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  1. #21
    Elite Member milkman's Avatar
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    Ky. Between Dead Horse Holler and Yellowbank
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    BX2200, BCS 735

    Default Re: 2003 Dk50C 4A200T head bolt length

    Hope that fixes it, I'll let you know what I see at HD&R when I get over there.
    Hate is like drinking poison, hoping your enemy will die. unknown author

  2. #22
    Elite Member Coyote machine's Avatar
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    Southern VT
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    '10 Kioti DK 40se/hst KL-401 FEL, loaded tires, KB-2485 bhoe, Tuffline TB160 boxblade, Woods QA forks, MIE Hydraulic bhoe thumb & ripper tooth, Igland 4001 winch, & GR-20 Log Grapple. Woods BBX72" Mower. Diamondplate aluminum canopy.

    Default Re: 2003 Dk50C 4A200T head bolt length

    Quote Originally Posted by LTEnterprises View Post
    quick update, I found the issue ( I hope) the pre comb inserts were higher than the head sealing surface, gottem flattened. Using my learned machine shop apprentice days of taking a flat file before gauging, and running it over the head surface. removes high spots caused by bolt tightening and knocks off any small high spots.....I got the pre comb inserts flat, straight edged the block and head...GOOD drag using a .001" feeler gauge...took some internal coolant passage pix with my snap on BK6000 borescope. Also got some inside the pre comb chambers while looking for cracks / leaks.


    I have more, this should give an idea of inside condition though
    My question is how and when do you think the precomb inserts got higher than the head surface? Do you think they have been that way since day one, or since the first head gasket blew out? What do you think could have caused it? Is it likely a factory defect, or a result of shaving the head when the first gasket was replaced, or most recently?
    2010 DK-40se/hst, Kioti KL-401 FEL, (reversible Kioti cutting edge), 72" Ratchet Rake. Fit Rite Top-N-Tilt hydraulics & diverter valve. HLA Series 2000 7' snowplow, Aquiline MPC rear chains. Samuri Sickle bar.

    Scag Wildcat: Kawasaki 26HP, with bagger. Dr. brush mower, & 42" lawn deck, Dr. self propelled, 6.5HP Trimmer mower. Pro-Mow 3 gang mower, no HP.

    Bunch of STIHL chainsaws: 011x 2, MS192T, MS200T, MS180C, MS230, MS270 (Wood Boss), 038 Farmboss, '86 anniversary edition.

  3. #23
    Silver Member LTEnterprises's Avatar
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    KY
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    2003 Kioti 50C FEL with QA, 72" root grapple, woods ' box blade, kioti 72" tiller,18J mini excavator, 71 GMC dump truck, 4 200 cc dirt bikes, 500cc BMX XUV 4x4, 346 xp killer chain saw, 40x64x12 insulated epoxy coated floor garage

    Default Re: 2003 Dk50C 4A200T head bolt length

    CM..I didn't have the head machined when the 1st gasket let go. I DID see an area for improvement on the HG design...ALL of the small coolant hole between the siamesed cyl's are encircled with compression metal, the 2 hole @ each end are not....I can see if the comp ring split between layers, that could DEFINATELY allow compression to get into those very easily.

    as for the inserts, I dont know when they "grew"...I dont see HOW they could have being compressed by the bolts and HG ???

    I'm thinking improperly installed from the beginning, just not ENOUGH protrusion to cause immediate issues ??....just a SWAG on my part....STILL haven't gotten a delivery tracking or confirmation from MIE......getting parts for these is like pulling teeth I tell ya
    Todays Mighty Oak is just Yesterdays NUT that held it's ground

  4. #24
    Elite Member Coyote machine's Avatar
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    Southern VT
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    '10 Kioti DK 40se/hst KL-401 FEL, loaded tires, KB-2485 bhoe, Tuffline TB160 boxblade, Woods QA forks, MIE Hydraulic bhoe thumb & ripper tooth, Igland 4001 winch, & GR-20 Log Grapple. Woods BBX72" Mower. Diamondplate aluminum canopy.

