Which one ck20hst or ck25hst or ck30hst?

[Xtremesvc]

I have a dilemma! I am looking at getting an CK25HST w/KL130 loader, 5' brush, 60" tiller, liquid filled AG tires and hooks welded to the bucket for $17825.00 in Colorado. I was also thinking of getting the CK30HST for the extra 5 horses, but that would be $1200.00 more for only 4 hp more at the PTO. I am having issue of paying out $300 per 1 hp, but do I really need it for the jobs I am going to do with my new landscape/lawn care business. I have landed an account to take care of a 5 acre orchard (disc and tilling) and plan on doing more when I get the back hoe attachment later in the year. The other issue I have, is my trailer is rated at 7000#s and was thinking of getting the CK20HST, but my dealer is trying to talk me out of it and going with the CK30HST. I will be pulling all this with a 2001 Ford Supercrew rated at 7700#s pulling which I have done in the past with my 19' TT. By the way, the truck is scheduled next week to get the 3.55 gears replaced with 4.10's in both front and back axles.

Thanks,
Bill

 

[kentrodngun]

Bill, I'm like Tim the Tool Man - more power! If you under-power yourself and find you need it or wish you had it, you'll kick yourself for a long time. In the grand scheme of things, what's another $1200 when you're spending almost $18k? Extra HP for disking & tilling when you hit certain soil types will be a God send.

In regard to your trailering questions, when you add the backhoe you'll add about 1,000 to the tractor/loader combo. I think the 30 HP tips the scales at around 4k, so that's 5k with the hoe and the trailer probably weighs 1.5k. Total should be about 6.5k and with chains, binders, blocks/chocks, etc, close to 7k. I'd recommend pulling it with a F250 but I'm sure we'll hear from plenty of guys who do it with an F150. If you are doing it as a business and trailing often, I'd strongly suggest the F250. (Just my 2 cents worth).

Good luck on your decision and keep us posted.

 

[BTI]

CK30HST, you will not be disappointed with the extra power.
If you are tilling with a 60" tiller I would suggest a minimum of the CK30HST.
My preference would be the CK35HST.
Since you are using it for a biz, time is money.........

BTI

 

[Agro-oti]

I'm going to go with BTI on the CK35h as the better choice all around. Especially since it is for business use. Why the ag tires though instead of the industrials for a landscaping/lawn care business?

 

[albmn10]

Hello Bill, with your intended uses i would suggest nothing smaller then the ck30hst.. The ck35 would be nice as well since time is money and the extra hp and pto hp would benefit you here. Good luck.. Matt

 

[Xtremesvc]

One reason for the Ag tires is the dirt/soil around the area has alot of clay/rocks and when it gets wet look out, so I decided to drop the Ind. tires and also saved $300.00. GOOD old Colorado top soil! Going to the CK35HST is way too much on the pocket book at this time. As for my truck, its paid for and I have pulled my 19 foot TT with no problems. I always know that I am pulling a trailer and I do not drive like AJ Foyt when loaded.

 

[bearhawk]

Get the CK30HST.

You can always throttle down, but if you need more power, what are you going to do.

I had always heard. If you get a CK25, get the gear. But if you want HST, get the 30.

Jim

 

[Steverino]

Get the CK30HST.

You can always throttle down, but if you need more power, what are you going to do.

I had always heard. If you get a CK25, get the gear. But if you want HST, get the 30.

Jim

I ditto that!

 

[IslandTractor]

Get the CK30HST.

You can always throttle down, but if you need more power, what are you going to do.

I had always heard. If you get a CK25, get the gear. But if you want HST, get the 30.

Jim

I've been biting my tongue on this thread but I cannot resist the urge to counter unrestrained the more is better argument.

One must look at the whole package not just the HP. Of course a 30hp tractor will do more than a 25 or 20 but why not get a 35, 40, 50 or 80hp tractor with that argument. The question is whether you can appropriately match the tractor, implements, tasks, transport, storage and budget to get an optimized combo.

If you need more power then perhaps you are using implements that are incorrectly sized. I can run any implement with my 21 hp tractor that a CK30 can run but the appropriately sized implements for me are about a foot narrower. That could be a disadvantage in some settings but can also be a significant advantage. I can store my tractor and tools in less space, I need a smaller trailer to move them, I paid less for both tractor and implements and for the same budget I can have more or better implements than someone who just buys "more horsepower". Also, my KL120 loader is very close to the capacities of the KL130 matched to the bigger CKs and is pretty close to best in class for 21hp tractors. The CK35 has worst in class loader capacity (compared to competitors 35hp tractors).

The original poster clearly has a tight budget and therefore the "more is better" philosophy is problematic. If his landscape business involves numerous smaller jobs then the time savings he will experience using implements that are one foot larger will be a relatively small proportion of the total time on job. Obviously set up, trailering etc etc are identical times regardless of tractor hp. Tilling with a 5ft vs 4ft tiller does not save 20% of project time. The cost of the upgrade to even 25hp much less 30 or 35 would cover lots of extra specialized implements such as a grapple, 4n1 bucket etc. Overloading his trailer with a bigger tractor or needing to leave a specialized implement at home because the tractor weight precludes bringing it to a job are also negatives he should balance against the benefit of more Hp.

I've posted quite a lot on the capabilities of the CK20 TLB. A potential landscaper might want to look at a recent post documenting the type of work done with a 21hp mighty mite CK. Check it out: http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/kioti-owning-operating/96980-lots-firsts-here.html#post1103607

 

[Bob_Skurka]

I am looking at getting an CK25HST w/KL130 loader, 5' brush, 60" tiller, liquid filled AG tires . . . I was also thinking of getting the CK30HST. . . I am going to do with my new landscape/lawn care business . . . I get the back hoe attachment later . . . my trailer is rated at 7000#s . . . I will be pulling all this with a 2001 Ford Supercrew rated at 7700#s

Bill you are going to be dangeriously overloaded with either the CK25 or 30.

The CK30-Gear tractor weights 3042#.
The CK30-HST tractor weighs 3055#.
The KL-130 loader weighs 770#.
So the tractor and the loader will weigh roughly 3820#.

Assume roughly 500# up to 800# for the brush cutter
Assume roughly 500# up to 700# for the tiller
Assume roughly 500# for the liquid filled tires.
Assume roughly 80# for a full tank of diesel in the tractor
Assume roughly 200# for 6 chains and binders to comply with DOT standards
Assume the trailer, which is rated for 7000# has an empty weight of 1600# (presumes a 16' trailer) or 2000# (presumes a 20' trailer).

If you have an 1800# (18') trailer, you are up to 3580# in weight without the tractor. That leaves you 3420# of capacity for the tractor, loader & backhoe. (Tiller + Brush Cutter were both calculated at only 500# each, so it is very possible the total combined weight could = 4080#)

3580 (trailer, implements, fluids) + 3820 (tractor) = 7400# without the backhoe.

You are over the rated trailer capcity by 400# without the backhoe. Add a backhoe, which weighs over 1000# (when you incude the weight of the bucket) and you are now 1400# over the trailer capacity and and 700# over the truck's capacity. Also consider that a CK30 tractor, loader, backhoe won't fit on an 18' trailer so step up to a 20' trailer and your trailer weight also goes up about 200#, which now means that your total weight is 1600# pounds over your trailer capacity (you are already at 8600# on a 7000# trailer ), and # over the truck's tow capacity.

Now if you are in the landscaping business, then it is reasonable to assume you will have shovels, tools, extra fuel cans, drinking water, and other things on the trailer. You will easily be at 9500# (and could be up to 10,000# if your implements weigh over 500# each) on a 7000# trailer.

• Now if anyone tells you a 7000# trailer can safely hold that, they are a liar.
• If anyone tells you your truck can safely tow that, they are a liar.
• If you think your truck's transmission and brakes will hold up for the long term, you are mistaken.
• You are also in violation of commercial towing laws and better hope the DOT inspectors don't grab you because they could possibly impound your whole rig.

BTW . . . if you downsized to a CK20, a 48" rotary cutter, a 48" tiller then your weights will be roughly:

• 1675# = tractor: 1193# + 400# for liquid fill + 80# fuel (in the tractor's fuel tank)
• 650# = loader
• 885# = backhoe: 785# hoe + 100# bucket
• 400# = tiller: 400# to 600#
• 400# = cutter: 400# to 650#
• 200# = chains and binders
• 1800# = approximate raw trailer weight, 18' trailer
• Add another 400# for additional fuel, tools, water, supplies

• 6410# = total combined weight of CK20, trailer + supplies

Using the CK20 with your truck & trailer gives you a modest amount of safety capacity. Even if you used a heavy duty tiller + HD rotary cutter, your total weight would likely be in the range of 6850#. Not much margin for error here, but still just under your legal maximum capacity.

If you need to use a larger rotary cutter and larger tiller than the CK20's PTO HP can manage, then you better look at a different brand that offers a lighter weight tractor with greater engine/PTO horsepower. A Kubota B7800 is a 30hp tractor that weighs a little more than the CK20 and powers the same size implements as the CK30. It is a basic machine without some of the nice features the CK offers, it has lower lift capacity than the CK30 too, but the tractor weighs about 1741# (add ~450# for fluid fill and you are under 2200# for the tractor) you will be pushing your trailer capacity but still stay under 7000# with a B7800 configured as the CK20 is configured.

The other option is to move up to a bigger truck and bigger trailer to haul a CK25/30 tractor.