how it works, its just too bad that this could have been a spendy lesson in life.

I know i don't check the u joints on my pickups. i drive them till i notice a problem, sometimes its just the joint to replace but i have had to replace knuckles. Did i go after GM?? no, because i should keep an eye on them closer.

U joints are considered a wear item.
 
   / 2320 hydro drive shaft just snapped off !!! #102  
tcartwri said:
I'm sorry, but it is absolutely plain as day what happened there. Numerous other posters pointed out the same thing. Anyone who's worked around machinerey, or cars and trucks for that matter could see this, and has seen this many times over.

Not sure what being a metalurgist has to do with anything.

Glad to hear that JD is covering it. I would not have expected that!

I tend to agree based on my own experience as well, the rust color and how beat up the yoke and trunnion are give clear evidence that the u-joint had been bad for a while. During the last 20 seconds of it's life is where all the needle bearings finally fell out and the whole thing got sloppy enough to cause serious vibration.

Shame on Yanmar (put the blame on the right party) for designing it so as to make it difficult to inspect and service these joints. Shame on John Deere for not pointing out these joints as inspection and maintenance items in the owner's manual. Applaud John Deere for doing the right thing by this customer in fixing it.

It's interesting that my old JD 316 has the same type of drive shaft between the engine and transaxle. I have to take the operator platform off and remove the drive shaft to get grease into the joints. Despite that, it still seems easier to service them on the 316 than on a 2320.
 
   / 2320 hydro drive shaft just snapped off !!! #103  
I'm sorry, but it is absolutely plain as day what happened there. Numerous other posters pointed out the same thing. Anyone who's worked around machinerey, or cars and trucks for that matter could see this, and has seen this many times over.

Not sure what being a metalurgist has to do with anything.

Glad to hear that JD is covering it. I would not have expected that!

Gotta disagree with you, Bro...

Although we all agreed it broke, no one determined why or how (other then say it was a lack of lubrication...which may or may not be the cause (my opinion is if lack of lubrication wasn't the cause, it probably contributed)).
The comment you wrote "The wear marks on this yoke indicate that the universal joint was broken for a long time. " (from your post) lacks a degree of credibility. You can state an opinion, but not a fact. There may have been a nick or other forging defect that resulted in the catastrophic failure...and cracks can propagate rapidly under stress (but I'm sure you know that). Could have been an internal defect.
There may not have been a visual cue prior to the event.
If these U-Joints are a wear item, or something that should be checked periodically, the manual should so state just as it does for checking fasteners at intervals).
How often do you check your tractor (or car or truck) U-Joints? I'll go first...U-joints on the PTO drive shaft...every time I use a driven implement (actually checking to ensure it's locked in place...the visual for damage is secondary); U-Joints on the MFWD shaft...only if I'm under the tractor for another reason (infrequently); Car and truck...never have so far.

Now, this is my last post on this particular topic (not the thread...just this topic). We just have to agree to disagree...
Otherwise, we'll just go back and forth ad nauseam, with no conclusion. You're welcome to have the "last word", if you wish...
 
   / 2320 hydro drive shaft just snapped off !!! #104  
i'd agree.

anyone who has been around u joints much would know thats markings of a joint being run while worn out. What kind of metal it is don't mean squat...the u joint wore out, period.

On the other hand, i do think it should be pointed out in the manual to watch for these things, as many ppl would not know that they are even there.

But then again, these are tractors, and if you own one you should probably be aware of how it works, its just too bad that this could have been a spendy lesson in life.

I know i don't check the u joints on my pickups. i drive them till i notice a problem, sometimes its just the joint to replace but i have had to replace knuckles. Did i go after GM?? no, because i should keep an eye on them closer.

U joints are considered a wear item.
I agree with some of both this post and what tcartwri says but here is where I differ. Unlike an auto that runs at high RPM's I don't see how this should happen on a tractor unless it had no grease in the 1st place. The manual NOT listing how to lube this, the lack of zerks and the location of where this joint is make me believe that it is permanently lubed so should last many years/hours. Typically you notice a bad u-joint on a car by high speed vibration or slap when reversing direction. This appears to only spin in one direction and seeing a tractor is inherently loud it's tough to know it's happening. I'm glad to see JD stepped up to the plate on this one seeing my bet is it started wearing from lack of lube on day one.
 
   / 2320 hydro drive shaft just snapped off !!! #105  
...my bet is it started wearing from lack of lube on day one.

My only question is, if it is lubrication, why aren't we seeing a rash of these failures?
 
