LK3054 Alternator

[Jimmyb33]

I've had my tractor a little over a year and the more I look at it the more things I find that the previous owner jacked up! When I bought it, the guy told me "I don't think the alternator is working right.... the light stays on on the dash and I sometimes have to charge the battery if it's set up for a while..." Well, since I've had it, I've only had to chagre the battery twice. The second time I realized the battery was dry as a bone. I filled it up, gave it a charge and haven't had a problem since. So, i'm prettty sure the alternator is working correctly, but I'd like to see if I can get the light to go off on the dash. I tried to make some since of the shop manual wireing diagrams, but I'm pretty lost there. It does look to me that there should be 3 or 4 wires coming off the alternator. I have 2. See the pictures below... the wire with the push on connector is runing to the black box on the firewall (regulator?). the other wire (nut on connector) is running into a bundle of wires covered with elecrtictal tape. I've got to sort those out when I get time. Can anyone tell me what wires are missing and where these two are supposed to go? Ultamately I'd like to have this all corrected and all the wires running in shrink tubing or something better than electrical tape!!!

Thanks!

jb

[IXLR8]

This is a guess, but I believe the nut labeled 'B' (for Battery) will go to- the fusible link in the schematic then on to the battery, and to the 'B' on the ignition switch. The push on connector below it, this should be the 'F' connection, which is the field, which excites the alternator and controls its output. The 'F' is not labeled on the schematic, it is the lead that goes from the regulator to the single coil in the alternator. In your schematic it is on the left side of the alternator. The 3 coils that are connected together are the actual alternator output coils. From the schematic, it looks like the regulator has a relay that drives the 'Charge Lamp', it looks like there are two relays in the regulator, my guess is the one for the 'CL' is not working if the alternator is indeed putting out. What is the voltage on the battery when the tractor is running above 1500rpm. If the alternator is working, it should be between 14.0-14.5 volts. Anything less then 13.0 and you have a problem somewhere. Keep in mind that the schematic shows the ground wire connections when actually it is the tractor frame, engine block and alternator mounting bracket making the connections, not separate wires.

HTH

[Jimmyb33]

Thanks for the reply IXLR8... Your description makes it a bit clearer for me. I'll have to dig out my multimeter over the weekend and check the voltage. I'll report back.

jb

[IXLR8]

JB- After studying your photo and schematic... I think you maybe missing a wire. The schematic shows 4 wires coming off the alternator, you have 3. You have "B" as the output lead to the battery. You have "F" as the lead to the Field to control the output. You have "E" the alternator frame itself as the ground/earth connection. But it looks like you should have another lead going back to the regulator, I believe that would be the "N" connection. Do you have all 6 wires coming out of the connector for the regulator? If you do... then I suspect that one of them goes nowhere and it should go back to the alternator. My CK30 has the regulator built in, not separate like your is, but according to the schematic I have 4 wires. On mine, the 4th wire goes directly to the dash charging light, where yours goes to the regulator and it in turn controls the dash light.
HTH

[kentrodngun]

Jimmy, I will look at my machine when I get a chance (close by but I've been sick). In the meantime attached is the Electrical diagram from my engine manual - it differs from the LK3054 Owner's Manual Electrical diagram, but perhaps it's better.

[IXLR8]

Originally Posted by kentrodngun

Jimmy, I will look at my machine when I get a chance (close by but I've been sick). In the meantime attached is the Electrical diagram from my engine manual - it differs from the LK3054 Owner's Manual Electrical diagram, but perhaps it's better.

Your diagram is the same as my CK30, it looks like the regulator is internal to the alternator, JB's is external. Where are all the service techs when you need one?

[Jimmyb33]

Thanks guys for your replys... and thanks kentrodngun for the diagram. I'm stil trying to figure all this out. I got out there this evening with my multimeter and camera phone... I checked the voltage at the battery before cranking the eninge and after... It was 12.34v each time. Checked again at about 1500 rpm and still 12.34v. I checked the "B" connections on the back of the alternator ang got the same. So it looks like maybe the alternator is not working correctly right? One thing I havent tried yet..(just thought of it) is to remove the positive battery cable after it's started and check the voltage on the alternator...

Here's a couple of pictures of the regulator (I think?) front and back. The wire from the "F" on the alternator is connected to the "FIELD" side of the regulator... There is no other wires connected to the regulator though... That doesn't seem right to me at all! What's the silver box with all the wires connected to it?

Thanks again for all y'all's help!!

jb

[IXLR8]

JB- Based on what you have said so far, there is no output from your alternator. I suspect after looking at your last pictures, that there is no input to the Field wire to the alternator. Next time you run the tractor, see if there is any voltage going to the "F" connector on the alternator, I suspect it will be zero. If so... that is where we need to start. I am guessing, based on mounting and wiring connector (ring lug), that what you have labeled as "Regulator?" is an aftermarket addon regulator. I suspect it is missing some wires and that is part of your problem. My guess, based on the wiring connector (6 pin molex) and the mounting, is that what you have labeled "What's this?" is the original regulator. It is still connected to part of the system, which is why you have the alt light on the dash, but no longer connected to the Field of the alternator and that is why there is no alternator output. If you notice, things that look original, are mounted to bumps stamped in the sheet metal, the suspected aftermarket item is bolted to flat sheet metal.
I hate to say say this... but at this point... I would trace out all the wires from the item you have labeled "what's this?" This would verify that it is indeed the 'old' regulator, we can see what goes where and what needs to be corrected. This is not going to be a fun task, but it is necessary before we put in a new regulator (which is what i suspect you need) and possibly blow it up, lets try and avoid that. After looking at all your posts again, it might be possible that your alternator is not the original one either... that is really going to muck up the troubleshooting.
It would be really good if some of the other 3054 owners would chime in and let us know what they have.

[Jimmyb33]

Thanks again or the input IXLR8.... It is all strating to make some sinse... The black "regulator" is only held on with the one screw on top. It's a "self tapping" sheet metal screw. That thing's been flopping around up there til I added some washer to it to help it tighten up. So it's very likely that "regulator" is doing nothing but looking ugly.?... I'll check the voltage on the "F" connection next time I crank it up. And I will start tracing out the wires on the "original regulator" and see where they are going.

So it is likely that the alternotor doesn't work at all and that I am running only on battery power. All other things electrical seem to work... headlights, flashers, dash lights... but I only turn them on for fun once in a while... I hardly ever work after dusk... so those things aren't really draining the battery.

There are a couple of other "funny" things on this tractor that I am finding but will get into those later.

So now it looks like I might be getting to a point where I can spend some $$ and get all this working right, or have the "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" attitude and just keep putting the battery on the charger every couple of months....


jb

[IXLR8]

I am afraid you are probably running on battery only, which once the tractor is started, is about all you need with a diesel. I would put the battery on a charge on a regular basis, once per month depending on usage, to keep it charged and have it last longer. Part of me goes with your 'if it ain't broke, don't fix it' mentality. But I would get tired of having to charge the battery, here in the north the battery would not last long with cold winter starts. Someday you might want to run at night, have some lights or something extra. I suspect if you could just get some way to properly control some power to your "Field" connection that the alternator would have some output. I am fairly sure the 'regulator' is doing nothing but looking ugly at the moment. If you put battery voltage on the other terminal, "Ign" then you might have an output on the "FLD" terminal and the alternator might then function. You are taking a chance in toasting the alternator if you do that... although it might already be dead. Is there any chance you can get the cover off of the "regulator" and post a few pictures of the insides? Let's see what the insides of the "regulator" look like before we try any more troubleshooting.
You mentioned in one post about disconnecting the battery after the tractor is running. In general that is not a good idea, alternators depend on having a load to dump their power into. It is possible to fry an alternator if you pull the battery when the engine is running, although in your case with no Field to excite the alternator, it probably would not be an issue.