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  1. #1
    New Member
    Join Date
    May 2013
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    9
    Location
    Eastern PA
    Tractor
    Kioti CK35HST

    Default CK35HST - New to Tractors

    Hi All -

    This forum has been a great help researching which tractor to buy - thanks to everyone! I'm pretty happy with my choice (CK35 with the Kioti BH and FEL).

    I'm also ordering a ripper and thumb from MIE, a 5' box blade from EA and very much looking forward anxiously to EA's new 48" grapple. With these tools the only thing I'm going to be lacking is a snow blower but I'm going hold off on thinking about that $.

    While I have many many questions as I'm new to CUT's I have three that are really bugging me:
    1) My dealer told me to only use the 540 rpm PTO option for the backhoe but someone else at the dealer told me the rear hydraulics are independent of the PTO.
    2) Transmission - once the tractor is warmed up, it's still pretty tough to swap in and out of gears. For example, to go from medium to low I stop, clutch, and it will go to neutral. To go to low I have to let off the brake, apply the brake, sometimes let it coast an inch or two. Is it just breaking in or is this a problem?
    3) Rear hydros - I run around in neutral and when I want to use the backhoe I swap over to A. Even at idle the lever seems to require way too much force (or too much jiggling) than would seem necessary. Dealer do something wrong or is this normal or do I need to relieve pressure somehow? I had additional lines run for the grapple - swapping back and forth to use the grapple seems like it would defeat the utility if it takes this much effort when the time comes.

    OK +1 question:
    What's the difference between the mechanical and hydraulic positioning thumb options here:
    http://www.michironandequip.com/p/BT...vot-Pin-Thumbs

    I've used thumbs previously (compact excavators), and while it's been a while I just remember clamping the thumb down. I will call MIE but any help with my education would be well received.


    Thanks in advance!
    Last edited by rtom; 05-28-2013 at 02:57 PM.

  2. #2
    Veteran Member kiotiken's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Posts
    2,270
    Location
    Dunrobin, Ont
    Tractor
    2012 Kioti DK45 HST Cab

    Default Re: CK35HST - New to Tractors

    Quote Originally Posted by rtom View Post
    Hi All -

    This forum has been a great help researching which tractor to buy - thanks to everyone! I'm pretty happy with my choice (CK35 with the Kioti BH and FEL).

    I'm also ordering a ripper and thumb from MIE, a 5' box blade from EA and very much looking forward anxiously to EA's new 48" grapple. With these tools the only thing I'm going to be lacking is a snow blower but I'm going hold off on thinking about that $.

    While I have many many questions as I'm new to CUT's I have three that are really bugging me:
    1) My dealer told me to only use the 540 rpm PTO option for the backhoe but someone else at the dealer told me the rear hydraulics are independent of the PTO.
    2) Transmission - once the tractor is warmed up, it's still pretty tough to swap in and out of gears. For example, to go from medium to low I stop, clutch, and it will go to neutral. To go to low I have to let off the brake, apply the brake, sometimes let it coast an inch or two. Is it just breaking in or is this a problem?
    3) Rear hydros - I run around in neutral and when I want to use the backhoe I swap over to A. Even at idle the lever seems to require way too much force (or too much jiggling) than would seem necessary. Dealer do something wrong or is this normal or do I need to relieve pressure somehow? I had additional lines run for the grapple - swapping back and forth to use the grapple seems like it would defeat the utility if it takes this much effort when the time comes.

    OK +1 question:
    What's the difference between the mechanical and hydraulic positioning thumb options here:
    BT-SHP Series Bucket Pivot Pin Thumbs

    I've used thumbs previously (compact excavators), and while it's been a while I just remember clamping the thumb down. I will call MIE but any help with my education would be well received.


    Thanks in advance!
    Welcome to TBN and congrats on the new tractor.

    1) The BH should run off the rear hydraulics of the tractor (hydraulic remotes). There are bh's that have their own PTO driven hydraulic pump, but the Kioti or Woods BH run off the tractors remotes. Also, don't try and operate the BH with the RPM's of the tractor at 2500 like you need to for the PTO (this may be what the dealer is trying to say). That will give you too much oil flow and the BH will be very difficult to control, especially when you're trying to get the hang of it. Anywhere between 1800-2200 seems to work well.

    2) The shifter is a little stiff when the tractor is new. It will work in a little and you should see a big difference by 50 hrs. It may always be a little tricky to get into gear, simply push the hst pedal a little forward or backwards and it should pop right in.

    3) It sounds like you're disconnecting the lines when you're not using the BH. That's not necessary, but if you do, changes in temp will increase the pressure in the lines and they will be next to impossible to re-attach without relieving that pressure. To relieve the pressure, cover the male hose end with a rag and hit the end with a hammer or against one of the rear tires. Be careful, even with a rag, oil is going to spray, so watch your eyes. Your remote lever has an A a N and a B setting. You can either leave in in the A position with the BH attached (oil will circulate through the BH) or you can move that lever to N. You need to be very careful if you disconnect the line. If you forget and leave the remote in the A or B position without the BH attached, you will be "dead heading" the hydraulics (forcing that circuit to relief). That can over heat the oil and burn out the pump. Some people have a small hose made to make a loop between the two remote ports on the back when not in use, that way it's impossible to dead head the hydraulics.

    3) I had a manual thumb and it worked very well. I would have loved a hydraulic thumb and it may have been a lot easier to use, but once you get used to the manual version, it works well. Mine had about 9 positions so you moved the thumb by jumping off and moving a pin. The it was the bucket closing against the fixed thumb that did the work and let you pick stuff up.

    I hope some of that's clear and helps. Congrats again, you bought an awesome tractor.

  3. #3
    Elite Member Coyote machine's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Posts
    4,707
    Location
    Southern VT
    Tractor
    '10 Kioti DK 40se/hst KL-401 FEL, loaded tires, KB-2485 bhoe, Tuffline TB160 boxblade, Woods QA forks, MIE Hydraulic bhoe thumb & ripper tooth, Igland 4001 winch, & GR-20 Log Grapple. Woods BBX72" Mower. Diamondplate aluminum canopy.

    Default Re: CK35HST - New to Tractors

    I've owned both a mechanical and hydro thumb from MIE for the Kioti KB-2485 backhoe. And I have the first ripper/CLAW (with teeth on the leading edge) from them, for the same hoe. I was OK with the mech thumb but wanted to stay on the tractor/hoe instead of constant manual adjustments.
    I strongly suggest you bring the thumb to the bucket and not the bucket to the thumb. They may have changed the operation of the hyd thumb since I bought mine; but if not, one can bend the thumb piston into a pretzel without too much effort.
    What KK said on the rest of the questions.

    One exception- see my avatar- it shows my Igland brand log grapple- GR-20. It is AWESOME! I don't buy into the bucket type grapple, especially on the smaller cuts; IMHO they're not really good at being a bucket or a grapple. A grapple should only be a grapple and a bucket- ditto.
    2010 DK-40se/hst, Kioti KL-401 FEL, (reversible Kioti cutting edge), 72" Ratchet Rake. Fit Rite Top-N-Tilt hydraulics & diverter valve. HLA Series 2000 7' snowplow, Aquiline MPC rear chains. Samuri Sickle bar.

    Scag Wildcat: Kawasaki 26HP, with bagger. Dr. brush mower, & 42" lawn deck, Dr. self propelled, 6.5HP Trimmer mower. Pro-Mow 3 gang mower, no HP.

    Bunch of STIHL chainsaws: 011x 2, MS192T, MS200T, MS180C, MS230, MS270 (Wood Boss), 038 Farmboss, '86 anniversary edition.

  4. #4
    Elite Member Mousefield's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Posts
    2,518
    Location
    Qualicum Beach on Vancouver Island, BC. Canada
    Tractor
    2008 CK35 HST

    Default Re: CK35HST - New to Tractors

    Welcome to TBN and congratulations on your new tractor.
    Have many happy and safe hours in the seat.
    Can't add much more than what Kiotiken did, he answered your questions very well.
    I have a 2008 CK35 with the Woods 7ft backhoe with mechanical thumb, 477 hours.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails -logging-007-jpg  

  5. #5
    New Member
    Join Date
    May 2013
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    9
    Location
    Eastern PA
    Tractor
    Kioti CK35HST

    Default Re: CK35HST - New to Tractors

    Quote Originally Posted by kiotiken View Post
    Welcome to TBN and congrats on the new tractor.


    3) It sounds like you're disconnecting the lines when you're not using the BH. That's not necessary, but if you do, changes in temp will increase the pressure in the lines and they will be next to impossible to re-attach without relieving that pressure. To relieve the pressure, cover the male hose end with a rag and hit the end with a hammer or against one of the rear tires. Be careful, even with a rag, oil is going to spray, so watch your eyes. Your remote lever has an A a N and a B setting. You can either leave in in the A position with the BH attached (oil will circulate through the BH) or you can move that lever to N. You need to be very careful if you disconnect the line. If you forget and leave the remote in the A or B position without the BH attached, you will be "dead heading" the hydraulics (forcing that circuit to relief). That can over heat the oil and burn out the pump. Some people have a small hose made to make a loop between the two remote ports on the back when not in use, that way it's impossible to dead head the hydraulics.
    Thanks for the quick response! I've read quite a few of your posts over the past few weeks .

    Regarding your response - I'm not disconnecting the lines, rather moving the remote lever from A to N (or at least, trying to). I figured I'd post up again before I attempt to disconnect the lines & drop the backhoe. Baby steps...