    Default Re: 2003 Dk50C 4A200T head bolt length

    LTE,

    I agree that logically the inserts have been wrong since day one. It would make sense that this is what took out the factory gasket prematurely, after some hours on the engine. Then without the problem being noticed, and left un-repaired, before the first gasket replacement, the inserts caused it to fail too. Now you've found the likely culprit and have most likely solved it. The chance of compressing head bolts crushing the gasket enough to 'cause' the insert issue is remote at best.

    Call Denise at MIE and see where your parts are- she'll give you a tracking #.
    2010 DK-40se/hst, Kioti KL-401 FEL, (reversible Kioti cutting edge), 72" Ratchet Rake. Fit Rite Top-N-Tilt hydraulics & diverter valve. HLA Series 2000 7' snowplow, Aquiline MPC rear chains. Samuri Sickle bar.

    Scag Wildcat: Kawasaki 26HP, with bagger. Dr. brush mower, & 42" lawn deck, Dr. self propelled, 6.5HP Trimmer mower. Pro-Mow 3 gang mower, no HP.

    Bunch of STIHL chainsaws: 011x 2, MS192T, MS200T, MS180C, MS230, MS270 (Wood Boss), 038 Farmboss, '86 anniversary edition.

  5. #25
    Silver Member LTEnterprises's Avatar
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    2003 Kioti 50C FEL with QA, 72" root grapple, woods ' box blade, kioti 72" tiller,18J mini excavator, 71 GMC dump truck, 4 200 cc dirt bikes, 500cc BMX XUV 4x4, 346 xp killer chain saw, 40x64x12 insulated epoxy coated floor garage

    Default Re: 2003 Dk50C 4A200T head bolt length

    Hey CM...got some pics showing the discs...AFTER I "milled" em down..3 and 4 were the problem areas.

    These 2 pics show the issue the clearest...I had to move around to get the light just right WO a flash.

    I'm HOPING I got em flat enough to seal...certainly wont seal any worse...oh, and yes I CLEAN CLEAN and then CLEAN some more...don't like outside stuff INSIDE
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails -kioti-dk50-engine-apart-pics   -kioti-dk50-engine-apart-pics  
    Todays Mighty Oak is just Yesterdays NUT that held it's ground

  6. #26
    Elite Member Coyote machine's Avatar
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    '10 Kioti DK 40se/hst KL-401 FEL, loaded tires, KB-2485 bhoe, Tuffline TB160 boxblade, Woods QA forks, MIE Hydraulic bhoe thumb & ripper tooth, Igland 4001 winch, & GR-20 Log Grapple. Woods BBX72" Mower. Diamondplate aluminum canopy.

    Default Re: 2003 Dk50C 4A200T head bolt length

    LTE,

    Looking good. Have you considered having your machine shop get a swirl pattern across the entire head to help grip the head gasket and keep it from any possible movement as it heats and cools? It looks like from the factory they just plane it smooth- but with all the scratch marks I'd have some concern about it sealing as well as you want it to.
    Others who have extensive experience with diesel heads might want to chime in on this issue. You could also inquire of MIE and send them your pics and this thread link- I'm sure they would give you their opinion.
    2010 DK-40se/hst, Kioti KL-401 FEL, (reversible Kioti cutting edge), 72" Ratchet Rake. Fit Rite Top-N-Tilt hydraulics & diverter valve. HLA Series 2000 7' snowplow, Aquiline MPC rear chains. Samuri Sickle bar.

    Scag Wildcat: Kawasaki 26HP, with bagger. Dr. brush mower, & 42" lawn deck, Dr. self propelled, 6.5HP Trimmer mower. Pro-Mow 3 gang mower, no HP.

    Bunch of STIHL chainsaws: 011x 2, MS192T, MS200T, MS180C, MS230, MS270 (Wood Boss), 038 Farmboss, '86 anniversary edition.

  7. #27
    Gold Member GMtb42's Avatar
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    Reno, Texas
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    SOLD L2800DT-F, purchased Kioti CK20 HST

    Default Re: 2003 Dk50C 4A200T head bolt length

    You didn't squirt a bunch of ether in there did you?

