Water In Transmission, How Did It Get There?

[Rameck]

Bought a B7100 several years ago but have used it only a couple of times, as I have a B6000 that I use more. I never checked the fluids since I haven't used it much. Decide to use it for a bigger job today. Started it up and put it in reverse and heard a lot of grinding noise in the front. Stopped and put it in forward and the same noise when releasing the clutch and moving. Put it back in reverse but it wouldn't move and still the noise. I noticed it would only make this loud grinding noise when I let out the clutch while in gear but no noise if in neutral and clutch released. I decided to check the transmission fluid and when I opened up the filler cap, out came a brown fluid. My experience, told me that this looked like water contamination. I opened up the drain plug to drain the transmission fluid and a lot of water came out followed by the brown fluid. By now, I figured that trans is probably shot or the clutch. I removed the Hydraulic screen and it was covered with fine metal pieces. Only had a gallon of gear oil and it needs three, so will fill it tomorrow and see what happens but it may be to late by now. But I can't figure out how all that water got in the trans. The boot cover over the gear shifter has a big rip in it. Can the water get in the trans from there or is there somewhere else it could have entered?

[DieselPower]

Has it lived outside or is it stored inside. If it's outside it could be from rain. That much water doesn't sound like it happened from condensation.

[Treemonkey1000]

You wouldn't think the boot over the shifter would allow that much water in. Would a crack in the water jacket allow water to seep in? That wouldn't make sense as the motor and tranny are seperated. Was there a stain underneath the tractor that you could tell? As the water seeped into the tranny and displaced the fluid it would float on top and leak out somewhere.
Jim

[Iron Horse]

Rain water runs down the gearshift lever and into the box . Ive seen it a few times with perished/torn boots . The first thing to go in the box is usually the bearing cages which if rusted bad enough fail and let the balls/rollers settle at the bottom of the races which can cause a catastrophic gearbox failure . If it's making those kind of noises i think your too late , sorry . If you pull it down now you may be able to save all the components and only have too rerace it . Put all the bits that are rusted into a drum with a mixture of about 50/50 Molasses and water . A few weeks later the parts will come out looking like new and ready to serve again .

[Rameck]

Yes, it's been outside and though we don't get much rain here in So. Ca., it's enough. The trans was actually overfilled from the water being added. When I took the filler cap off if was under pressure and coming out of the filler opening for several minutes. I got off the tractor and while in neutral pushed the clutch in and could hear exactly where the noise was located. It was up front where the trans connects to the engine and not underneath the shifter knob. I don't have a service manual so not sure what section that would be. I don't have the expertise to tear it apart, though, I might tackle it, if I had a service manual that was good, in explaining exactly how to do it. Was the service manual for this tractor very good in that regards? Is this a very extensive or difficult repair job? Why would I hear this grinding when the clutch is engaged (derpressed) and not after I let it out in gear, when the trans would be engaged? I only hear it when the clutch is engaged (depressed), though it's not engaging the gears when released in gear. Could it just be the clutch? Oh, and I did notice leakage around the filler and thought it was just overfilled and cap was not tighten enough to keep it form leaking. Hind sight now tells me, I should have check it further then.

thanks,
Ralph

[Tig]

Sorry to hear about your bad luck. The I&T manual is pretty good. It's $20 or $30. It's worth having even if you decide to not tackle this repair. You can find it at online bookstores. I guess the trickiest part of the repair will be splitting the tractor. I had to split mine for a different repair and it was quite interesting because after you separate the two halves you have to roll one away to work on the other. Safety is important.
If you PM me your email address I can send you a parts guide. That will give you a look at the assembly you suspect has failed.

[milkman]

Why would I hear this grinding when the clutch is engaged (derpressed) and not after I let it out in gear, when the trans would be engaged? I only hear it when the clutch is engaged (depressed), though it's not engaging the gears when released in gear.


This sounds like your clutch throw out bearing is the culprit making the noise and not the transmission, as this bearing is only contacting the clutch fingers and spinning when you have the clutch pedal depressed. If that's the case, you still have to split the tractor to replace bearing. If this was my tractor, I'd get the fluid cleaned out and refilled and try running the tractor to see if there's any problem in the transmission, if not then I'd split it and fix the clutch . Oh yes, and replace the gear shifter boot.

[Tig]

What Milkman suggests seems reasonable if the noise is only when you push in the clutch. If so then the tranny may be ok. Although it seems odd that it will go forward but not reverse.
There should be a drain plug in the bottom of the clutch bell housing. Remove the plug and see what comes out. (oil, water, metal?) It should be dry in there.

[Rameck]

Originally Posted by Tig

What Milkman suggests seems reasonable if the noise is only when you push in the clutch. If so then the tranny may be ok. Although it seems odd that it will go forward but not reverse.
There should be a drain plug in the bottom of the clutch bell housing. Remove the plug and see what comes out. (oil, water, metal?) It should be dry in there.

Forgot to mention, it won't go forward or reverse. I didn't notice the drain plug under the clutch housing until I drained the one under the trans. After draining the trans, I unscrewed the clutch plug but not even a drop came out. Is the clutch fluid suppose to share the trans fluid? I only had a gallon of gear oil for the trans and put that in the trans until I can get some more. But nothing came out of the clutch drain plug even with a gallon added. Again, if they share the same fluid, wouldn't I get some drainage from the gallon added to the trans filler?
You mention that "it should be dry in there", is there suppose to be no liquid at all, when trans fluid is full? I'll will PM you on your offer and give you my email address.
thanks,
Ralph

[Tig]

Clutch should be dry, as you found it. No fluids. I was curious about any water being in there. From the symptoms you describe it's very likely that the clutch is your problem. IMO that would be good news, if that's all that is wrong. Can you roll the tractor in neutral? What about if you put it in gear? Just curious.