CK20s loses power 20 minutes into heavy lifting

[Coyote machine]

Drop the bogus NAPA filter, replace with correct OEM. Try that. Further problems, then check lift pump/and or tank/vent.

 

[powerscol]

I'm betting on a plugged vent. Take your fuel cap off. First look on top in the center for a small hole - is it clear? Turn the cap over and check the center. There should be a series of small holes in the center. Supply suction - air should flow through freely. Hope this helps. If it is plugged, use a good carb cleaner from the top into the cap, It also helps to have a beverage of choice to get the diesel off you lips at the end of this exercise. :thumbsup:

 

[Amvcane]

Thumbs up for dropping the fuel and installing the OEM filter.
With regards to the fuel filter, when I was tractor shopping I think I remember reading about CK20 fuel filter bulbs ( I think the somewhat clear ones, not translucent ) getting brittle and cracking. Maybe the newer upgraded bulb is a little different in size and there are still some of the older type filters around. I used the OEM filter in my CK35 without issue. Have read about this problem with after markets not fitting before and I'm just curious as to why. Also my memory is not that great either.

 

[Coyote machine]

Yes, the filter bowls had cracking issues and were updated to a better type. That was a long time ago, and hasn't been an issue since the retrofit, IIRC.

Best to use OEM, (because of fitment) - not much savings if one's constantly chasing one's tail trying to figure out problems caused by bad aftermarket fitment issues. :confused3:

 

[DroppedAxle]

Pretty good bet. My fuel cap had an indentation on the top center of the grip on the outside of the cap, but the 2mm or so hole seemed to have been filled with injection molded plastic from when the cap was made. I punched through that carefully and now have flow when I blow air through the top of the cap and when suction is applied to the holes on the inside. However, this seems to be a one way airlock that only allows flow in that direction; which makes sense.

One thing that doesn't figure though is that this was only an issue in the cold weather. I suspect the cap has always been bad. In fact, I should probably just replace it.

Draining tank and replacing filter with OEM Kioti part as well today. It's 60F here so no cold weather testing until next weekend perhaps.

Thanks!

 

[ritcheyvs]

When you drain the fuel, try to observe if there is any restriction at the tank, especially after some of the fuel has drained. There have been cases of junk in the tank that migrates to the outlet as fuel leaves the tank and eventually clogs the outlet. Such a restriction might be OK in warm weather but really clog as fuel begins to jell.

Also, you might want to put a sample of the old fuel in a clear jar and set it outside in the shade. Then you could observe if that fuel begins to "cloud" at various ambient temps. That might indicate if the fuel is part of the problem (which may have other factors too).

 

[DroppedAxle]

Drained the tank and replaced the filter with OEM.

A couple more clues:
I had punched through the vent hole in the cap and was getting air flow but probably not enough. Cap was replaced on tank tight. I removed the hose from the fuel filter housing to drain the fuel from the tank. At first it came out full flow but quickly tapered off to moderate/slow flow. I removed the cap from the tank and that emptied the tank completely at full flow. So it seems the vent in the cap was and is still a problem. I'll just order a new one. Not sure if punching it out at the top was the right thing to do. Is there a little filter in there or should it be a small (2-3mm) clear open hole?

OEM fuel filter, though smaller in diameter than the NAPA part and certainly quite a bit shorter, still did not fit as easily as I expected. It was very snug and I again had to use a 3/8" hex key down the center and a tap with a hammer to pop it into the bowl. Then, when I screwed it into the housing it again collapsed a bit due to being compressed vertically. It does sit on the little rests at the bottom of the fuel bowl. Maybe I should try to replace the fuel bowl too. I would have expected the filter to fit with just a tiny bit of play side to side...

I filtered the old fuel through a water filter and the stuff left in the sump was a bit cloudy. I still have that fuel and will pour it into a jar as you suggest and visually inspect. I'm not planning to use that fuel. Refilled tank with fresh diesel treated with power service. (BTW, learned from MIE not to use 911 with these tractors since it damages fuel injectors...)

Tractor ran fine for about an hour, although I didn't do much lifting and it's spring here on the east coast, 60F :laughing:.

Thanks.
DA

 

[Bavarian]

Good troubleshooting with a lots of headache. Be careful with 911. It's not ment to be for prevention.
I'm a truck driver and had gelled fuel a few years ago. I put endless 911 in the tanks to get it going again. Talked to a foreman from Caterpillar about it and he warned me. Too much 911 damages the paper of the fuelfilter and 'dryes' out the fuel, meaning it's loosing it's lubricity. That's causing damage to the injector like mentioned already.
I always try to run my trator as empty as possible comes fall. In November then just fill it up with fuel from the truck. The tractor is outside most of the time and never had any issues with fuel gelling. I'm not using any additives at all and the tractor starts at -10F after an hour on the blockheater.
If you have to treat your fuel use the cetane boost from power system. It's the same bottle as 911 in white. Read the label and it says Antigel.

 

[mj007]

Good troubleshooting with a lots of headache. Be careful with 911. It's not ment to be for prevention.
I'm a truck driver and had gelled fuel a few years ago. I put endless 911 in the tanks to get it going again. Talked to a foreman from Caterpillar about it and he warned me. Too much 911 damages the paper of the fuelfilter and 'dryes' out the fuel, meaning it's loosing it's lubricity. That's causing damage to the injector like mentioned already.
I always try to run my trator as empty as possible comes fall. In November then just fill it up with fuel from the truck. The tractor is outside most of the time and never had any issues with fuel gelling. I'm not using any additives at all and the tractor starts at -10F after an hour on the blockheater.
If you have to treat your fuel use the cetane boost from power system. It's the same bottle as 911 in white. Read the label and it says Antigel.

Schaeffer's DieselTreat 2000 (Winter) worked for me at -32F.

 

[powerscol]

Drained the tank and replaced the filter with OEM.

A couple more clues:
I had punched through the vent hole in the cap and was getting air flow but probably not enough. Cap was replaced on tank tight. I removed the hose from the fuel filter housing to drain the fuel from the tank. At first it came out full flow but quickly tapered off to moderate/slow flow. I removed the cap from the tank and that emptied the tank completely at full flow. So it seems the vent in the cap was and is still a problem. I'll just order a new one. Not sure if punching it out at the top was the right thing to do. Is there a little filter in there or should it be a small (2-3mm) clear open hole?

OEM fuel filter, though smaller in diameter than the NAPA part and certainly quite a bit shorter, still did not fit as easily as I expected. It was very snug and I again had to use a 3/8" hex key down the center and a tap with a hammer to pop it into the bowl. Then, when I screwed it into the housing it again collapsed a bit due to being compressed vertically. It does sit on the little rests at the bottom of the fuel bowl. Maybe I should try to replace the fuel bowl too. I would have expected the filter to fit with just a tiny bit of play side to side...

I filtered the old fuel through a water filter and the stuff left in the sump was a bit cloudy. I still have that fuel and will pour it into a jar as you suggest and visually inspect. I'm not planning to use that fuel. Refilled tank with fresh diesel treated with power service. (BTW, learned from MIE not to use 911 with these tractors since it damages fuel injectors...)

Tractor ran fine for about an hour, although I didn't do much lifting and it's spring here on the east coast, 60F :laughing:.

Thanks.
DA

The cap has a spring in it that keeps a diaphragm normally closed, and under a slight vacuum should open. To test you can blow from the top thru the hole. or pull a vacuum from under. If you do that have a cold one hamdy to rinse the taste out of your mouth :laughing::drink: