DK90 vs. Kubota M Series (M95S-M125X)

[mark.r]

Because I am bored for the most part but also because if business is good over the next couple of years (yes lots in the market can change in two years) we would be in the market for a 100 horsepower or so tractor. So I ask how do these units compare. Now let me say I did not compare the "orange" ones because they were . . . well orange. I chose these because they were the largests of their respective brands and relatively less confusing (although Kubota's offerings have become pretty confusing with the new models). All the different transmissions offered by the other big manufact. (Kubota included now) confuse me, one reason Kioti is nice. Obviously there is a fairly large difference between 78 PTO horsepower and 103 PTO (or is there) but that is the kind of information I am looking for. Furthermore, last time I looked the DK was considerably heavier than the Kubota, to the tune of 4000lbs. That can be good in agriculture but I am used to the sports car market where extra weight and less horsepower is BAD.

Our use for this monster would be hay production and large acreage brush hogging. I obviously want as much PTO horsepower for my money to increase my choice in implements. So how would the DK90 stack up against the 100+ horsepower Kubota M Series?

 

[Robert_in_NY]

If you are looking at this tractor for haying then you will want a good transmission with plenty of gears. You can get by with less but more is better.

I would not discount the other tractors on the market just because you are scared of them. Go talk to the dealers, hop in the tractor and drive it around the lot and see how easy they are to drive. These new trannys are actually a lot of fun to operate if you hay or spray crops. I have 8 forward gears with a powershift giving me 16 forward gears and if I see a heavy windrow coming up and can hit the powershift button and it down shifts me seamlessly so that the baler doesn't feed too fast. Once past it, tap the button and you are back up to speed. No clutching or such not.

Try out all the tractors, talk to the dealers and tell them what you want to do and see what they recommend.

As for brush chopping, what type of ground are you cutting? If all you are doing was hay then I would think a 2wd would be a great choice and save you a good chunk of money. If you are going to brush chop thru some heavy material where you will find soft spots or deal with hills a FWA tractor might come in handy. But if all you are doing is maintaining large, flat fields then 2wd will work great. I use a 90 pto hp, 2wd cab tractor for all my hay cutting and baling as well as all of my tillage and some planting.

 

[mark.r]

Hi Robert. Thanks for the reply. I didn't mean to sound as if I had written off the others. I originally owned a Ford/New Holland. So I had browsed those. I think the biggest thing the discourages mean presently, until I get a lot closer, to actually going to the lot and driving a model is the all the different transmissions. I am only doing arm chair research and my ignorance is the issue. For example, New Holland I believe has 3 or 4 different tranny's now. Having never used anything other than hydro and olds school manual shift I have no clue to what these new 16x16, 24x24 shuttle, EHSS, etc. really do and what there advantages vs. disadvantages are. So you are right I need to eventually go and talk to a dealer and have them show me how the work real time.

As far as 2wd vs. 4wd, I would have to go 4wd as we have way to many hill and soft terrain. Plus I think it would come in handy in my manure work.

 

[Robert_in_NY]

The tranny that states it is a 16x16 is just a 16 speed tranny with a shuttle, either manual or power shuttle (EHSS). The more gears 24x24 means you have 8 more gears then the 16 speed. If you see something like 12x4 you will know it is not a shuttle, it has 3 forward gears, one reverse gear and 4 ranges. It might sound complicated but it isn't. These new transmissions are very nice to run and generally very easy to use. I run mostly Ford/NH equipment so I am only familiar with their transmissions but from talking to others the other brands are all basically the same. They just have different names for the same basic thing.

I am assuming you are looking for something in the lines of the T6000 now if you go with NH (also known as the TS-A). If you go look at one of these tractors I will tell you right now to be careful. They have put one of the best cabs on the market on the TS-A. You feel so comfortable in that cab you don't want to leave. You keep looking at all the cab controls trying to figure out which one turns the TV on. It is an amazing cab and if you plan on spending any amount of time in the field you will want to demo these machines and use them for 6-10 hours doing what you want them to do. See how the tractor rides, operates and how you feel running them. Some of these new cab tractors have a real messed up layout (well, to me they are) while others feel natural.