  8. #28
    Silver Member LTEnterprises's Avatar
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    2003 Kioti 50C FEL with QA, 72" root grapple, woods ' box blade, kioti 72" tiller,18J mini excavator, 71 GMC dump truck, 4 200 cc dirt bikes, 500cc BMX XUV 4x4, 346 xp killer chain saw, 40x64x12 insulated epoxy coated floor garage

    Default Re: 2003 Dk50C 4A200T head bolt length

    Hey CM, putting a "swirl" pattern will not be a problem, I can use a "cookie wheel" on my high speed angle grinder ( porting air tool with a 90* head). I have EVERY possible entrance to the engine hermetically sealed...even the oil feeds to the rockers, so cleaning that wont be an issue.

    I talked to Bob from mie yesterday, he's read this thread. I COULD have gotten my parts drop shipped to me from Kioti...IF I was smart enough to call. I had talked to him before and led him to believe that I was gonna wait till after the 1st of the year, I THOUGHT I was gonna need a head.

    THEN I figured out what the issue was, ordered through their website. He apologized to me ?? He didn't do A THING that required an apology !! The order time issue was induced by ME !....I now KNOW what to do the next time I need something from them...thanks to Bob !

    As far as either being used...no I haven't...but WHY would it matter ? The either would be long evaporated before reassembly anyway

    I use a strong carb cleaner for carbon, and brake cleaner for oil residues, AFTER hand scraping surfaces. Good old soap and water is STILL the best pre assy cleaner on the planet....drying with compressed air afterwards of course.

    One HAS TO HAVE an array of blow gun configurations anyway, so ANYTHING and everything can get cleared out and dried......least thats what I was taught to do...especially after coming out of the hot tank.

    Before I'm asked...I NEVER used a hot tank without TOTAL disassembly.. sure wish I still had access to one, and a CK10, surfacer, valve seat machine,main and rod bore hones, etc...VBG

    Cooling is not an issue, I started out by making a grille guard 1st pic...THEN removed the battery from crammed up next to the condenser to out in front of the grille cover.

    Then made a heavy bolt on steel ventilated cover for the battery now out front....nice weight too, like I need it with a loader ...LOL
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails -handmade-grille-guard-side-view   -relocated-battery-dk-50c-jpg  
    Last edited by LTEnterprises; 12-19-2012 at 07:39 AM. Reason: continuity
    Todays Mighty Oak is just Yesterdays NUT that held it's ground

  9. #29
    Silver Member LTEnterprises's Avatar
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    2003 Kioti 50C FEL with QA, 72" root grapple, woods ' box blade, kioti 72" tiller,18J mini excavator, 71 GMC dump truck, 4 200 cc dirt bikes, 500cc BMX XUV 4x4, 346 xp killer chain saw, 40x64x12 insulated epoxy coated floor garage

    Default Re: 2003 Dk50C 4A200T head bolt length

    OH ...before I forget...IF you have calcium or some other buildup in the top of your radiator,( thats where all the return action happens with a cooling system) and the lower internals have been verified clean, just dump about 500 BB's in the radiator neck, rock the radiator back and forth side to side ( you will have it out right )....the BB's will "knock the "cling ons" off, WITHOUT getting stuck inside the cooling tubes, then all you have to do is back flush with water.( AFTER you recapture the BB's )

    Or if COMPLETLY dry inside...just use a strong shop vac on the upper hose inlet, or the cap hole , with the upper, then lower, hose inlets open....just a thought.

    I MAY have an inside view of a calcified radiator somewhere in my borescope pic files. if so, I'll come back and add it....if I can after X-ing out...
    Todays Mighty Oak is just Yesterdays NUT that held it's ground

  10. #30
    Silver Member LTEnterprises's Avatar
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    2003 Kioti 50C FEL with QA, 72" root grapple, woods ' box blade, kioti 72" tiller,18J mini excavator, 71 GMC dump truck, 4 200 cc dirt bikes, 500cc BMX XUV 4x4, 346 xp killer chain saw, 40x64x12 insulated epoxy coated floor garage

    Default Re: 2003 Dk50C 4A200T head bolt length

    I found one of a car I was diagnosing... The bb's wouldn't have helped this one...plugged internally to...verified with an IR temp gun.

    This one had the calcium on the RETURN side of the radiator ( cross flow type)
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails -calcium-plugged-radiator-jpg   -calcium-close-up-jpg  
    Todays Mighty Oak is just Yesterdays NUT that held it's ground

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