   / 2320 hydro drive shaft just snapped off !!! #106  
My only question is, if it is lubrication, why aren't we seeing a rash of these failures?

why does a vehicle u joint go out at 20,000 miles, and the next one goes 100,000.

Some times sh*t happens.....

pretty hard to say they are all gonna go out at xxx hours..... Some of them might go forever, and some will die like this one did.
 
   / 2320 hydro drive shaft just snapped off !!! #108  
But then again, these are tractors, and if you own one you should probably be aware of how it works, its just too bad that this could have been a spendy lesson in life.

U joints are considered a wear item.


Am I reading this right? Now you have to be a mechanic to own a tractor?

The guy did nothing wrong!!!! This should not have happened in the first place!!

If the manual does not list these as points that need to be greased, and they had no zerks, then they must have been sealed U-joints, that didn't need to be greased.

As Roy Jackson stated "if it is lubrication, why aren't we seeing a rash of these failures?" Thats because this was probably just a bad U-joint from day one, and John Deere realizes it. They wouldn't be fixing it if it was due to poor mantenance.

How anyone is trying to put the blame on the owner, is just absurd. Did you see where this joint is located? Regular mantenance, I don't think so. Bottom line, if its not listed in the manual as a TO DO item, then it shouldn't need doing.

Very happy to hear that they covered it. Good for you and even better for Deere.
 
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   / 2320 hydro drive shaft just snapped off !!! #109  
Sorry to chime in late on this post mortem, folks, but I don't think it takes very much to explain what has caused this to happen.

First of all, its a fast driveline. it runs at engine speed, not 540, nor is it a steering shaft that runs at 0+ rpm.

The shaft connects an engine to a transmission. They MAY be some elevation or sideshift between the crankshaft vector and the transmission input shaft. But, there's probably very little DIFFERENCE between the directions of these two shafts.

The key piece of the puzzle is the photo showing the splined joint from the two piece driveshaft. That joint is probably there for assembly of the connection, not because these is relative motion between the 2 assemblies. If so, then a flex coupling likely would be used instead (as on most other JD tractors that have a separately connected motor and transmission. Thats because the motor is rubber mounted but the transmission is hard mounted.

Your Honor, it seems to me (as a Professional Engineer familiar with driveline mechanics and 20+ years in the field) that this driveshaft was misasembled. If the splined pieces are not aligned such that the phase angle of the input yoke and the output yoke was NOT ZERO, then a rocking moment existed in the driveshaft which eventually cause the cross retention pieces and bearings to fail. When the cross fell out of the bearing cups, it soon caused the shaft to be mechanically unstable and this resulted in catastrophic failure(s) down the line.

While I can't PROVE it beyond a reasonable doubt, it would be helpful for other owners to report back as to what the phase angles on their driveshafts are. If there are ANY which are non-zero, then these are likely going to have some pending failure with the worst one(s) being a shaft whose angles are 90 degrees in error. The failure is common to all machines from cars to trucks to any power take off driven machinery with this type of geometry.

It is possible that the shafts were misbuilt, that they were assembled incorrectly, or that this particular machine was serviced in a manner that required removal of one end of the driveshaft. If so and the shaft were reassembled incorrectlly, then this was a probable cause of the failure.

What would help from all you owners with similar model machines, would be for you to report back (with pictures if possible as to what the input and output yoke positions are. It is possible that they are randomly assembled (meaning a JD problem or owner problem.

The grease situation as a contributor to failure is remote because there is so little movment in the cross of a properly designed and installed shaft when the input and output couplings are colinear and parallel as to make wear and tear on the yoke bearings miniscule.

However, a misphased powershaft causes there to be unexpected cyclic end pressure on the bearing caps of all the U-joint parts. In fact a knowledgeable owner can recognize the unexpected vibration level. If one of the C clips retaining a bearing cup became over stressed, it could jump out and compromise the integrity of the shaft.

In court, a JD expert would describe how they deliberately misphased a driveshaft in an experiment and it blew out after a few hours of 'gentle' operation and some power cycles.

A jury would want to know who did that, so where are all the service records...

In other words, let's see what a dozen or so other owners have for shaft angles in their tractors. All the same or different?

If different, then there is a problem there. If not, and the shaft can be misassembled via a spline index shift OR a yoke/cross misassembly, then we have a winner.
 
   / 2320 hydro drive shaft just snapped off !!! #110  
I do not understand the mystery here. He uses it to pull a drag in a arena all the time..That is generating more dust than ever and it just dried out the u joints..

Sad thing is the Deere shaft never gets a chance to be straight it is always offset..
 
 
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