I have not been in the large Kubota cab yet to see what that is like and have not even seen a picture of the Kioti you are talking about but do your homework now and then put them in the field to check your homework

 

[MessickFarmEqu]

You need to be very careful about making apples to apples comparions especialy when you get into farm tractors. When within one companies like you can see a 95 HP tractor but depending on how its optioned out the cost can very by several thousand. In the bigger frame Kubota's there are only two transmissions right now -- the X's are power shifts (buttons for up and down with electronic do-dads) and the S's are hydraulic shuttles with a mechanical and "swing shift" electronic range selectors (2x2). I'd highly recomend the X-series machines. They are very competivily priced for what they are, literaly $10,000 less than a Deere. As for your weight concern, anyone will tell you that the tractor must be balasted for field work. The literature and web show an unbalasted tractor, but almost all of them are equiped with Cast Iron rims that add 1500lbs. Throw a 1500lb front weight block on the front and your ready for tillage.

 

[art]

Most ag tractors depending on uses today run at 110lbs per horsepower to 130 which would be used predominately for tillage. These numbers are a standard for operating efficently in the field. Being to heavy will hurt tire life as well as put excess strain on the drive train.

To talk of the PTO horsepower, that IS the useable power of the tractor after all parasitic loss of horsepower from different types of drives like hydraulic pumps, air conditioning and transmissions. The gross numbers of horsepower to me gives an idea of what the tractor is but really a untangible number.

 

[Robert_in_NY]

The gross numbers of horsepower to me gives an idea of what the tractor is but really a untangible number.

But it can be a great selling point for some companies. I remember Cowboydocs experience with that one 5000 series Deere, the ac unit was robbing so much power the tractor couldn't pull his round baler well and Deere ended up taking it back towards a different tractor. The gross hp number was way up there as well as the pto hp but they didn't figure in the ac loss into their numbers which led to docs problem.

I would love to have one tractor of equal hp but just the base model and put them all to work and see which tractors really perform well at the base model price (without adding weights, options and such (well, just a cab)). Put them all to work at various task from brush chopping to baling hay to loader work to heavy tillage and finally to planting. Maybe all the OEMs can send me a base and deluxe model at the beginning of this year so I can try them all over the course of the year to give a real good review of them all

Maybe we can talk to Muhammad and see if he could start a magazine like consumer reports except dealing only with tractors and farm equipment I know I would love to get brand new tractors and equipment given to me for trial. New Holland can start out with a Stackwagon this summer

 

[mark.r]

Thanks for the post guys. The large tractor market is very new to me so much of what I post is ignorance in search answers. One question was already answered as to the difference in the Kubota X's vs. S's. As well as the large weight differences published. I wonder if Kioti's published weights are unbalasted. I tend to say no because if I remember correctly last time I was sitting in my dealers office we looked up the weight of the DK90 sans loader and it was in the 9-10,000lb range. If I recall that is quite a bit heavier than an unbalasted Kubota but that should be expected.

At Roberts recommendation I did take a gander at the NH T6000 I believe it was . . . mmmmmm. Can you say apple pie. I would be using whatever I get for hay production, brush hogging, and loader work so however balast, horsepower, and importantly transport from field to field relates to those tasks feel free to comment.

 

[Robert_in_NY]

Just make sure you get Radials on which ever tractor you get. They will smooth out the ride so much it is amazing and when you are in a tractor all day the radials are worth their price. They also provide better traction. However, I have heard from people who brush chop heavy brush and they have puncture issues with radials if you are cutting brush and trees. If all you are doing is knocking down grass and weeds or small saplings (just sprouting) then it wouldn't be a problem.

The T6000 cab sure is nice isn't it

 

[mark.r]

Just make sure you get Radials on which ever tractor you get. They will smooth out the ride so much it is amazing and when you are in a tractor all day the radials are worth their price. They also provide better traction. However, I have heard from people who brush chop heavy brush and they have puncture issues with radials if you are cutting brush and trees. If all you are doing is knocking down grass and weeds or small saplings (just sprouting) then it wouldn't be a problem.

The T6000 cab sure is nice isn't it

T6000, it's like apple pie, brownies and all that you know you should touch but is soooo good.

Radials should be fine. No real heavy brush, at least not with the big tractor. Anything that is that thick I would do with my small 45hp and small cutter. Pretty much heavy weeds small trees, sapplings and over grown pasture type stuff as you said.