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  1. #11
    Silver Member
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    DK45s with cab

    Default Re: Out of fuel DK45s

    Quote Originally Posted by JoelD View Post
    This may be a silly thing, but looks like the cable from the fuel shut off at the injector is disconnected? Did you do that? Is it possible the fuel cut off at the injector is off? I think that on my machine at least I've got a manual fuel cut off at the injector, which is how I shut my machine down.

    Do you know for a fact the feeder pump is working?

    Not for nothing, but depending on the year, are you still under warranty?

    Joel
    anything is possible Joel

    I didn't see any loose cables at the injectors but I wasn't looking for it either...why do you think it is disconnected? Can you reference the items in my picture to help me see what you're seeing? It could be something like this because as I've said before, the tractor didn't sputter prior to shutting down, it just shut down - but it was very low on fuel. Anybody else know where the fuel shutoff is located or is there a fuse/relay for the fuel pump(s)???

    I don't know that the feeder pump is working except that the filter is getting fuel - I guess the only way to check is to disconnect the hose and watch for the fuel to spurt out when I have somebody turn the ignition on....

    I'm under warranty but live in the middle of nowhere and have no trailer to haul it the one hour to the closest dealer...so I'm kinda stuck...and going on day 8 without power with 12 more inches of snow tomorrow...

    John
    John

    Kioti DK45S with cab, Quick Attach, Kioti loader, Kioti backhoe, Woods 7' LR 107 rake, forks, 9' snowpusher, 60" and 72" loader buckets, 72" Woods brush bull, King Kutter 72" box blade, CCM hydro top link

  2. #12
    Super Star Member EddieWalker's Avatar
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    Several, all used and abused.

    Default Re: Out of fuel DK45s

    John,

    Did you get it started yet?

    I don't know your tractor, but all three of my diesel tractors follow this basic principal, and yes, I've had to do it with all three of them.

    When you ran out of fuel, you let air enter the lines. To get it to run again, you need to get the air out of the lines.

    From the fuel tank, your line will go to either the fuel pump or fuel filter. Crack the line at the opposite side of the tank and turn over the engine until fuel comes out of the line. If it is the fuel filter, take it off and make sure it's full of diesel. Do you have one or two fuel filters? Make sure they are both full of diesel.

    Tighten up that line and go to the next thing along that fuel line and loosen it on the opposite side of the tank. Turn over the engine until you get fuel coming out of that line. Sometimes you will see air bubbles, but mostly it will just be fuel that comes out.

    Work your way to the injector pump. Crack the lines coming out of the injector pump and do the same thing. Here you should see air bubbles. Tighten that line and make sure everything else along the line is tight.

    Now loosen the lines to your injectors and do the same. Sometimes the engine will start right up when you do this, but other times it takes a bit of cranking the engine to get all the air out of the lines. You should see bubbles here too. Do this until the engine starts, then turn off the engine and tighten up the lines.

    Don't take off the lines, just loosen them. the idea is to flush out the air with the fuel. You'll lose a gallon of diesel doing this, and depending on your battery, you might need a charger or source to jump your battery. This should be about an hour project to get it going again. As long as there's air in the lines, fuel wont make it to your injectors and your engine will not run.

    Most diesels that I know of have pumps on them to do this, but I've found that cranking the engine works allot better then those little pumps.

    Good luck,
    Eddie

  3. #13
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    DK45s with cab

    Default Re: Out of fuel DK45s

    Quote Originally Posted by EddieWalker View Post
    John,

    Did you get it started yet?


    Most diesels that I know of have pumps on them to do this, but I've found that cranking the engine works allot better then those little pumps.

    Good luck,
    Eddie
    Eddie - thanks a bunch for the advice...not started yet...I did a lot of what you suggested... and see no fuel when I cracked the lines at the injector pump...can you take a look at some of the other questions I have along with the pictures? that will help me decide if I potentially have a fuel injector pump issue or a blown fuse, etc...thanks, John.
    John

    Kioti DK45S with cab, Quick Attach, Kioti loader, Kioti backhoe, Woods 7' LR 107 rake, forks, 9' snowpusher, 60" and 72" loader buckets, 72" Woods brush bull, King Kutter 72" box blade, CCM hydro top link

  4. #14
    Super Star Member EddieWalker's Avatar
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    Default Re: Out of fuel DK45s

    John

    If your tractor ran before you ran out of fuel, which I'm assuming is how you ran out of fuel, then I would think that everything is fine with your tractor. I know it's real easy to look for other reasons for something that's not working, but with air in fuel lines, it's just about being patient and sticking to it.

    I don't know of any electrical fuel injector pumps, but don't know enough about diesels, modern autos/trucks or the high tech stuff to know if they exist or not. On the tractors that I have, and I'm assuming yours, is that the injector pump is timed from the flywheel or camshaft. Having it timed (connected) to the gears makes sure it works at the right time, every time. Simple and effective.

    Did you take off the fuel line before the injector pump? I've gotten impatient and tried to take a shortcut on mine. I've even had fuel at the injectors, but couldn't get it to start. Sometimes you will see fuel, but there's still air in the lines. You also need to loosen all the fuel lines from the injector. Sometimes one or two of them will get the most fuel and if you pulled the week one, it might not bleed out the air. If it doesn't bleed out the first time, you just have to do it again and again until you get it right.

    Did you pull the fuel filter and make sure it's full of fuel? This was my mistake the last time I ran out of fuel. I wasted an entire morning trying to get my dozer started, and then went and bought five gallons of diesel, filled up both fuel filters and had it running in about half an hour.

    Good luck,
    Eddie

  5. #15
    Silver Member
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    DK45s with cab

    Default Re: Out of fuel DK45s

    Eddie - I'll give it another shot on Saturday when I have a second person to help...will let you know what happens, thanks, John
    John

    Kioti DK45S with cab, Quick Attach, Kioti loader, Kioti backhoe, Woods 7' LR 107 rake, forks, 9' snowpusher, 60" and 72" loader buckets, 72" Woods brush bull, King Kutter 72" box blade, CCM hydro top link

  6. #16
    Veteran Member IH3444's Avatar
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    Default Re: Out of fuel DK45s

    And don't forget to besure that the fuel tank is filled, this sometimes helps push the fuel through with only gravity pressure. We have all been here before.

  7. #17
    Super Member Highbeam's Avatar
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    South Puget Sound, WA
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    Kioti CK30HST

    Default Re: Out of fuel DK45s

    I haven't ran out of fuel in the last 750 hours on my tractor but I will comment that I also have no manual shutoff cable attached to the pump. Just like John's DK there is a place for one but no cable.

    You say you are still under warranty John. Your DK is from 1993! 15 years ago!

    Another item to consider is that at the bottom of your fuel tank is sludge and water. When you run the tank low you have a greater than usual chance of stirring that stuff up and sucking it in.

    I suspect air in the lines and you'll need to purge it.
    Kioti CK30HST, FEL w/toothbar, 60" RC, 60" BB, PJ 10k trailer. Weekend warrior hauling 50 miles each way.

  8. #18
    Veteran Member JoelD's Avatar
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    Kioti LK3054xs TLB, 2004

    Default Re: Out of fuel DK45s

    Quote Originally Posted by buyerjohn View Post
    Okay - spent a couple of hours trying to debug. I was by myself so it made it difficult to do this properly.


    Here is a picture of the fuel filter...definitely a different set up than any of the shop manuals...there is no petcock. There is a small valve on the far right side that can be opened and the top of the unit is a pump - to pump air out of the filter. I did this but it still didn't start. Here is a picture of that section:



    I did not remove any hoses at this section which is the fuel feed pump...it feeds the fuel filter:




    Here is the fuel injector pump section with the 4 lines leading to the injectors/valves.



    I loosened the center nut (with the black wire crossing it) and fuel flowed from this location. I then removed the left most injector line at the pump and cranked the starter. No fuel flowed out of the pump at this point. A couple of questions:

    1. is the injector pump electrically powered? If so, is this the FFT fuse? or is it another fuse? The FFT fuse appeared good when I checked it.

    2. this tractor only has 300 hours on it...could the injector pump be bad?

    3. Ideas on how to better test the injector pump?

    Having no fuel flowing out of the injector pump seems to be consistent with the tractor just dying instead of sputtering to a stop if I had indeed run out of gas.

    I should have removed some of the fuel lines when cranking but didn't have a 2nd set of hands.

    John.
    In the third picture, to the right of the four metal fuel lines coming off of the pump there looks to be a lever, with hole in the end, looks like it may be a manual fuel cut off? Not sure. Wondering what that is, could it be a fuel cut off?

    My LK has a manual fuel cut off cable.

    I am thinking the others are likely correct and you've got to clear your lines or maybe you sucked up some dirt and are clogged (would think unlikely).

    I'd give Rick Wallace a call, see if on the phone he can help with diagnostics.

    But you've definately been given the written scoop on bleeding lines from the other guys.

    If you do get fuel from the "pre-pump" but not the injection pump. Would think it odd that you'd have a clog inbetween them? Maybe a fuel celenoid shut, would think unlikely that the injection pump went bad.

    Joel
    Joel
    2004 Kioti LK3054XS TLB
    Woods Box Blade
    King Cutter Tiller
    Three Point Snow Blower
    York rake
    60 inch king kutter tiller
    1994 Ford F600 Dump Truck "Kioti Hauler"

  9. #19
    Silver Member
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    Berkshires, MA
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    DK45s with cab

    Default Re: Out of fuel DK45s

    You say you are still under warranty John. Your DK is from 1993! 15 years ago!
    My DK45s was purchased new in 2006 - may look like 1993 but it's not!
    John

    Kioti DK45S with cab, Quick Attach, Kioti loader, Kioti backhoe, Woods 7' LR 107 rake, forks, 9' snowpusher, 60" and 72" loader buckets, 72" Woods brush bull, King Kutter 72" box blade, CCM hydro top link

  10. #20
    Silver Member
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    DK45s with cab

    Default Re: Out of fuel DK45s

    Quote Originally Posted by JoelD View Post
    In the third picture, to the right of the four metal fuel lines coming off of the pump there looks to be a lever, with hole in the end, looks like it may be a manual fuel cut off? Not sure. Wondering what that is, could it be a fuel cut off?

    My LK has a manual fuel cut off cable.

    I am thinking the others are likely correct and you've got to clear your lines or maybe you sucked up some dirt and are clogged (would think unlikely).

    I'd give Rick Wallace a call, see if on the phone he can help with diagnostics.

    But you've definately been given the written scoop on bleeding lines from the other guys.

    If you do get fuel from the "pre-pump" but not the injection pump. Would think it odd that you'd have a clog inbetween them? Maybe a fuel celenoid shut, would think unlikely that the injection pump went bad.

    Joel
    I'll take a look at that lever...haven't had a chance to try bleeding the lines yet, too much snow and just got the power back after 9 days in the dark...

    Anybody know what that lever is and which direction it should be pushed/pulled???
    John

    Kioti DK45S with cab, Quick Attach, Kioti loader, Kioti backhoe, Woods 7' LR 107 rake, forks, 9' snowpusher, 60" and 72" loader buckets, 72" Woods brush bull, King Kutter 72" box blade, CCM hydro top link

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