    You said I could leave it in A or move it to N - that was something one of the mechanics pointed out at the dealership. They said that leaving it in A constantly could "burn out the small pump" that drives the bh. Sounds like you've done this and had no adverse effects?

  6. #6
    Super Star Member murphy1244's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
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    17,254
    Location
    Ohio
    Tractor
    Kioti DK-40, MF-135, Ventrac 4500Y

    Default Re: CK35HST - New to Tractors

    Quote Originally Posted by rtom View Post
    Thanks for the quick response! I've read quite a few of your posts over the past few weeks .

    Regarding your response - I'm not disconnecting the lines, rather moving the remote lever from A to N (or at least, trying to). I figured I'd post up again before I attempt to disconnect the lines & drop the backhoe. Baby steps...

    You said I could leave it in A or move it to N - that was something one of the mechanics pointed out at the dealership. They said that leaving it in A constantly could "burn out the small pump" that drives the bh. Sounds like you've done this and had no adverse effects?
    Leave it in N when not in use or you deadhead the pump
    Murph ------------

  7. #7
    New Member
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Posts
    9
    Location
    Eastern PA
    Tractor
    Kioti CK35HST

    Default Re: CK35HST - New to Tractors

    Quote Originally Posted by Coyote machine View Post
    I've owned both a mechanical and hydro thumb from MIE for the Kioti KB-2485 backhoe. And I have the first ripper/CLAW (with teeth on the leading edge) from them, for the same hoe. I was OK with the mech thumb but wanted to stay on the tractor/hoe instead of constant manual adjustments.
    I strongly suggest you bring the thumb to the bucket and not the bucket to the thumb. They may have changed the operation of the hyd thumb since I bought mine; but if not, one can bend the thumb piston into a pretzel without too much effort.
    What KK said on the rest of the questions.

    One exception- see my avatar- it shows my Igland brand log grapple- GR-20. It is AWESOME! I don't buy into the bucket type grapple, especially on the smaller cuts; IMHO they're not really good at being a bucket or a grapple. A grapple should only be a grapple and a bucket- ditto.
    Took me a bit to get what you were saying there - if you bring the bucket up to the thumb and what, it's clamped, you can mangle the piston & such? It's funny that you said that because it never occurred to me that you could do that but of course now it's all I can think of - and how expensive that mistake could be. That said, I've always brought the bucket where I needed it, clamped the thumb to move the load, then released it. It seems like any movement on the bucket then could hurt the thumb piston (what if, what if). How would changing the design affect that? May be a novice question, but I'm lost.

    Thanks - and wow - somehow I missed the GR-20 that thing looks about perfect. Looking at what I plan to use it for the Wicked grapple seemed to be the best compromise, especially with a single grapple 48" version for my tractor that should be along in a couple of months. That said, I'm swayed - I'm going to start looking into that GR-20. If I can pick one up now I can get to work that much sooner.

    How does it handle brush?
    Last edited by rtom; 05-28-2013 at 06:27 PM. Reason: missed a question

  8. #8
    New Member
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Posts
    9
    Location
    Eastern PA
    Tractor
    Kioti CK35HST

    Default Re: CK35HST - New to Tractors

    Quote Originally Posted by murphy1244 View Post
    Leave it in N when not in use or you deadhead the pump
    That's been my issue - going from A to N - I can feel the lever bending. If I jiggle it a bit it will eventually release. What am I doing wrong? I know not to force anything, but this seems a bit much.

    "flexing" would be a better way to put it.
    Last edited by rtom; 05-28-2013 at 07:19 PM.

  9. #9
    Super Star Member murphy1244's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
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    17,254
    Location
    Ohio
    Tractor
    Kioti DK-40, MF-135, Ventrac 4500Y

    Default Re: CK35HST - New to Tractors

    Quote Originally Posted by rtom View Post
    That's been my issue - going from A to N - I can feel the lever bending. If I jiggle it a bit it will eventually release. What am I doing wrong? I know not to force anything, but this seems a bit much.

    "flexing" would be a better way to put it.
    Its new give it time. Tractor off shift it back and forth.
    Murph ------------

  10. #10
    Gold Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
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    341
    Location
    Disputanta, VA
    Tractor
    2007 Kioti CK20 & 1981 Iseki TU1700

    Default Re: CK35HST - New to Tractors

    I've sprayed a little lube of choice on my levers. Look underneath your tractor and you will see where they move. A couple shots a month will help with the break in. If you are having to apply enough leverage to bend the lever then something is not lined up. That control should move very freely.

    Eddie
    08 Dodge (Cummins) 2500, 2007 Kioti CK20, FEL, Finish Mower, 4' Howse Bush Hog, Landscape Rake, 52" Woods Tiller, 5' Rear Blade, 4' Box Blade, 5 horses, 2 dogs, 1 fat cat, 1981 Iseki TU 1700 for grass mowing.

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